Deleted Topic

[Ganondox 899]

So recently I made a satirical thread about Stellar Eclipse in response to what I found to toxic attitudes which are apparently somewhat widespread and popular in this forum (and others) regarding disability (as well as LGBT) headcanons. After all, satire is powerful means to make a point, especially after I found a direct approach failed. The topic got deleted only a couple minutes after posting, though it explicitly no rules, probably either being seen as trolling or as a low quality post (which I think its the most likely because it got deleted without notice). Now, if it was taken at face value, the topic would have *extremely* offensive, but it was satire. There is also a fine but very real line between satire and trolling. Regarding the quality, the topic name was intentionally low quality, but the contents were of significant quality to get a bro-hoof in it's short life span. 

 

So I agree the topic may very well have been in appropriate for the board/forum. If so, were would be the appropriate place for such content? It does have value. Second, there are technical aspects of deleted topics which are annoying. First, the topic remains in the recently commented on topics list on the main page, even though it is inaccessible. Second, the deleted page says "You do not have permission to view this topic." I realize this is a technical aspect of how deleted threads are dealt with on an administrative level and it's because I'm not part of the correct userspace, but it comes across as rather silly because I created the topic, I should have permission to access it's contents. It would also be nice to be able to access it's contents so I could copy it to a more appropriate location like a blog or something. 

Edited March 19, 2017 by Ganondox

[Jeric 46,851]

Yeah. I see it in my notifications. Muscular entropy isn't a thing. G71.0 is the medical code for muscular dystrophy. Not sure if you meant that.

 

So you are right. Stellar Eclipse does not have muscular entropy.

[Ganondox 899]

Yeah. I see it in my notifications. Muscular entropy isn't a thing. G71.0 is the medical code for muscular dystrophy. Not sure if you meant that.

 

So you are right. Stellar Eclipse does not have muscular entropy.

 

I misspelled it on purpose to emphasize it was not a serious thread. The actual term atrophy, specifically spinal muscular atrophy type III as that's what the kid has. 

Edited March 19, 2017 by Ganondox

[Jeric 46,851]

Ah.

 

Sounds like the staff hid it so maybe Ask them why? Also, toxicity is not really an issue here compared to other forums. It is rather tame.

 

He has Kugelberg–Welander's yes. That would definitely be more accurate.

[Ganondox 899]

Ah.

 

Sounds like the staff hid it so maybe Ask them why? Also, toxicity is not really an issue here compared to other forums. It is rather tame.

 

He has Kugelberg–Welander's yes. That would definitely be more accurate.

It's not an issue of general toxicity, just toxicity regarding this specific subject. And you're right, it's much worse in other forums. 

 

I study psychology, not medicine, so I could care less about the exact condition. 

[Jeric 46,851]

It's not an issue of general toxicity, just toxicity regarding this specific subject. And you're right, it's much worse in other forums.

 

I study psychology, not medicine, so I could care less about the exact condition.

I would suggest that the halo effect may be applicable here then. Actually, it may be sharply pronounced on the internet since we are absent many other communication cues. The interesting thing about satire is that while some authors seemingly try to subvert the halo effect, they do so prematurely. Take a look at Sam Clemens early work when he was not widely known as a satirist, and compare to his later work when the name Mark Twain conjured thoughts of a whimsical humorist. Even in his detractors they understood what they were about to walk into when they read a new essay or piece.

 

Modern internet satirists who still haven't found self-control tend to start balls-to-the-wall, tossing out subtlety in favor of jarring, helping to invoke the halo effect. This causes diminished returns on understanding the purpose of the rhetoric, and undermines the message.

 

Pehaps therein lies the difference between great satirical commentary, and a piece that from go invokes thoughts that don't favor the author's purpose and desired effect.

 

It's a hard craft to master, that's for sure. Consider your audience, and massage your message to better work within it, including your titles to come up with. On a forum a topic title is the first thing that will tend to invoke the halo effect (outside history of the author).

[Ganondox 899]

I would suggest that the halo effect may be applicable here then. Actually, it may be sharply pronounced on the internet since we are absent many other communication cues. The interesting thing about satire is that while some authors seemingly try to subvert the halo effect, they do so prematurely. Take a look at Sam Clemens early work when he was not widely known as a satirist, and compare to his later work when the name Mark Twain conjured thoughts of a whimsical humorist. Even in his detractors they understood what they were about to walk into when they read a new essay or piece.

 

Modern internet satirists who still haven't found self-control tend to start balls-to-the-wall, tossing out subtlety in favor of jarring, helping to invoke the halo effect. This causes diminished returns on understanding the purpose of the rhetoric, and undermines the message.

 

Pehaps therein lies the difference between great satirical commentary, and a piece that from go invokes thoughts that don't favor the author's purpose and desired effect.

 

It's a hard craft to master, that's for sure. Consider your audience, and massage your message to better work within it, including your titles to come up with. On a forum a topic title is the first thing that will tend to invoke the halo effect (outside history of the author).

Makes since, just wondering if you actually saw any of the actual post?

[Yellow Diamond 7,569]

@Ganondox, since I was the one who removed your topic, I'll explain my reasoning.

 

The topic you made was essentially a low-quality troll post There's an adage known as Poe's law which stipulates that a parody of an extreme viewpoint may become indistinguishable from the real thing. At no point did you bother to qualify the thread as a commentary on whatever it was you sought to critique; as such, members were bound to be confused and assume you were being serious. Ultimately, that means mods have to come around to actively monitor the topic or close it outright. In short, it's a waste of everyone's time and demonstrates little meaningful commentary.

 

As Jeric has said, good political and social satire are hard to master. Someone like Stephen Colbert makes it look easy -- but he and other masters of the craft have years of training, experience, reputation, and a visual medium to cue the audience to the joke. A text post without context and that mishandles even basic information comes across as an attempt to get everyone's hackles up. MLP Forums isn't the place for that sort of discourse.

 

The inability for a topic's creator to access their topic when it's removed is in part a technical limitation. However, the denial of access also serves a practical purpose in preventing that person from monkeying around with the topic while moderators discuss how best to handle it. In this respect, then, the limitation is intentional and helpful for our purposes. More strictly speaking, what you post here isn't solely yours. Your content is subject to forum rules. You normally have a lot of latitude, but what gets posted/removed ultimately rests with the staff's discretion.

[Ganondox 899]

@Ganondox, since I was the one who removed your topic, I'll explain my reasoning.

 

The topic you made was essentially a low-quality troll post There's an adage known as Poe's law which stipulates that a parody of an extreme viewpoint may become indistinguishable from the real thing. At no point did you bother to qualify the thread as a commentary on whatever it was you sought to critique; as such, members were bound to be confused and assume you were being serious. Ultimately, that means mods have to come around to actively monitor the topic or close it outright. In short, it's a waste of everyone's time and demonstrates little meaningful commentary.

 

As Jeric has said, good political and social satire are hard to master. Someone like Stephen Colbert makes it look easy -- but he and other masters of the craft have years of training, experience, reputation, and a visual medium to cue the audience to the joke. A text post without context and that mishandles even basic information comes across as an attempt to get everyone's hackles up. MLP Forums isn't the place for that sort of discourse.

 

The inability for a topic's creator to access their topic when it's removed is in part a technical limitation. However, the denial of access also serves a practical purpose in preventing that person from monkeying around with the topic while moderators discuss how best to handle it. In this respect, then, the limitation is intentional and helpful for our purposes. More strictly speaking, what you post here isn't solely yours. Your content is subject to forum rules. You normally have a lot of latitude, but what gets posted/removed ultimately rests with the staff's discretion.

 

Understood (though my plan was to clarify the purpose once someone took it the wrong way, I was thinking I could incorporate it directly into the original post, but that would diminish it's effect). So what about the fact the topic still appears in the recent topics list even after being removed? Is there a technical reason for that, or is it just an undersight? 

Edited March 19, 2017 by Ganondox

[Yellow Diamond 7,569]

Understood. So what about the fact the topic still appears in the recent topics list even after being removed? Is there a technical reason for that, or is it just an undersight? 

 

To the best of my knowledge, that's a technical issue. There's a similar problem with removed status updates which appear in content searches. Bear in mind that we don't delete topics but instead hide them. Deleting topics wholesale leaves us without a record and can create gaps in our database.

 

Basically, it's yet another limitation of IP Board.

[Ganondox 899]

To the best of my knowledge, that's a technical issue. There's a similar problem with removed status updates which appear in content searches. Bear in mind that we don't delete topics but instead hide them. Deleting topics wholesale leaves us without a record and can create gaps in our database.

 

Basically, it's yet another limitation of IP Board.

 

Got it. I've done some administrative work in the past, so I understand how that works.