Pandachan 31 February 22, 2012 Share February 22, 2012 someone needs to make one of these youtube rants about this!! but a good one!! i have seen so pretty bad ones going up laetly! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dark0star0 2 February 22, 2012 Share February 22, 2012 When i tell people i like mlp they usually just laugh and say ''Are you serious?'' and then they just laugh some more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Envoy-in-exile 101 February 22, 2012 Share February 22, 2012 I have to thank you for writing this post. In just a handful of well-written paragraphs, you build a fantastic explanation for why being a brony is so strangely controversial. (I hope you don't mind if I keep a copy of it around to quote to people - with proper citation - on occasion.) Actually, when I was reading your post I started to think, so I greatly apologize for the following rant. The next few paragraphs are probably going to be fairly dry and boring. I probably shouldn't even post this here, but I have been trying to wrap my head around the "brony controversy" for so long. Well, I tend to over-think things, so it was really starting to drive me up a wall. I agree with you that gender stereotypes are a contributing factor to why so many people have such strong reactions against being a brony. However, I also think that there also be something slightly more primitive at work. My reason for thinking this is that I have seen reactions against bronies that come from quite a few angles. When I introduced my sister to the show, she liked it, but when she attempted to introduce her female friends to the show, some of them had a surprisingly visceral negative reaction. To them, it was insulting to suggest watching a show for "little girls". I have heard of other female bronies having a similarly cold reception. And so now we have some type of agism being a reason for disliking the show.... And then there was this: Yes, that is something that I have often wondered about. Why was it the case that ponies became so controversial in a place where social deviance and general anarchy are, seemingly, everyday things? It just doesn't seem to make any sense, and the more I thought about it the less sense it made. But then I thought about something. What if it wasn't necessarily about sexism or doing something out of the ordinary? In other words, what if it was about these things but at the same time was about something broader? Something that is fundamental to human nature that encompasses all of the myriad of reasons why bronies are attacked. What if it was about tribes? What if it was about "the other"? In philosophy, the "other" is a concept that refers to anything that is in opposition to the "same", and the "same" is a concept that refers to the traits that people use to identify themselves. These traits are not physical traits, but descriptive traits that a person derives from their gender, heritage, or culture. If we think of people as being members of different tribes, then the "other" is anything that is completely foreign to your tribal identity. Just as an example, if someone identifies themselves as being from the "Green" tribe then anything from the "Purple" tribe is automatically bad. To a member of the "Green" tribe, the "Purple" tribe is the other. I think that when we self-identify as bronies, we become "the other". This means that people that have very strong "tribal identities" will make the assumption that we are opposed to their core values, and they will see us as something that should be attacked. This is when they reach for anything and everything that they have to demonize us. The reason that we become "the other" is simply that they have no knowledge of what we actually are. The word "brony" didn't even exist before Friendship is Magic. To people who hear it or see it for the first time, it is a completely foreign term. This is where the tribal identities kick in. If someone very strongly identifies with a group that has a well-defined way of thinking, then it is not worth the risk to their self-identity to even consider that bronies could be people *like them*. I don't think that this theory explains everything, but I do think that some of this does play a role in the reflex reactions against bronies that I have seen from so many different sources. If we were known as "fans of MLP that are outside of the target demographic", then I do not think that there would be so much negativity out there. But, I also think that it is an unavoidable tradeoff. If we didn't call ourselves bronies, then we would have had to call ourselves something else, and we would have had the same problem. We are a real group and there is a cohesive, identifiable thread that pulls us all together. I think that this may scare some people, but I think that this also allows an amazing amount of creativity and other positive things to flourish. Oh man.... This is way longer than I originally intended...... Well, if anyone actually reads this far, I hope my rant made some kind of sense. Tribalism is, in fact, the perfect explanation for the root cause and all the questions I had (and also the larger phenomena of why people tend to shun something different). Not being a stranger to discrimination because I am "different" (nothing related to ponies), I can relate very well to what you typed. 1. In the case of why bronyism is shunned in "mainstream" places, this answers it. 2. In the case of why bronyism is shunned in 4chan, this actually calls to question my long held assumption that deviants and outsiders are one group/tribe as opposed to mainstream society which organizes itself into different tribes. Deviants are not excluded from tribal instincts, it seems, despite being termed "deviants" all that happened is that they have formed yet another tribe with their own interests and identities. 3. This also can be expanded to an answer of why my forums and 4chan had such different reactions to bronies, despite the cultural similarities shared. 4chan is a much larger community than my forums and can easily shed one sub-group without threatening it's own existence. My forums on the other hand, has much smaller numbers and several of the core members are into ponies. Kicking the bronies out would actually threaten the survival of that "tribe", especially since this is a "low" time for that community t may even explain why I so rarely receive hatred compared to others...I don't use the term brony in general. I use pony fan...that difference might be just enough. If that makes any sense. 4. This also answers the question why I don't get flack as well. I don't identify myself as brony. And when I tell people about it that don't like ponies, I use phrases that they can relate more to. I say "I've gone pony" or "I'm on rainbow coloured cocaine (that is MLP)" It basically points out that while our technological advances have gone at a spectacular speed, our societal structures and basic instincts have progressed at a much slower rate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5guysburgersnfries 216 February 22, 2012 Share February 22, 2012 Heh, I drew Trixie at my art class once, I got an A+ for it :3 One guy drew a sun. Yeah, a sun. I kept thinking Celetia when you said 'sun' XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FIMChangedmylife72 58 February 22, 2012 Author Share February 22, 2012 As speculated upon by the administrator of that alternate history forum, it probably has a lot to do with how Friendship is Magic challenges traditional gender stereotypes. Let's face it: society is incredibly sexist. Gender stereotypes are buried everywhere, from various cultural assumptions about career choices, about the nature of entertainment, to our very language where references to male and female anatomy are even used to describe courage and cowardice respectively, among other things. Friendship is Magic challenges these assumptions because it subverts the very nature of girl's entertainment. instead of being full of frou-frou nonsensical garbage the likes of which few females of any age would actually enjoy, it is ridden with complex three dimensional characters, high quality writing, excellent animation, superb story-making and song writing, and an overall wonderful cast and crew. It spits in the face of those who say that girl's entertainment cannot ever be good while simultaneously enrapturing a massive audience on the level of Star Trek or Star Wars fans. It created a community where a fansite can get over one hundred million views in less than a year, where huge amounts of art, music, fanfiction, and other fan works are created every day. At the same time Friendship is Magic has also garnered extreme amounts of hatred from all kinds of different, unusual sources. People who normally espouse beliefs akin to the phrase "love and tolerance" turn into frothing madpeople over the subject, raging away their utter loathing for the show despite the fact that in doing so they betray the very principles they claim to stand for. Of course it has also gained plenty of dislike from the camps you'd expect to see it from, such as chauvanistic blowhards or religious fundamentalists. You add to that the nature of the fandom, the fact that it has grown so massive and is so vocal, even swaying the creators of the show to not only turn a two second animation error into a cameo Where's Waldo character but to then grant that character a voice as well as the name bestowed upon the character by that fandom, and it's only natural you would have significant opposition. The more controversial aspects of the fandom, such as the Rule 34 community, from respected artists such as John Joseco, Slugbox, and Megasweet, to all the clop fic writers, as well as the grimdark content of fics like Cupcakes, Rainbow Factory, and Sweet Apple Massacre, give fuel to those who hate it, allowing them to tar the entire fandom with a brush that paints us all as the very worst aspects. To hear some of them you'd think we were all masturbating twenty-four/seven to Molestia atop a pile of pony corpses. I've heard a lot of confusing things from those who hate the show, though almost none of it has been directed at me specfically. Whether it's the more typical accusations of homosexuality--an insult that makes no sense because it is ridden with stereotypes of its own accord, including the stupid notion that being a homosexual is somehow bad--to all kinds of explanations about how pony fans are all either mentally unstable or outright paedophilic. There have also been plenty who've just expressed a complete inability to understand why a male might desire to watch the show in the first place, because they're trapped in their own web of gender stereotypes and cultural idiocy. And, as I said, I've heard hatred even from those who espouse tolerance, who claim to buck gender stereotypes and treat the genders equally, and while the words are often different, the meaning almost invariably comes down to them being unable to live up to what they claim to believe. In short, the subject is so controversial because it stands as an example of why so many of our cultural stereotypes are outright wrong, and plenty of people don't like that fact. As speculated upon by the administrator of that alternate history forum, it probably has a lot to do with how Friendship is Magic challenges traditional gender stereotypes. Let's face it: society is incredibly sexist. Gender stereotypes are buried everywhere, from various cultural assumptions about career choices, about the nature of entertainment, to our very language where references to male and female anatomy are even used to describe courage and cowardice respectively, among other things. Friendship is Magic challenges these assumptions because it subverts the very nature of girl's entertainment. instead of being full of frou-frou nonsensical garbage the likes of which few females of any age would actually enjoy, it is ridden with complex three dimensional characters, high quality writing, excellent animation, superb story-making and song writing, and an overall wonderful cast and crew. It spits in the face of those who say that girl's entertainment cannot ever be good while simultaneously enrapturing a massive audience on the level of Star Trek or Star Wars fans. It created a community where a fansite can get over one hundred million views in less than a year, where huge amounts of art, music, fanfiction, and other fan works are created every day. At the same time Friendship is Magic has also garnered extreme amounts of hatred from all kinds of different, unusual sources. People who normally espouse beliefs akin to the phrase "love and tolerance" turn into frothing madpeople over the subject, raging away their utter loathing for the show despite the fact that in doing so they betray the very principles they claim to stand for. Of course it has also gained plenty of dislike from the camps you'd expect to see it from, such as chauvanistic blowhards or religious fundamentalists. You add to that the nature of the fandom, the fact that it has grown so massive and is so vocal, even swaying the creators of the show to not only turn a two second animation error into a cameo Where's Waldo character but to then grant that character a voice as well as the name bestowed upon the character by that fandom, and it's only natural you would have significant opposition. The more controversial aspects of the fandom, such as the Rule 34 community, from respected artists such as John Joseco, Slugbox, and Megasweet, to all the clop fic writers, as well as the grimdark content of fics like Cupcakes, Rainbow Factory, and Sweet Apple Massacre, give fuel to those who hate it, allowing them to tar the entire fandom with a brush that paints us all as the very worst aspects. To hear some of them you'd think we were all masturbating twenty-four/seven to Molestia atop a pile of pony corpses. I've heard a lot of confusing things from those who hate the show, though almost none of it has been directed at me specfically. Whether it's the more typical accusations of homosexuality--an insult that makes no sense because it is ridden with stereotypes of its own accord, including the stupid notion that being a homosexual is somehow bad--to all kinds of explanations about how pony fans are all either mentally unstable or outright paedophilic. There have also been plenty who've just expressed a complete inability to understand why a male might desire to watch the show in the first place, because they're trapped in their own web of gender stereotypes and cultural idiocy. And, as I said, I've heard hatred even from those who espouse tolerance, who claim to buck gender stereotypes and treat the genders equally, and while the words are often different, the meaning almost invariably comes down to them being unable to live up to what they claim to believe. In short, the subject is so controversial because it stands as an example of why so many of our cultural stereotypes are outright wrong, and plenty of people don't like that fact. Amazing words my good friend. One of the main parts of fandom will be inevitability. There will always be haters and lovers of a show. No matter how much you don't want it to happen, it will happen. I have heard about the Pony Wars. To me it is just people who completely despise the show showing their stereotypical insults to the fandom while the fans try to stop it. It happens in every fandom no matter what. Anybody will make all the smut and gore they want out of any story. It will always happen and there is no way to stop it, absolutely no way. A thing that drives me nuts and is very idiotic is when people try to fight inevitability. They think they can form a huge group against another and fight it off. It doesn't work that way. Even a majority form of hatred comes from somebody's opinion. While the rest will diss it. The bigger the fandom the bigger the fights. With My Little Pony, it gets worse. The reason is everbody will say it is for girls. And that is the trolls main saying of the fandom. You are totally correct about the show. It has very rich writing with beautiful visuals and perfect compositions of music. To me it is one of my favorite cartoons ever made and I think the show has so very much talent then most cartoons made today. Lauren Faust made the show for kids and their parents. Including male parents. The people who troll about the show just probably have little knowledge or never seen it and just the pictures and judged it by the title and cover. You know what, there will be all sorts of people different then us with different actions and opinions and we work with the people everyday. There will always be people who think they can say what they want about something. Trolls can do that since they are on the internet and can remain anonymous. Judging someones sexuality on their love for a fandom is so stupid and childish, I don't have to say anything because we all know about how ridiculous it is. If I was interested in this show back in late 2010 and knew about the popularity of the fandom, I could already estimate that there will be a Pony Wars. It just happens no matter what. I don't really like the disgusting fanart and stories the fans of MLP FIM write but like I said before, it is inevitable. I am just thankful I was born with very understandable and respectful knowledge and didn't end up like one of those cowards who judge all sorts of things by the looks. I love you all everypony, no matter what and I hope you understand that. https://blog.so-net.ne.jp/_images/blog/_fc4/mayr/P6300005-d207a.JPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 236 February 22, 2012 Share February 22, 2012 I kept thinking Celetia when you said 'sun' XD If it were Celestia, he would've got a higher grade for it. You see, my art teacher is a brony. His name is Zoran Zivkovic, and he's quite famous too, you might have heard of him :3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Key Gear 6,663 February 22, 2012 Share February 22, 2012 So I shall sum up my general reaction as: I think you're definitely onto something here, that there's a significant aspect of this part of psychology involved as well. It may even explain why I so rarely receive hatred compared to others...I don't use the term brony in general. I use pony fan...that difference might be just enough. If that makes any sense. I think that you are onto something there. In general, I have also had a much better experience speaking to people about the show when I don't use the term brony. Of course, later on, some of them find out about the community and draw their own conclusions, but, as you say, I am not a direct recipient of their reaction. It basically points out that while our technological advances have gone at a spectacular speed, our societal structures and basic instincts have progressed at a much slower rate. Well.... Societal structures and basic instincts have progressed at a slower rate, but slow progress is still progress. So long as things keep moving forward, then I think that eventually, maybe, we may just yet reach some type of utopian society... (When everyone has become a brony!!!!) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxey 13 February 22, 2012 Share February 22, 2012 It seems round where I live, people are pretty accepting. They may not understand it, but they wont treat me any different, aside from the odd banter joke. Then again it may because this isnt the first thing ive done which is questionable from a hetrosexual standpoint *cough*Charity drag show*cough*. Im a guitarist who is writing pony songs amongst other things http://ciaranmaxey.minus.com/ <----I will post all produced pony music here http://www.youtube.com/user/CiaranMaxey/videos <---All produced music+live covers and demos http://soundcloud.com/ciaranmaxey <---All music including the crappy stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/mlp/ 106 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 When i told my friends about me being a brony and what it was they stopped talking to me, but it was short lived cause they then started to watch it and 2 of 5 became bronys 1 Want me to fly around the world **doesn't move** Wanta see me do it again ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Champagne 5 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 I wear the fact that I am a brony proudly on my sleeve. I don't care what people think, I love being a brony and I love the fandom. I feel like I have been changed in a great way becoming a brony. I think many bronies, like myself, have disvovered personal creativity through the show especially in art forms such as music, painting, sculpting, and sewing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5guysburgersnfries 216 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 If it were Celestia, he would've got a higher grade for it. You see, my art teacher is a brony. His name is Zoran Zivkovic, and he's quite famous too, you might have heard of him :3 Sorry, no ^^' is he good? what kind of art is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 236 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 Sorry, no ^^' is he good? what kind of art is it? http://www.galeriajan.com/art/Zoran+T+Zivkovic/ Pretty much everything you need to know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5guysburgersnfries 216 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 http://www.galeriaja...ran+T+Zivkovic/ Pretty much everything you need to know It reminds me of my sister's style of art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 236 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 It reminds me of my sister's style of art Oh, she is an artist too? xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5guysburgersnfries 216 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 Oh, she is an artist too? xD Yeah, she used to get 100% on some projects for her school, she did an art course for a year but completely wasted her talent and became a chef instead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Spark 25 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 My brother doesn't understand me when I tell him what a Brony is! Me: *Telling what a Brony is* Brother: .....What's a Brony? Me: UGH!!! Nevermind! Brother: No! Tell me! Me: *Ignoring* I have to tell him what it is and I give up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gingerpotato 889 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 I have a 'friend' at school who believes that all bronies are homosexual, creepy men who clop to pony pics. Sadly this is the usual reaction for when you tell someone you are a brony/ what a brony is. Oh well, back to loving and tolerating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrOphthalmos 497 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 So far I have had mixed reactions. The first people I told were the members of my FFXI linkshell. I had no idea how they would react but that game can get repetitive at times so I had MLP songs playing in the background. Apparently my new $80 headset is good enough that they could hear the songs clearly on Ventrilo. Oops! I got an immediate "what the hell are you listening to?!" reaction. This was not surprising since I usually listen to things like Nightwish and The Birhday Massacre. When one of them suggested Disney, I had to reply by saying, "No way! This is at least 20% cooler!" Right then, I discovered who was and was not familiar with the show. But, the nice thing was, even those not familiar with the show, had no negative reaction. I guess I have been playing with these guys long enough that they really don't care about any deviant behavior on my part. The only comments I get from time to time come when I am upset at the game. If I am upset at something, they tell me to watch ponies which I think is excellent advice. Now, for a different reaction - I recently started a business and sometimes things are slow. When there isn't much going on, I have a tendency to browse the internet. This might not be professional per say but I am the boss so I feel I am allowed that little perk. Anyway, I often share funny internet culture with my two employees. One of them is age 50 and the other age 60, both female. Well, I never told them outright that I was a brony but rather I kept showing them this "interesting internet phenomenon." Basically, I started showing them pony memes and talking about the brony community. The older female had a look of disgust on her face that somebody might have guessed I showed her that infamous Two Girls One Cup video. She completely rejected the idea of My Little Pony being good for ANYONE, let alone adult males. The younger employee had a very different reaction - she thought it was "cute." I eventually even showed her the Smile Smile Smile song. Her reaction - that pink pony is VERY happy! I replied by, "Yes, look at the Youtube comments, some people think Pinkie Pie can cure depression." I think it best to not admit to them that I am a brony. While it is nice to be friends with employees, I do believe there is such a thing as getting too close. Still, I do not regret showing them what I did show them since it gave me some insight into their different personalities. The older one seems to be more rigid in her mindset than the other but that's fine, I still consider both of them to be good people. Given what you guys have been saying, I am going to continue to tread carefully when discussing this subject. I just hope to someday bump into a brony and get an in-person brohoof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megustoreeze 35 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 Reaction I get when I admit that I'm a brony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onyx Inferno 8 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 at my school, I told this kid that I was a brony, and asked what it was and I told him, the rest of the day he made jokes about me having sex with ponies. after school, I clipped a MLP keychain to his backpack, now his "friends" call him gay, and he probably wants to hurt me, alot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
83awsm 234 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 at my school, I told this kid that I was a brony, and asked what it was and I told him, the rest of the day he made jokes about me having sex with ponies. after school, I clipped a MLP keychain to his backpack, now his "friends" call him gay, and he probably wants to hurt me, alot. Well played my good sir. I don't know how many times I've heard people associating rainbow dash with being gay... God does ignorance like that annoy me sometimes. 1 Awesomeness = at least 20% Cooler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champion RD92 8,658 February 23, 2012 Share February 23, 2012 (edited) I don't know how many times I've heard people associating rainbow dash with being gay... God does ignorance like that annoy me sometimes. Dude, it pisses me off so much when people call Rainbow Dash gay Edited February 23, 2012 by RainbowDash92 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Flitter 103 February 24, 2012 Share February 24, 2012 Haha! Some of these are actually hilarious When I first found out about MLP:FIM, I told my best friend, who, in turn decided to watch the show as well. She watched a few episodes and liked it, but stopped because she found another cartoon she liked better (Dan VS.). It wasn't until recently that she finished what season 2 has laid out for us so far. My other best fiend hasn't really watched much MLP as far as I'm aware. We watched about 10 episodes in the first season together. But she hasn't made any references and she's kind've clueless when we talk about it. xD My boyfriend, however, wanted to become a brony but wasn't? If that makes sense? I persuaded him to the pony side and now that's his addiction. I approve though. [: My other friends think it's cute and the 6 of us each have a pony that represents us - the mane six are almost identical to each one of us. It's kind of creepy in an oddly adorable way! But the others don't watch MLP, just take part in our name game. xD Other people just stare at me blankly and question why I would like "a little kids' show". My replies aren't all that great because it's pressure(!!!11!21!) and I hate pressure. LOL. So I just say "it's awesome!" and "you need to watch it to understand". c: But it's true! Once you start watching MLP:FIM, you can't stop. It's an addiction. There HAS to be some underlying message in the intro telling us to continue watching. WE WILL LOVE YOU! @_@ Anyhoof, I should Winter Wrap this reply up with a big hug to all ya bronies out thar. :'3 It can be tough being who we are and loving what we love but we stand tall and strong, together! With the elements of harmony AND friendship on our side! < 3 2 I waited all my life for this moment & I'm not going to let it slip by! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
83awsm 234 February 24, 2012 Share February 24, 2012 Dude, it pisses me off so much when people call Rainbow Dash gay IKR! Just because it says "rainbow" doesn't necessary make it gay. I've heard that being the reason behind it quite often... 1 Awesomeness = at least 20% Cooler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lillia 69 February 26, 2012 Share February 26, 2012 I've lost a few friends over being a Brony. Which is sad, but I've gained a few also, because goshdernnit, we Bronies just gotta stick together! The Most Misunderstood Mare... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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