Is Winter Wrap Up Really Traditional?

[Shadowking58 1,137]

One thing I never understood, Twilight told us that Winter Wrap up is done without any magic, to celebrate the tradition that Ponyville was founded by Earth Ponies, that makes sense, but then, in order to wrap up Winter, they use the Pegasi to fly and move the clouds, technically speaking, they're going against the tradition already, even if they aren't using magic, but are using flight. Flying is not an Earth Pony trait, doesn't that also break the tradition of Winter Wrap Up?

 

It is revealed in Twilight's Kingdom that all of Equestria runs off of magic. Earth Ponies tending the land is considered magic, and the point of Winter Wrap up is to wrap up Winter without any magic, so wouldn't this technically going against the tradition as well? If tending the land is considered Earth Pony Magic, I mean.

Edited January 9, 2015 by Shadowking58

[Derplight Sperkle 1,013]

I know I mentioned it before (in the wrong place) it may be a plot hole, but what Twilight may mean is unicorn magic. Unicorns are the only species in the show to be exhibitng magical capabilities like teleportation or telekinesis. Flying has been always been a physical ability for pegasi and wasn't seen as magical unlike the unicorn's magic. Earth ponies cant fly unless helped by some contraption such as balloons, so with the pegasi doing the activities that earth ponies can't do wouldn't be breaking tradition.

 

I also want to note that in the episode Hearth's Warming Eve, it was mentioned that pegasi were always in charge of weather based activities because they could fly, unlike the other two species. Earth ponies were in charge of the land which they always have done. And unicorns were there for magic. So unicorns magic was what would have broken tradition.

[Jeric 46,851]

I have always taken this to mean it forbids unicorn magic (specifically spells) and not passive magic. 

[PSP (Dizzy) 201]

I agree with the two above posts. I think it's clear they meant active magic.

[Fhaolan 4,483]

Traditions that prohibit something are usually based in some obscure event or lore who's origin has been forgotten, leaving behind just the prohibition. Often dressed up later in an attempt to excuse the tradition from detailed examination.

 

This feels an awful lot like that. It's possible that some time in the distant past, some unicorn(s) tried to help with Winter Wrap Up, with truly disastrous consequences (beyond the minor inconveniences that Twilight got up to), maybe even a delayed consequence such as total crop failure. This would have taken place prior to the founding of Ponyville, long enough ago to make it a tradition shared by many Earth Pony settlements and for the details of the event to be forgotten.

[Red Cedar 1,408]

Pegasi have been in charge of controlling the weather across all of Equestria for as long as there has been an Equestria. Longer, in fact. Earth ponies would have been just as reliant on their skills for their crops to succeed now as in centuries past, so using their skills wasn't really optional.

 

Overt, manipulative magic of the sort unicorns use, however, is quite different from a physical (if magically aided) skill like flying. It's hard to say why it would have been banned, whether due to a previous disaster of the sort Twilight almost caused in the episode, or just stubborn earth pony pride and determination, but a traditional custom it is, and so for that one day it doesn't seem like much to ask of local unicorns.

[Nulln 755]

Pegasi traditionally live in the air and have always dealt with weather and clouds.  Earth ponies dealt with the earth.  The only thing non-traditional would be the use of magic.

[Pastel 7,630]

Actually, I believe earth ponies draw their strength from magic too. x)

[Silver Letter 1,832]

 

 

Traditions that prohibit something are usually based in some obscure event or lore who's origin has been forgotten

But that can't be the case since Ponyville is not very old and it seemed that Twilight Sparkle had never heard of Winter Wrap Up. It may be that it is only a local custom.

[Derplight Sperkle 1,013]

But that can't be the case since Ponyville is not very old and it seemed that Twilight Sparkle had never heard of Winter Wrap Up. It may be that it is only a local custom.

That would be the case but twilight came from Canterlot which may have done away with the physical Winter Wrap Up that Ponyville performs. Even though Canterlot has gotten rid of it, some some towns like Ponyville may have kept it up for traditional or capability reasons which has been left unclear.

[Silver Letter 1,832]

 

 

Even though Canterlot has gotten rid of it, some some towns like Ponyville may have kept it up for traditional or capability reasons which has been left unclear.

I think that is still unlikely. Twilight would have heard of it. Ponyville is obscure which is why I thought it was called Ponyville in the show. Like it's so generic or far flung that it doesn't even have an interesting name. It would make sense that it was only their tradition.

[Derplight Sperkle 1,013]

I think that is still unlikely. Twilight would have heard of it. Ponyville is obscure which is why I thought it was called Ponyville in the show. Like it's so generic or far flung that it doesn't even have an interesting name. It would make sense that it was only their tradition.

Since Ponyville would qualify as a small town, Winter Wrap may only be performed by these small communities. Any town or city larger than Ponyville may have gotten rid of the physical Winter Wrap Up but the show doesn't elaborate if this kind of activity is performed anywhere else besides Ponyville and Canterlot

[Red Cedar 1,408]

I think that is still unlikely. Twilight would have heard of it. Ponyville is obscure which is why I thought it was called Ponyville in the show. Like it's so generic or far flung that it doesn't even have an interesting name. It would make sense that it was only their tradition.

Well, the real reason Ponyville is called Ponyville is because Hasbro had a trademark on the word Ponyville dating back to G3 and insisted Lauren Faust use the name. That's why Ponyville as a name sounds so incongruous with other cuty names in the show.

[Silver Letter 1,832]

Since Ponyville would qualify as a small town, Winter Wrap may only be performed by these small communities. Any town or city larger than Ponyville may have gotten rid of the physical Winter Wrap Up but the show doesn't elaborate if this kind of activity is performed anywhere else besides Ponyville and Canterlot

Winter Wrap Up kind of makes no sense as it goes against the idea that the three pony types work together. And the town seems to pride itself on being a place where the three types of ponies live together, like how the Cutie Mark Crusaders Social Club likes to emphasize. It proves that the thing is a pointless relic of the past. But who's relic? Canterlot is mostly unicorns. And other towns still control the weather and have to change the seasons. How could it be widespread throughout small town Equestria and evade Twilight's radar?

[Tilt 286]

This is the very reason I can't like the episode, people can write away this plot hole all they wish but the Pegasus do use magic and that magic is what helps them physically move clouds and even stand on them. Hence why Twilight can suddenly stand on clouds once becoming an Alicorn when she couldn't before. There are other reasons I do not like this episode but I akin it to my opinion of Frozen, it's a lot of filler with a iconic song.

[Derplight Sperkle 1,013]

Winter Wrap Up kind of makes no sense as it goes against the idea that the three pony types work together. And the town seems to pride itself on being a place where the three types of ponies live together, like how the Cutie Mark Crusaders Social Club likes to emphasize. It proves that the thing is a pointless relic of the past. But who's relic? Canterlot is mostly unicorns. And other towns still control the weather and have to change the seasons. How could it be widespread throughout small town Equestria and evade Twilight's radar?

I don't think we may never truly know the answer to the question. Since there will probably never be another episode like Winter Wrap up again, we won't know how widespread this tradition is. For all we know, Ponyville is the only location that actually does it.

 

I also don't think this would go against the harmony of the three species since unicorns are still helping with Winter Wrap Up. Rarity for example is making birds' nests so despite the limitation of not using magic, unicorns are still helping out.

 

It all boils down to the fact however is that this episode is from season 1 and so Much has happened since then. Lauren Faust may not have thought this far ahead with this show because no one would have seen how the fandom of this show has exploded beyond the expectations in the beginning. Winter Wrap Up is and will probably now remain as a relic of the past.

[Nature's Spell 526]

I don't think we may never truly know the answer to the question. Since there will probably never be another episode like Winter Wrap up again, we won't know how widespread this tradition is. For all we know, Ponyville is the only location that actually does it.

 

I also don't think this would go against the harmony of the three species since unicorns are still helping with Winter Wrap Up. Rarity for example is making birds' nests so despite the limitation of not using magic, unicorns are still helping out.

 

It all boils down to the fact however is that this episode is from season 1 and so Much has happened since then. Lauren Faust may not have thought this far ahead with this show because no one would have seen how the fandom of this show has exploded beyond the expectations in the beginning. Winter Wrap Up is and will probably now remain as a relic of the past.

 

Well said! No matter how much we may wish it to be different MLP, any movie or TV show, is never free of plot holes and miss steps. Shows go in different directions and formulate different goals. Writers have different points of view. In the end we can't always reconcile thoses differences.

[Fhaolan 4,483]

But that can't be the case since Ponyville is not very old and it seemed that Twilight Sparkle had never heard of Winter Wrap Up. It may be that it is only a local custom.

It's possible it's a local custom, but it's also possible to be a rural custom. Twilight is a young city pony, and seems to be confused by any and all rural activity, like many 'city folk' in RL. I'm personally used to explaining many rural customs to the young city-born people I work with, because the closest thing to a farm they've seen is a couple of flower pots in their parent's apartment. Heck, are you familiar with the tradition of the Burning of the Corn Maiden? It was a big deal in the farming community where I grew up, and had been brought over from Europe ages past, so it wasn't just a local custom.

 

And it's not like Ponyville itself is obscure or really distant. In the show, you can see Canterlot Castle from Ponyville, and vice-versa. The apparent distance is more due to the fact you can't travel a straight line from one to the other, as illustrated by the train which has to curve around several times to climb through those foothills and that mountain Canterlot is perched on.

[Manman20x6 359]

My explanation is that there weren't many powerful unicorns in Ponyville when it was first founded. Therefore, cleaning up winter was done entirely through hard work and manual labor. As the town grew, an unicorn capable of clearing all of the snow with a single spell showed up. However, after a few years of easy spring cleanings, the town realized that the tradition of working together to wrap up winter was a great bonding experience for everypony, and thus they all decided to stop using magic.

 

This is why pegasus and earth pony magic doesn't go against the spirit of Winter Wrap-Up, because even with it, there's still a lot of work involved, so it's different from just casting one spell and doing everything instantly.

[AlbaTross 1,586]

I did find it a little unfair that Pegasi can use their flight ability, but Unicorns can't use magic, but as indicated by the events of Winter Wrap-Up, perhaps there is a fear of the consequences of active magic, such as spells. A lot of the Pegasus population seems to reside in Cloudsdale too, and the two towns are close enough that maybe they have some kind of long standing agreement that involves Pegasus flight, but not Unicorn magic.

 

I do get the sense that Unicorn immigration came much later, whereas Pegasi live so close to Ponyville that it probably didn't take long for it to occur to them that living closer to ground level isn't out of the question. Ponyville appears to be the big initial Earth Pony settlement, whereas Cloudsdale is entirely populated by Pegasi(for obvious reasons), and Canterlot must have been where the Unicorns settled primarily. As one of the three settlements is further away from the others, geography probably limited the number of Unicorns who ended up in Ponyville.

 

Of course, the mane six were born in a time when decent transportation networks already exist, so all three species have since spread out across Equestria, but that could explain why Unicorns to this day often keep to themselves, without the excuse Pegasi have of being the only ones who can set foot on clouds, and it could also explain long standing policies like no Unicorn magic to aid in the annual winter wrap-up.

[Cwanky 17,579]

Well let's sort things out a bit.

 

First Ponyville was founded by Earth ponies, so it makes sense that they take pride in their manual labor skills, much like Cloudsdale takes pride in its fliers.

 

Secondly we know that over time Ponyville became a place of more integration between all races, most recently a zebra and yes, everyone's favorite draconequus.  Thus it makes sense that pegasi would get involved in the wrap up, 

Thirdly I think its safe to say by magic, the Ponyvillians mean direct spellcasting sort of magic. Whether it be unicorn, Tirek, zebra or otherwise. Flying is exempt because its actually a form of exercise and can be considered elbow grease. Magic, which often involves enhancements, telekinesis and not using one's body, is NOT manual labor.

[VitalSpark 1,830]

 

 

Ponyville appears to be the big initial Earth Pony settlement

 

I don't think Ponyville can be classed as a big settlement at all. I'd suggest that it's a small town (or possibly large village) of farmers and commuters, not far from Canterlot, which is the main unicorn settlement.

 

Manehattan on the other hand does seem to be a big earth pony settlement. Every character that's been associated with that city has been an earth pony (Aunt and Uncle Orange, Babs Seed, Coco Pommel, Cheese Sandwich, the Daring Do comic book trader, etc).

[AlbaTross 1,586]

I don't think Ponyville can be classed as a big settlement at all. I'd suggest that it's a small town (or possibly large village) of farmers and commuters, not far from Canterlot, which is the main unicorn settlement.

 

Manehattan on the other hand does seem to be a big earth pony settlement. Every character that's been associated with that city has been an earth pony (Aunt and Uncle Orange, Babs Seed, Coco Pommel, Cheese Sandwich, the Daring Do comic book trader, etc).

Maybe you're right on that one. It is more in line with Cloudsdale and Canterlot as a major population center. I'm not sure which is closer to Ponyville, Manehattan or Canterlot, but I'm going to assume Manehattan is. I still haven't invested in the guidebooks for the series. That may be my next purchase, since season 4 and Rainbow Rocks are due to arrive on Monday, and will complete my season/film collection(I have seasons 1-3 and the first EG film now).

[sweetolebob18 728]

I sort of got the impression that it was an Earth Pony thing -showing that they didn't need Unicorn magic to do things, but could do it with their strength & skill, thank you very much.  As to T never having heard of it, she was a big city girl from Canterlot (head of govt & more a unicorn town).  Spike's comment that they used magic there makes sense.  But, Ponyville is a small(ish) rural town & much more Earth Pony.  The ponies are closer to their farm roots & the old ways & old traditions still mean something, there. 

[Landi 600]

As others have said, the tradition is referring to unicorn magic because Pegasus magic and earth pony magic passive rather then active.

I actually think the tradition makes plenty of sense, for Unicorn magic has shown to be strong, rule-bending, and even a bit overpowered. Ponies would hardly have to put forth any work to change the seasons if unicorns were allowed to just magically wrap it up in the matter of minutes. One of the major reasons for winter wrap up is for ponies to work together to bring on spring using hard work and co-operation; unicorn magic pretty much evades this concept. Plus, I can imagine pegasi and earth ponies want something to be proud of despite not having access to the powerful magic the unicorns have, and Winter wrap up seems like a perfect opportunity for that. I can imagine other cities, possible even some bigger ones, who like to wrap winter up the traditional way as well.