If Celestia doesn't appear in the upcoming Season 5 premiere....

[Cleverclover 1,526]

....then I'm sorry, but that's just the final straw for her. It will be indisputable confirmation that she is now completely, utterly, 100% useless to the show.   

 

In light of the season 5 trailer, I've come to realize that it's a definite possibility (or rather, a likelihood) that Celestia might not be appearing in the premiere, which would be a first for her, as she has consistently made appearances in each premiere and finale in each season. 

 

In The Return of Harmony and The Crystal Empire, Celestia serves as a mission-giver of sorts. She informs the mane six of the return of a long-defeated evil, and sends them on their way to handle it. From what we've seen of the season 5 premiere, it appears that it's going to follow the same (or at least a similar) route, only with one huge difference this time. Celestia is not serving as the mission-giver. Instead, the mission is given by the map itself. So we can probably expect that the mane six are going to find the town via the map, find out about the crisis on their own, and resolve it without any involvement from Celestia whatsoever. And with her not serving as the mission-giver, she has no other reason to appear in the episode. 

 

Like I said, this would be a first for her, as up to this point, the premieres and finales have been the only times when she has been guaranteed to make an appearance. And yet here I am, under the impression that she's going to be sitting this next one out. If that's the case, then I have to ask a serious, legitimate question: What's left for her? 

 

Keep in mind, Celestia only appeared in five episodes in season 4: Princess Twilight Sparkle, Equestria Games, and Twilight's Kingdom. Prior to season 4, her longest absence in the show occurred in season 2, and was 11 episodes long: between Sweet and Elite and It's About Time, not counting her flashback appearance in Family Appreciation Day. In season 4, that absence nearly doubled in length and she went a staggering 21 episodes without making so much as a cameo. 

 

This leads me to believe that when it comes to the normal slice-of-life episodes, Celestia pretty much has no further purpose in the show (hell she didn't even utter a single line in Equestria Games). So with those ruled out, that pretty much leaves just the tension-filled premieres and finales, and as soon as she stops appearing in those, that's it for her. 

 

She has nothing left. 

 

She has no purpose. 

 

Her role in the show, which has gradually diminished with each passing season, has now become virtually non-existent. 

 

The writers simply have no reason to keep her around anymore. And hell, Luna is quickly facing the same problem, but if Apple Bloom ends up having her own episode in season 5 where Luna appears as her moral guide in a dream, that gives her at least one more purpose. Unfortunately, that's probably more than can be said for Celestia at this point...

[Brock Obama 298]

THANK GAWD! Nobody likes Sunbutt anyway.

 

 

In all seriousness they are probably change her role in the show as the plot changes.

[Celli 4,338]

THANK GAWD! Nobody likes Sunbutt anyway.

 

 

In all seriousness they are probably change her role in the show as the plot changes.

What did you say boy? :okiedokielokie: 

Seriously though, I love Luna a lot, but I feel that Tia doesn't get nearly as much love as she deserves, and I really don't like seeing people rag on her. Not saying you are, but I know way too many people that do.

 

Oh, um, OT:

I do agree to an extent that she's mostly served her purpose, other than, well, her daily duty, but I think that, and I've said this countless times, after 1000 years by yourself, anybody would get tired and want a big long rest. And would also make them not think straight. Not even Celestia is exempt from this. By the way, she's NOT immortal. Seriously, clever, your Points on Twilight have some merit, but I wish people would give Celestia a break. I don't know if you'll respond to this, or if you'll even take anything I say into consideration, but just putting this out there. At least you don't resort to being hostile and you clearly put a lot of thought and effort into your points.

[Dulset Tarn 441]

Seriously, when they got the orders from the table of harmony and left to some unknown corner of the country, I was seriously wondering if Twilight even thought to tell Celestia what they were doing.

 

The funny/sad part about all this is that despite Celestia's purpose being all but completely removed from the show, she still hasn't even gotten a single episode, which people have been eager to see since season 1!

[Cwanky 17,584]

As much as I hate to admit it, its true. There's only so long that you can keep a character underdeveloped and at the same time expect him or her to have a major role and impact.

 

Aside from Celestia's supposed role the show tells us, there's literally been ZERO meaningful lore, at least show wise to explain her significance or develop her role. Hell even Moonbutt  :comeatus: er Luna, the supposedly "lesser" of the 2 sisters, has had considerably more development and lore in the show. The audience simply can't be expected to support and relate to Celestia if she's never actually there. She's in danger of becoming a poorly written deus ex machina, unless of course that's what the writers intend, but even then the planning would seem off and bad based on what's been scene.

 

She's surpassed Dumbledore status now in terms of being a manipulative and careless jerk. And believe me, Dumbledore was a massive jerk, even the story acknowledged that with his past and his brother Aberforth. But at least with Dumbledore we actually saw his side of the story and he actually did have more than 1 meaningful dialogue with Harry and others. Where has that been for that past 4 seasons with Celestia and Twilight?

 

"Oh I'm busy right now Twilight, instead of spending some time to discuss to you how to save the Crystal Empire I'll just give you this brief memo and hope you don't screw up."

 

"Oh you're officially a princess now Twilight. Enjoy your new status, even though you're young inexperienced and have not had any real leadership roles yet, let alone know how to run a country. Bye!" 

 

I really want to like Celestia, but the show has not offered me an ounce as to why I should. And no it can't simply be lore derived from the comics or another source. The audience watching deserves to know who the person that Twilight looks up to as a role model really is. Otherwise she isn't really much of a role model, or anything for that matter.

[Buck Testa 5,505]

....then I'm sorry, but that's just the final straw for her. It will be indisputable confirmation that she is now completely, utterly, 100% useless to the show.   

 

In light of the season 5 trailer, I've come to realize that it's a definite possibility (or rather, a likelihood) that Celestia might not be appearing in the premiere, which would be a first for her, as she has consistently made appearances in each premiere and finale in each season. 

 

In The Return of Harmony and The Crystal Empire, Celestia serves as a mission-giver of sorts. She informs the mane six of the return of a long-defeated evil, and sends them on their way to handle it. From what we've seen of the season 5 premiere, it appears that it's going to follow the same (or at least a similar) route, only with one huge difference this time. Celestia is not serving as the mission-giver. Instead, the mission is given by the map itself. So we can probably expect that the mane six are going to find the town via the map, find out about the crisis on their own, and resolve it without any involvement from Celestia whatsoever. And with her not serving as the mission-giver, she has no other reason to appear in the episode. 

 

Like I said, this would be a first for her, as up to this point, the premieres and finales have been the only times when she has been guaranteed to make an appearance. And yet here I am, under the impression that she's going to be sitting this next one out. If that's the case, then I have to ask a serious, legitimate question: What's left for her? 

 

Keep in mind, Celestia only appeared in five episodes in season 4: Princess Twilight Sparkle, Equestria Games, and Twilight's Kingdom. Prior to season 4, her longest absence in the show occurred in season 2, and was 11 episodes long: between Sweet and Elite and It's About Time, not counting her flashback appearance in Family Appreciation Day. In season 4, that absence nearly doubled in length and she went a staggering 21 episodes without making so much as a cameo. 

 

This leads me to believe that when it comes to the normal slice-of-life episodes, Celestia pretty much has no further purpose in the show (hell she didn't even utter a single line in Equestria Games). So with those ruled out, that pretty much leaves just the tension-filled premieres and finales, and as soon as she stops appearing in those, that's it for her. 

 

She has nothing left. 

 

She has no purpose. 

 

Her role in the show, which has gradually diminished with each passing season, has now become virtually non-existent. 

 

The writers simply have no reason to keep her around anymore. And hell, Luna is quickly facing the same problem, but if Apple Bloom ends up having her own episode in season 5 where Luna appears as her moral guide in a dream, that gives her at least one more purpose. Unfortunately, that's probably more than can be said for Celestia at this point...

 

In terms of her place in the story itself, she is the ruler of Equestria and deals with the things going on in Equestria. Granted the IDW comics do a much better job explaining WHAT she does while she is "off screen" but basically she has a lot more on her plate than just dealing with Twilight. 

 

In terms of the show and her role as a character...I wouldn't be so harsh about it but I kinda see your point. I wish they would delve into her and her sisters jobs and lives like they did in the comics, it would flesh them out so much more in the show if they did and it would not make them seem so...obsolete. 

[Spartan 433]

How I see it is that Celestia will now be a source of information for Twilight. But i would LOVE to see a prank war of sorts with Celestia, Luna, Cadance and Twilight.. maybe even Raindow Dash joins in or starts it all xD

 

But I figure shes not totally useless, just not as helpful now that Twilight doesn't need to be told what to do

[Deae Rising Shine~ 55,485]

Celestia's death soon COMFIRMED! Nah, kidding ... our?

 

But yeah, she seems to have less appearence then once ago. Mayby something big is gonna happen in season 5 with her?

[sweetolebob18 728]

I agree w Cleverclover as to Celestia's fading away.  However, I think hope Luna's role in For Whom the Sweetie Bell Toils is a harbinger of more active things to come in Season 5.  There is a promised episode where she fights a nightmare & I'm hoping she'll get an episode in Apple Bloom's dream.

 

As to "more Celestia" I think it's more a case of subplot overload from too many characters.

[ShadOBabe 18,997]

Do you have some kind of vendetta against Celestia, Clover?

[Princess Oceangem 61]

I wouldn't mind not seeing her in the premier but I really want at least one episode that redeems her trolling. She's my favorite Princess but seriously Cadence got more development than her!  

[Mesme Rize 15,683]

I couldn't care less aslong as the episode entertains me, to be honest with you.

[ShadOBabe 18,997]

As long as she's raising the sun and running the kingdom, Celestia's doing exactly what she needs to do. And neither of those things need to be on screen. Someone has to take care of the politics and logistics when the kids are off adventuring.

 

I'd love an episode devoted to her, but that can come at any time as far as I'm concerned.

It's not like she's going anywhere. Her and her sister are staying put.

[Cleverclover 1,526]

 

 

I do agree to an extent that she's mostly served her purpose, other than, well, her daily duty, but I think that, and I've said this countless times, after 1000 years by yourself, anybody would get tired and want a big long rest. And would also make them not think straight. Not even Celestia is exempt from this.

 

If this is supposed to excuse Celestia's crappy decision-making in Twilight's Kingdom, it doesn't. If she truly needs a rest, then someone else should be ruling the country while she takes it. To me, once the decisions you make no longer protect your subjects, but instead endanger them, that's when you've lost all right to be a ruler, no matter how long you've been at it or how many victories you've celebrated. 

 

Do you have some kind of vendetta against Celestia, Clover?

 

Not particularly. I actually used to like her. I just hate how far she's fallen since she failed to stop Chrysalis in A Canterlot Wedding. And after Twilight's Kingdom, I'm fully under the impression that Equestria is in need of a new ruler. 

 

Basically, as Twilight has gone up, Celestia has gone down. Twilight no longer needs her as a mentor. She no longer needs her as a teacher. And now she no longer needs her as a mission-giver. She's useless to Twilight, and thus useless to the show. 

[Celli 4,338]

If this is supposed to excuse Celestia's crappy decision-making in Twilight's Kingdom, it doesn't. If she truly needs a rest, then someone else should be ruling the country while she takes it. To me, once the decisions you make no longer protect your subjects, but instead endanger them, that's when you've lost all right to be a ruler, no matter how long you've been at it or how many victories you've celebrated.

 

 

Not particularly. I actually used to like her. I just hate how far she's fallen since she failed to stop Chrysalis in A Canterlot Wedding. And after Twilight's Kingdom, I'm fully under the impression that Equestria is in need of a new ruler.

 

Basically, as Twilight has gone up, Celestia has gone down. Twilight no longer needs her as a mentor. She no longer needs her as a teacher. And now she no longer needs her as a mission-giver. She's useless to Twilight, and thus useless to the show.

I'm sorry,but that is a very short-sighted way of looking at it.

[ThatOneComrade 1,091]

Ah, well that's too bad. I liked Celestia.

At least I'll see her in the theme song.

[ShadOBabe 18,997]

Basically, as Twilight has gone up, Celestia has gone down. Twilight no longer needs her as a mentor. She no longer needs her as a teacher. And now she no longer needs her as a mission-giver. She's useless to Twilight, and thus useless to the show. 

 

This assumes that the show is ONLY about Twilight. Which it isn't.

It's about her and her friends and the people close to her. FRIENDSHIP is magic.

And Celestia fits that bill.

 

Also, a character isn't deemed useful or not by whether they are necessary or not.

If they have potential for good stories, then they are useful. Celestia, and TONS of other minor characters, have a crap ton of potential, even if they aren't "necessary" to the show's continuation. And Celestia especially has a place in the lore and workings of the universe. Like I said above, I'd love an episode in which she plays a huge part, but as long as she's raising the sun and making sure Equestrian infrastructure is running, then she's doing exactly what she needs to do. The kids can go off and have all the adventures.

 

Though I'm sure Tia would like the writers to break up the monotony and stick her in an adventure.

You can only take so much paperwork, and Tia's immortal.

Edited February 14, 2015 by ShadOBabe

[Critical Mass 178]

Well if that were to happen then the role of ruler of equestria would go to either luna or cadence, however if all the princesses were to "have an accident" and disappear either equestria would be enforced by the royal guard, turn to anarchy like in fallout equestria, or just be like a democratic government which may lead to some corruptions. Now for the royal guard part that means that at least Shining Armor would take control until the princesses come back or if Equestria get's conquered by anyone I guess ,but this may lead to also recruiting more guards this is monarchy after all.

 

Enjoy hoof camp.

[Fluttershutter 2,471]

Well you hear her voice in the preview at least so she's probably in it.

[LZRD WZRD 1,929]

So if a character isn't needlessly shoehorned into an episode, they're automatically useless? I don't get it

 

And wasn't that Celestia's voice in the trailer? I assume that's dialogue from the actual episode

[ShadOBabe 18,997]

Here's a couple of other examples.

 

Lets use characters like Gilda and Lightning Dust.

These characters have absolutely ZERO personal connection to Twilight.

But that doesn't matter. They have a connection to Rainbow Dash and have potential for good stories.

Therefore they are not "useless".

 

And then on the other side of the scale are, say, Twilight's parents.

They have zero characterization and no real potential for stories since we have no information about them.

But they are not useless to Twilight. They're her PARENTS. They're the people that raised her and love her and got her into Celestia's academy.

 

So your "useless to Twilight = useless in the show" doesn't really hold up.

Twilight might not need Celestia to hold her hoof anymore, but she's still Twilight's friend and the pony that mentored her for most of her life.

Twilight would not EVER deem her useless.

Edited February 14, 2015 by ShadOBabe

[Dulset Tarn 441]

@@ShadOBabe

Do you actually have anything at all to say about the Celestia situation?

[Commissar Alexer 763]

So what?

Neither will probably Luna and Cadance appear too. That doesn't mean they will cease to exist from the show.

 

They will keep sunbutt if only for the toys.

[Felix 1,363]

I doubt she's not. She's been in every one since the first. But if she really isn't...it'd be admittedly out of the ordinary that's for sure.

[ShadOBabe 18,997]

@@ShadOBabe

Do you actually have anything at all to say about the Celestia situation?

 

What situation exactly?

 

That she can't swoop in and save the day because she's not a main character and the Mane Six are required to?

That she got creamed by a changeling (while Luna, I guess, SLEPT through it all) that had been building up power by siphoning off the love of her nephew in law for an unknown period of time?

That her "bad" (read desperate) decisions in Twilight's Kingdom where questioned by NO ONE ELSE, thus if you think she's dumb, than so is everyone else involved (Luna, Cadence, Twilight, etc). That she said, "don't tell your friends about your new powers" and Twilight decided that also meant "don't tell them that Discord has turned on us".

 

I don't really see a "situation".

Celestia is a cool character with a lot of potential. But she's under utilized because she's the super powered motherly presence.

There's a reason "Superman stays out of Gotham". Celestia can't take care of everyone's problems for both in-universe and meta reasons.

 

They need to give her more attention like they do with Luna. It's really not hard, but I think they're either afraid to try or have too much to do with the Mane Six, plus the CMC, and Spike. But I don't really mind if it takes a long time for them to get to it.

Even if they don't get to it, the fans will take care of it.

 

The OP argues that she's useless to the show because she's not useful to Twilight.

And if you read the other posts I've made here, I argue that neither of these things are true.

Edited February 14, 2015 by ShadOBabe