is the nsa surveillance program too much?

[Frosty Fire 12]

well the question I want to ask is weither the benefits of domestic surveillance by the NSA, outweigh the harms?

 

let minnow what your guys' opinion is, because this has been a question I've had since the start of the program

 

Also if you're curious as to why I asked, I am the leading competitor in my school's forensic team and this is our topic for the month.

 

So I will probably make a monthly discussion talking about the new topic every month. So thank you to everyone who comments, and have a wonderful day

Edited October 22, 2013 by Doctor Blaze

[Emperor Posh 360]

Well... yes. Considering some recent info leaked about them hacking into government emails, but not just that. They spy on everyone in the US and even some people in other countries, surveilling phone calls, text messages, emails, even your phones GPS data is collected. If you name it they are probably watching it. I think before people decide to say no, they should look into it and actually see what the NSA is doing.

 

I think if they want to spy on their own people that's ok so long as they tell them what they are watching. As for other countries, well they can get lost, because it is not their business what goes on outside their country, unless it has todo with the onset of a war.

Edited October 21, 2013 by Xelphos

[Scootalove 10,689]

The surveillance program is really too much. They spy on everyone. people from other countries, they are literally watching everything that we send or do. They are monitoring our actions, even though we didn't approve of this surveillance in the first place. As a tip in the future, at least tell the people on why your monitoring and tracking everything that they do instead of doing it without permission.

[Outkin 35]

They don't need that much information god...and I find it funny they'd rather tap from their own allies and people rather then enemies or people that could be a serious risk. Yep, that guy's quarterly report is more important then <enemy country's*> plan to secretly launch nukes after an elaborate distraction detailed in the email.  

 

*I don't know who you guys are enemies against, I know little of federal politics 

[Shanks 10,816]

Yes the NSA and other government agencies are going way too far, they keep making the excuse that all of their overreaches of power and complete contempt for the constitution and the rule of law is necessary to "protect us" but history has shown that it does the exact opposite. Allowing unchecked power only encourages abuse of said power which often results in a police state which is exactly what is unfortunately happening in America today. Even more disturbingly is how many Americans actually are indifferent and even support this, political activist Mark Dice actually got people to sign a fake petition actually advocating an expansion of the police state he went so far as to say it would modeled after Nazi Germany.

 

http://youtu.be/l02E4cj4Vvo

[CornBreadGang 514]

They're going way too far. Invading our right to privacy, which was unconstitutional, according to the fourth Amendment to the Constitution, so basically, that means they could be tried for treason.

[Frosty Fire 12]

They're going way too far. Invading our right to privacy, which was unconstitutional, according to the fourth Amendment to the Constitution, so basically, that means they could be tried for treason.

I agree with you 100%, the sad part is though, the supreme court even says that it's constitutional How, I may never know. but thank you for your imput

[Appetite4Democracy 452]

Well... yes. Considering some recent info leaked about them hacking into government emails, but not just that. They spy on everyone in the US and even some people in other countries, surveilling phone calls, text messages, emails, even your phones GPS data is collected. If you name it they are probably watching it. I think before people decide to say no, they should look into it and actually see what the NSA is doing.

 

I think if they want to spy on their own people that's ok so long as they tell them what they are watching. As for other countries, well they can get lost, because it is not their business what goes on outside their country, unless it has todo with the onset of a war.

They don't. They spy on those who are suspected of crimes. It would cost way too much to spy on everyone, so they only spy on suspects.

[CornBreadGang 514]

I agree with you 100%, the sad part is though, the supreme court even says that it's constitutional:okiedokielokie: How, I may never know. but thank you for your imput

Yeah. That's my reaction to the Supreme Court's ruling. :okiedokielokie:

But yeah, makes me want to slap every official in the face. If the Founding Fathers were here, they'd be outraged.

[Frosty Fire 12]

image.jpg

Yeah. That's my reaction to the Supreme Court's ruling.

But yeah, makes me want to slap every official in the face. If the Founding Fathers were here, they'd be outraged.

No joke, it seems like even just the people here, have more than enough sense to make better decisions that what we call our " elected officials"...

[OkBuddy 586]

Yes. It is a pretty big problem. Privacy is being taken away for a lot of people, even those not in our country. It was recently revealed that the NSA was spying on the French. I want my freedom to be kept. I don't want to be watched because I could be a potential "terrorism" threat or something like that. It's like the government is not trusting their own people anymore.

[Frosty Fire 12]

Yes. It is a pretty big problem. Privacy is being taken away for a lot of people, even those not in our country. It was recently revealed that the NSA was spying on the French. I want my freedom to be kept. I don't want to be watched because I could be a potential "terrorism" threat or something like that. It's like the government is not trusting their own people anymore.

I had no idea about them being involved with other countries... So thanks for that information  Do you think you could give me a source for that?

[Loriem 639]

They don't. They spy on those who are suspected of crimes. It would cost way too much to spy on everyone, so they only spy on suspects.

They don't need the NSA for that, and it is only legal with warrants (which for some reason come from secret courts now too.) When they suspect a criminal or terrorist or what not, they get a warrant, they get all their web data, find phone records from companies who service the suspect, and possibly if necessary, search the house.

 

The NSA is a umbrella data collection agency, that just sotres all sorts of records and data. Supposedly, this would keep us safer, by using "trigger words" spoken in an email, text or phone message, and it would get looked at by an agent. This is done without warrants or much other reasonable cause, and wil many trigger word, they probably look through plenty of stuff. 

 

However, such a system is VERY easily abused, as president have used other agencies like the IRS to steal information on political matters *Cough*JFK*cough*Obama*Cough*Morewehaven'tlearnedaboutyet*cough*.

[Emperor Posh 360]

They don't. They spy on those who are suspected of crimes. It would cost way too much to spy on everyone, so they only spy on suspects.

I hate to argue what you are saying, but it has been leaked and they have already admitted to collecting this data. You should watch Tek Syndicate. They usually talk about stuff like this and what Snowden has leaked about the NSA.

[Shanks 10,816]

They don't. They spy on those who are suspected of crimes. It would cost way too much to spy on everyone, so they only spy on suspects.

But if they are so confident that everyone they are spying on is a criminal/terrorist than why don't they follow the 4th amendment and get a damn warrant? A suspect is called a suspect because they may or may not have committed a crime and assuming that the constitution and the rule of law is followed there should at least be probable cause to make them a suspect and "maybe" isn't sufficient probably cause there needs to be some evidence to back it up. And even if that is the case than what guarantee do we have that such a system will not be abused in the future? Dictatorships have a very nasty history of using spying and surveilance to track people and groups who disagree with them so they can shut them down. COINTELPRO has been spying on, slandering and even infiltrating political activist groups which are critical of the government for decades. Having a differing opinion of course is not a crime but former congressman and presidential candidate Ron Paul put it best "truth is treason in the empire of lies."

[MichaelxXxTrixie 433]

Lots of people will disagree with me, but here's the primary point of disagreement for many people (Not all) I've discussed this issue with.

 

People are afraid that someone is watching them do there petty little things (Watch porn, send hate mail, etc) You'd never know they were watching you in the first place and do you really think the Government cares about what weird things we do so long as we aren't trying to blow up some bridge. And of-course we are all good people right? And we shouldn't worry? Yes and no. The NSA has many pros and cons. 

 

We live in an age of cyber-space where things can be transmitted across the world in mere instants, or where people can tap into your webcams and microphones on your phones. Although we've came so very far from our primitive ancestors, the world still has a few very dangerous people with some very dangerous toys. Sometimes governments have to act and if that's out of constitution well then there going to have to do it, the needs of many outweigh the needs of individuals. This is done by monitoring web-traffic and picking out key words and choosing who to pick and follow.

 

A retired officer who served in the US military once explained this to me (He use to have a VERY large security clearance) Want to know why things like surveillance gets enacted? Because the higher-ups see things and know things that people like us don't know, and probably don't want to know. Terrorism is a very real thing all over the world, and of-course we all want to be able to sit in our homes and live happy lives, the world is monitored so we don't have to worry. 

 

We still live in a VERY free country, want to know why? All these government leaks in a non-free country would be approached a very different way. Those people who have the audacity to leak classified information out would be dead, they'd use all there security measures and tracking devices to hunt them down and kill them. So of-course we live in a nice country where we can bitch and moan about some people who know much more about the under-workings of the world than us keeping tabs on the bad guys.

 

We can hunt down multiple kinds of guys now with this technologies and cause justice, we can stop acts of terrorism, we can return kidnapped children, we can do so much. Of-course this power is good until it gets into the wrong hands.

 

I know the counter-argument to my claims and that is, more power to do good basically means the more bad you can do with it. We haven't blown our selves up with nuclear weapons yet right? Because the NSA at the moment are in the hands of sane people and not complete morons, I read these guys are only paid about 40k a year to monitor people. They aren't paid much at all. A very middle-class job and a shitty one too. 

 

And if the NSA screws us over in the end, I guess I'm wrong but I don't see that being the problem right now. The REAL problem is all of our debt, welfare and all of that junk in the USA. Basically people exploiting the government finding ways they can vote themselves into getting gifts. People are the problem now, not the government.