gaming The Problem with the Pokémon GTS

[Moonlight Magician 494]

What's with all these people requesting level 9 and under legendary pokémon? It is very difficult to find a good trade on the GTS because of all these people. I was looking for a Tepig on the GTS and pretty much everyone requested a level 9 and under Reshiram or Zekrom. It makes me so angry!

Edited February 24, 2014 by Moonlight Magician

[FractalMoon 378]

What's with all these people requesting level 9 and under legendary pokémon? It is very difficult to find a good trade on the GTS because of all these people. I was looking for a Tepig on the GTS and pretty much everyone requested a level 9 and under Reshiram or Zekrom. It makes me so angry!

Still not as bad as the people who put up common pokemon for event ones, or level 2s for level 100s...

[Moved to Elsewhere 11,331]

I defiantly agree with you. When I first heard of the GTS I thought, "This sounds great for me to get really good Pokemon." The nwhen I go there, everyone is requesting those. Why, and why level 9 and under for that matter? It's not like they'll be winning online battles or anything?  

[~Silver Essence~ 2,625]

Here is the main reason why.

 

Most ask for a level under 10 because that way, they can raise it to their own way by stats and power.

 

If you give one with your personal stat changes or high level, no one would want it since it's too late to personalize it.

 

Hope this helps to understand why.

[Celtore 2,770]

I agree, those posts really annoyed me. Back in the 4th gen, I was incredibly tempted to generate some level 1 legendaries with horrible natures, stats, and moves just to counter troll. Fortunately for legendary trades, you can just filter them out all together, but not so with "almost" legendaries like the birds.

 

It's a surprise they don't crack down on that, it really isn't that difficult to detect whether a level 9 aggron is possible or not. But I suppose that would require some maintenance for new event pokemon... Maybe if they merged the GTS effort with some of pokemon bank's components...

Edited February 24, 2014 by Celtore

[Moonlight Magician 494]

Here is the main reason why.

Most ask for a level under 10 because that way, they can raise it to their own way by stats and power.

If you give one with your personal stat changes or high level, no one would want it since it's too late to personalize it.

Hope this helps to understand why.

You do know it is impossible to get under level 9 legendaries right? it would be ok if it were possible to obtain them at that low level but it is annoying if you can't get them because that pretty much ruins the trade.

[~Silver Essence~ 2,625]

You do know it is impossible to get under level 9 legendaries right? it would be ok if it were possible to obtain them at that low level but it is annoying if you can't get them because that pretty much ruins the trade.

While it is impossible, it's still possible.

 

Lately, I have been seeing some 5-10 legendaries that surprises me!

 

But how do they do it? I don't know, but that sounds like a golden opportunity.

[Moonlight Magician 494]

While it is impossible, it's still possible.

Lately, I have been seeing some 5-10 legendaries that surprises me!

But how do they do it? I don't know, but that sounds like a golden opportunity.

Yup! You'd be able to counter-troll the people that offer shiny Pokémon for the level 9 and under legendaries! I would love to see the look on their face!

[Mutemutt 773]

Yeah, I gave up on GTS pretty much instantly. I had a good laugh at how everyone was asking for legendary pokemon to trade for their eevee. Apparently people use the GTS for some cloning glitch; they ask for an impossible trade so that the pokemon doesn't get traded by accident.

 

While it is impossible, it's still possible.

Lately, I have been seeing some 5-10 legendaries that surprises me!

But how do they do it? I don't know, but that sounds like a golden opportunity.

 

I'm pretty sure they're just hacked/ AR pokemon. 

Edited February 24, 2014 by Mutemutt

[Chacobos 160]

While it is impossible, it's still possible.

Lately, I have been seeing some 5-10 legendaries that surprises me!

But how do they do it? I don't know, but that sounds like a golden opportunity.

  

Yeah, I gave up on GTS pretty much instantly. I had a good laugh at how everyone was asking for legendary pokemon to trade for their eevee. Apparently people use the GTS for some cloning glitch; they ask for an impossible trade so that the pokemon doesn't get traded by accident.

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure they're just hacked/ AR pokemon.

 

Bingo, it's still quite easy to move hacked pokemon around even with the laughable hack checker. You just need to make it seem legit minus stats and level

[KirbyFluttershy 2,523]

It's just like all other ridiculous Trade offers since 4th-5th gen pokemon games cuz People wanted a event pokemon for a low level legendary pokemon, but that's not even possible unless it's hacked. Another reason was to make a possible clone, but I don't think that's possible after the cloning method was found out in X/Y.

 

I may suggest that using filters if you're using GTS in X/Y to search for the pokemon you want to avoid these ridiculous trade offer(s). The filter(s) and search(es) in GTS wasn't introduced (or released) in 4th-5th gen pokemon games.

[The Mane-iac 1,648]

Yea, I pretty much gave up on the GTS. I have Y and need the X exclusives, but the dumb stuff people want for them I gave up. I managed to get lucky on Houndour by finding someone who wanted a Haunter, but beyond that everything has been stupid. The filtering system also needs tweaked some more IMO.

[Radiance64 7,053]

X/Y's GTS lets you filter out 'special' Pokémon and only search for people asking for Pokémon you have, I agree in previous generations the GTS was a pain in the ass but I can't say I've really had any problems with gen 6's.

I think they might want to tweak the options a bit for individual Pokémon though, like if a Pokémon is impossible to obtain at certain levels then don't give people the options to ask for them at levels lower than possible. If they fix that at least then I think it would be golden, because that is the main problem really and I'm sure they could fix it.

[theshinycelebi 93]

Hmmm, as a fellow Pokémon player and competitive battler, I can say one thing. These people are cloning their pokes. In 1.1 and under, there was a way to manipulate the system and effectively get the Pokémon back from the GTS as well as the dupe from their Box. They ask for illegal pokes so as to ensure nopony ACTUALLY accepts their offer. In 1.2 I believe this was patched, iirc, however there yet remains a quicker way to clone, involving 2 3DS systems. Since bits don't grow on trees, and most don't have two, they decide not to update and continue using GTS manipulation, while those with 2 systems use the new method.

Edited February 24, 2014 by RainBDash

[True Rarity 1,240]

I'm sorry, but wouldn't that be a problem with the traders, not the forums?

 

Anyway, I do see your point. I'm pretty sick of people asking for Legendaries of any level and offering a lvl 3 Ditto in return...

[deadprofile 1,122]

GTS really doesn't seem to do its purpose well because of the illegitimate pokemon and everyone asking for pretty much the same ones...No diversity, No guarantee at all...

 

What every happened to the good old fashioned link cable of the good ol' Gameboy Color....Pokemon is just getting more and more high tech, and for someone like me who rarely uses the internet (I don't game at work where I do have internet), I feel like I am not getting the full pokemon experience at all

[SBaby 660]

The constant influx of 'Lv 9 and under Legendary' requests really illustrates exactly why the EV system in Pokémon seriously needs to be revamped. 

 

I've said time and again that an Aptitude system where the points directly affect your stats would be way more user-friendly (and realistic, since aptitude does in fact work that way) than the system we have now.  Then you can raise it by doing various things outside of simply leveling up.  Plus, a max level Pokémon would still be able to raise their aptitude, making it worthwile to keep around even after gaining all the experience it can.  That's how they do it in Disgaea, and it's so perfect that it's scary.

[Mutemutt 773]

The constant influx of 'Lv 9 and under Legendary' requests really illustrates exactly why the EV system in Pokémon seriously needs to be revamped. 

 

I've said time and again that an Aptitude system where the points directly affect your stats would be way more user-friendly (and realistic, since aptitude does in fact work that way) than the system we have now.  Then you can raise it by doing various things outside of simply leveling up.  Plus, a max level Pokémon would still be able to raise their aptitude, making it worthwile to keep around even after gaining all the experience it can.  That's how they do it in Disgaea, and it's so perfect that it's scary.

 

Not really. Like I said they're using the GTC to duplicate pokemon and they put up the illegitimate pokemon to prevent unwanted trades from happening. People will do it simply because it's quick and easy (or at least, the quickest and easiest method available to them) and they'll probably continue to do so until it's no longer worth it, either because it becomes impossibly difficult or an easier/quicker method has been discovered etc. People duped stuff in Disgaea as well (Puppy paw stick in D3 and the item world/Rosen Queen duping in D4) for the same reasons.

 

I'm just a little confused on what kind of aptitude system you're talking about; like, how does it work? I play Disgaea but their's works with equipment as a multiplier and you can max out all of the aptitudes, which would take out a bit of the diversity in pokemon battles. By the way max level pokemon can still benefit from EVs: the stats are recaculated after battle whether or not a level up occurs.

[SBaby 660]

Not really. Like I said they're using the GTC to duplicate pokemon and they put up the illegitimate pokemon to prevent unwanted trades from happening. People will do it simply because it's quick and easy (or at least, the quickest and easiest method available to them) and they'll probably continue to do so until it's no longer worth it, either because it becomes impossibly difficult or an easier/quicker method has been discovered etc. People duped stuff in Disgaea as well (Puppy paw stick in D3 and the item world/Rosen Queen duping in D4) for the same reasons.

 

I'm just a little confused on what kind of aptitude system you're talking about; like, how does it work? I play Disgaea but their's works with equipment as a multiplier and you can max out all of the aptitudes, which would take out a bit of the diversity in pokemon battles. By the way max level pokemon can still benefit from EVs: the stats are recaculated after battle whether or not a level up occurs.

 

First I'll talk about the PPS (Puppy Paw Stick).  I am aware that it allowed for duplicating items.  So I'll get this out of the way now.  According to an interview with one of the producers of the Disgaea games, they honestly didn't realize that it could steal from clones in Class World until the game was already out on the market.  And because Nippon Ichi Software isn't a very big company, pulling the game from shelves to fix the error would have been very damaging to the company's bottom line (read:financially devastating), which relies heavily on their mainstream series' sales.  It was an honest (if extremely exploitable) mistake, and they fixed it in all future games.  It should also be noted that in the original prototype version of Disgaea 1, they wanted Item World to be something you had to go all the way through in one trip.  Obviously, this would have been a bad idea, hence the Mr. Gency Exits and portals every 10th floor.

 

Anyway, onto the Aptitude System.  

 

In Disgaea, you have an Aptitude system, which is kind of like a mash of the EV and IV systems from Pokemon, but you can actually see them in your stats.  Improvement number 1.  You can actually SEE the numbers.  If you play Pokemon for awhile and EV train a Pokemon part of the way, take a break for a few weeks to go on vacation, then come back, you'll often forget where you were in training and probably mess up the numbers, unless you write it down.  In Disgaea, they resolve this by letting you see the numbers.

 

Second, and this especially applies to later games.  You can improve your aptitudes in a way that becomes more streamlined the further you get in the series.  At first, you only improve them by Reincarnating.  But by the time you get to D2, you can improve them simply by putting your character in the training room section that improves your aptitudes.  You raise them simply by fighting, no matter what you fight.

 

Finally, all of them can be maxed (currently at 300% in non-RS mode, though I did hear rumors that the next game might go up to 500%).  Now I know in Pokemon this makes it sound like you're making each Pokemon a carbon copy of the others.  But that's not true at all.  In fact, this would be the best way to do it competently.  Bear in mind that the average Pokemon player probably doesn't care too much about EV Training.  The people that do are the competitive battlers.  So they're going to take the time to level it up anyway.  All these changes would do is make the process more streamlined and user-friendly, and it would take out alot of the guess work, and probably save Smogon some grief when it comes to suspect testing.

[Lightwing 12,978]

While it is impossible, it's still possible.

 

Lately, I have been seeing some 5-10 legendaries that surprises me!

 

But how do they do it? I don't know, but that sounds like a golden opportunity.

I can explain you that

 

With a wi-fi conexion control and certain programs,you can manipulate the dns number of the gts to get ceryain pokemon with. certain stats

 

I would show you a web page with info,but i can't find them.

 

I hope it helped you :3

[Mutemutt 773]

First I'll talk about the PPS (Puppy Paw Stick).  I am aware that it allowed for duplicating items.  So I'll get this out of the way now...

 

My point was about the players doing something simply because it's available, quick and easy. The GTS being filled with impossible trades is an unfortunate side effect. Even if you did change the EV to an aptitude system similar to Disgaea there would still be duping. Plus Disgaea 4's duping exploit was way worse than D3's PPS.

 

 

In Disgaea, you have an Aptitude system, which is kind of like a mash of the EV and IV systems from Pokemon, but you can actually see them in your stats.  Improvement number 1.  You can actually SEE the numbers.  If you play Pokemon for awhile and EV train a Pokemon part of the way, take a break for a few weeks to go on vacation, then come back, you'll often forget where you were in training and probably mess up the numbers, unless you write it down.  In Disgaea, they resolve this by letting you see the numbers.

 

 

 

 

I can get with you on this one even though it only takes about 15~30 min to fully EV train a pokemon at this point. Being able to see an actual number would be useful.

 

 

Second, and this especially applies to later games.  You can improve your aptitudes in a way that becomes more streamlined the further you get in the series.  At first, you only improve them by Reincarnating.  But by the time you get to D2, you can improve them simply by putting your character in the training room section that improves your aptitudes.  You raise them simply by fighting, no matter what you fight.

 

I not so sure about this one. In Disgaea D2 you raise aptitudes sort of randomly and it's always by some battle which you'll most likely be grinding anyway. The only notable difference between Pokemon and Disgaea in this area is that in Pokemon grinding for EV has to be more focused given that there is a limited amount points to be gained unlike Disgaea.  

 

Finally, all of them can be maxed (currently at 300% in non-RS mode, though I did hear rumors that the next game might go up to 500%).  Now I know in Pokemon this makes it sound like you're making each Pokemon a carbon copy of the others.  But that's not true at all.  In fact, this would be the best way to do it competently.  Bear in mind that the average Pokemon player probably doesn't care too much about EV Training.  The people that do are the competitive battlers.  So they're going to take the time to level it up anyway.  All these changes would do is make the process more streamlined and user-friendly, and it would take out alot of the guess work, and probably save Smogon some grief when it comes to suspect testing.

 

 

That may not change the game a ton but it does take away from the diversity found in fine tuning the stats. Even if it didn't, it does nothing but add to the number of stats you need to max out just to be effective. Can't say I like the idea.

[SBaby 660]

 

 

I not so sure about this one. In Disgaea D2 you raise aptitudes sort of randomly and it's always by some battle which you'll most likely be grinding anyway. The only notable difference between Pokemon and Disgaea in this area is that in Pokemon grinding for EV has to be more focused given that there is a limited amount points to be gained unlike Disgaea.  

 

You do raise them randomly.  But when you think about it, it is more realistic than the way Pokemon does it.  In Pokemon, you defeat a certain enemy type and that corresponding stat goes up.  It's what I like to call the 'Step On An Ant, Step On A Snail Effect'.   Here's what it is saying.  If you step on an ant, you get stronger.  If you step on a snail, you get smarter.  It really doesn't make too much sense when you think about it.  However, if you step on an ant, then wait to see what happens afterward and how the other ants react to it, you aren't getting stronger.  You're learning something.  Therefore, you would be getting smarter.  That's the logic behind Disgaea's random Aptitude gains.  However...

 

 

 

That may not change the game a ton but it does take away from the diversity found in fine tuning the stats. Even if it didn't, it does nothing but add to the number of stats you need to max out just to be effective. Can't say I like the idea.

 

 

The thing is, they don't necessarily need to be random.  There could be other ways to train EVs outside of vitamins.  They should have some kind of facility where you can put Pokemon into a spot where they improve certain EVs depending on what you have them entered in.  And most importantly, you should be able to SEE THE EVS.

 

Now as far as maxing them goes, well the competitive battlers are going to do that anyway, so it really wouldn't take anything away from what they would do anyway.  Also, Pokemon are diverse enough so that there would still be enough of a difference that the strategy of battles would still be there.

 

In Disgaea's case, I never once thought the ability to max out my aptitudes took away from any of the diversity, because you still had to upgrade weapons and items, as well as characters that were all different from one another.  My point is, if Disgaea has enough diversity in it to make this ok to do, Pokemon definitely does (especially seeing as they have almost ten times the number of creatures).

[Mutemutt 773]

 

 

You do raise them randomly.  But when you think about it, it is more realistic than the way Pokemon does it.  In Pokemon, you defeat a certain enemy type and that corresponding stat goes up.  It's what I like to call the 'Step On An Ant, Step On A Snail Effect'.   Here's what it is saying.  If you step on an ant, you get stronger.  If you step on a snail, you get smarter.  It really doesn't make too much sense when you think about it.  However, if you step on an ant, then wait to see what happens afterward and how the other ants react to it, you aren't getting stronger.  You're learning something.  Therefore, you would be getting smarter.  That's the logic behind Disgaea's random Aptitude gains.  However...

How much sense it makes doesn't have much weight in the end since you'll just be grinding through it.

 

 

 

The thing is, they don't necessarily need to be random.  There could be other ways to train EVs outside of vitamins.  They should have some kind of facility where you can put Pokemon into a spot where they improve certain EVs depending on what you have them entered in.  And most importantly, you should be able to SEE THE EVS.

There is another way, and it does show you how much points you gain, but it's much, much slower in the end. I agree with being able to see the EVs, though; that's just plain convenient.

 

 

 

Now as far as maxing them goes, well the competitive battlers are going to do that anyway, so it really wouldn't take anything away from what they would do anyway.  Also, Pokemon are diverse enough so that there would still be enough of a difference that the strategy of battles would still be there.

It also adds nothing but additional grind time. I see no benefit to this.

 

 

 

In Disgaea's case, I never once thought the ability to max out my aptitudes took away from any of the diversity, because you still had to upgrade weapons and items, as well as characters that were all different from one another.  My point is, if Disgaea has enough diversity in it to make this ok to do, Pokemon definitely does (especially seeing as they have almost ten times the number of creatures).

It takes away from the diversity in that every class is just as effective with any weapon as the next class, stats wise. The most defining feature of the classes being the evilities and weapon choice (giving a different set of specials), once you reach stat caps. But none of that really matters (especially not the stats) since Disgaea has no competitive element to it. The stats in Pokemon hold more meaning, being much more finite; there being a trade-off for maxing one stat over the other adds more strategy to the game.Pokemon and Disgaea are just too different for a one to one transfer of mechanics like this.