general How do you feel about anti vaxxers?

[Feather Data 131]

How do you feel about anti vaxxers?

[The Recherche 29,969]

I'll keep this as short as possible:

I understand that some folks would be skeptical of certain ones they might find questionable, but past a certain point, it just becomes outright irrational.

So, yes; I support vaccination, but skepticism is not necessarily bad until they go into outright denial and delusions.

[A French Derpy full of Salt 404]

Let's see their point of view, letting doctors putting some kind of stuff in your child to protect of something you never see it. Is that normal?

From me, I'll always take the vaccinations. I'll just see if it's really a doctor and a tested vaccine (paranoia).

[Feather Data 131]

Honestly, antivaxxers refuse to trust their doctors, and claim "Vaccines do nothing, only healthy immune systems do!"

Immune systems need to learn how to fight the infection first, which is where the vaccines come into play.

Sadly, there is an antivax group trying to spread their ignorance to other parents https://www.stopmandatoryvaccination.com

 

Please do not fall for their BS!

Edited April 17, 2018 by Feather Data

[ShadOBabe 19,011]

I support vaccines. And so does my mom. But we don't support pumping a bunch of them into a small child at once.

Because when I was a toddler, I went to get some shots. And they apparently gave me a bunch. That day I got a spiked fever, had a seizure, and stopped breathing. My grandfather had to give me mouth to mouth while they waited for the ambulance. As you can see, I'm not dead, but trust was lost that day.

[Feather Data 131]

Just now, ShadOBabe said:

I support vaccines. And so does my mom. But we don't support pumping a bunch of them into a small child at once.

Because when I was a toddler, I went to get some shots. And they apparently gave me a bunch. That day I got a spiked fever, had a seizure, and stopped breathing. My grandfather had to give me mouth to mouth while they waited for the ambulance. As you can see, I'm not dead, but trust was lost that day.

Sadly, many anti-vaxxers cherrypick such a scenario like yours as a way to prove that vaccines, even one can cause harm.

[ShadOBabe 19,011]

1 minute ago, Feather Data said:

Sadly, many anti-vaxxers cherrypick such a scenario like yours as a way to prove that vaccines, even one can cause harm.

Indeed. Vaccines are a perfectly sound medical practice.

But maybe when putting them in a baby, do just one or two, wait a couple days, and then a couple more.

[Feather Data 131]

Just now, ShadOBabe said:

Indeed. Vaccines are a perfectly sound medical practice.

But maybe when putting them in a baby, do just one or two, wait a couple days, and then a couple more.

Yea, putting too many vaccines at once is not very safe. But do not blame vaccines for almost killing your kid when you should plan each vaccination on separate days! 

This will cause the ingredients in vaccines to reach harmful levels if done too close together

[ShadOBabe 19,011]

1 minute ago, Feather Data said:

Yea, putting too many vaccines at once is not very safe. But do not blame vaccines for almost killing your kid when you should plan each vaccination on separate days! 

This will cause the ingredients in vaccines to reach harmful levels if done too close together

See the thing is though, the DOCTORS should have known better. That is what they go to school for, yes?

Edited April 17, 2018 by ShadOBabe

[Feather Data 131]

2 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

See the thing is though, the DOCTORS should have known better. That is what they go to school for, yes?

Yes. And I feel anti vaxxers will also use this to 'prove' doctors have no idea what they are doing, and are 'stealing your money'

[ShadOBabe 19,011]

Just now, Feather Data said:

Yes. And I feel anti vaxxers will also use this to 'prove' doctors have no idea what they are doing, and are 'stealing your money'

Well quacks DO exist unfortunately.

And yes, my mom was concerned about the amount of shots they gave me, but the educated doctors are like, "Naaaaaaaah, she'll be fiiiiiine..."

Cue suffocating ShadOBaby...

Vaccines have saved countless lives. But it is totally okay to not trust your doctor as the final word on everything. Getting multiple opinions, and sometimes calling your own shots on what is best for you personally, is very sound.

[Feather Data 131]

1 minute ago, ShadOBabe said:

Well quacks DO exist unfortunately.

And yes, my mom was concerned about the amount of shots they gave me, but the educated doctors are like, "Naaaaaaaah, she'll be fiiiiiine..."

Cue suffocating ShadOBaby...

Vaccines have saved countless lives. But it is totally okay to not trust your doctor as the final word on everything. Getting multiple opinions, and sometimes calling your own shots on what is best for you personally, is very sound.

But don't get your opinions from people who deny vaccines, they are insane

[Victoria Sponge 1,017]

I think they're selfish and cruel, they'd rather their kid get horrible diseases instead of preventing them with a mythical risk of autism, which isn't that bad even if it were true, it's certainly better than polio etc.

Edited April 17, 2018 by Victoria Sponge

[Feather Data 131]

Okay, I have not said it clearly here yet, but anti-vaxxers really make me mad!

 

So angry! They deny the science of vaccination, because of autism (which unfortunately has turned into a buzzword thanks to these assholes, and this is coming from someone with autism)

Instead they say "My kid has a healthy immune system!"

A healthy immune system THAT DOES NOT KNOW HOW TO FIGHT MEASLES!

Another excuse they say " Vaccines have chemicals in them."

JUST LIKE EVERYTHING YOU USE IS MADE OF CHEMICALS, YOU ASSHAT!

URGH, I have so much to say about these antivaxxers, but I want to hear more from you guys

[SharpWit 2,708]

I had many coworkers who didn't get their flu vaccines this past year. One of them I think just had a weak immune system or something because although it's often expected to feel some mild nausea while you're building antibodies, he would feel too sick to work. It might not have been as bad as the flu but he figured if he wasn't going to be able to work might as well take the risk. Another coworker has an allergy to one of the components used in the vaccines so for them it was either deal with the flu or be hospitalized I beleive. Finally, and I could very well be wrong about this, but I think last years flu vaccine covered only one of three major variants and was under 40% effective for the variant it did cover, resulting in about a 10% effectiveness, making it seem almost pointless in getting the vaccine, so many other coworkers didn't get it. I and two other coworkers went and got ours together since we were more likely to catch the flu or spread it to children as we had more interaction with them.

When it comes to medical issues, we have to treat everyone individually. We're all people, but we have different bodies with different reactions to the same substances. This isn't something to be overlooked for the sake of speeding things along and getting it all over with.

[ShadOBabe 19,011]

18 minutes ago, Feather Data said:

But don't get your opinions from people who deny vaccines, they are insane

Not insane, just very, very distrusting and not researched.

Too much distrust is bad for you, but I also have a hard time blaming those who are. They're usually people have been hurt a lot, and refuse to take the chance it'll happen again. Though yeah, I'd never take their medical advice.

15 minutes ago, Victoria Sponge said:

I think they're selfish and cruel, they'd rather their kid get horrible diseases instead of preventing them with a mythical risk of autism, which isn't that bad even if it were true, it's certainly better than polio etc.

I have not be able to find a good medical source about febrile seizures and positive or negative connection to autism. But I would not be shocked if in the future they're like, "Yeah, that high fever and lack of oxygen is partially responsible." I had a bunch of shots, got terribly sick, had a seizure and stopped breathing, and I AM on the autism spectrum.

I acknowledge it could all just be a terrible coincidence though.

That said, you're right about the fact it's not that bad. Not bad at all actually. Autism hasn't made my life any less special than anyone else's. I'm straight up proud of it on occasion. XD

Edited April 17, 2018 by ShadOBabe

[Feather Data 131]

2 minutes ago, SharpWit said:

I had many coworkers who didn't get their flu vaccines this past year. One of them I think just had a weak immune system or something because although it's often expected to feel some mild nausea while you're building antibodies, he would feel too sick to work. It might not have been as bad as the flu but he figured if he wasn't going to be able to work might as well take the risk. Another coworker has an allergy to one of the components used in the vaccines so for them it was either deal with the flu or be hospitalized I beleive. Finally, and I could very well be wrong about this, but I think last years flu vaccine covered only one of three major variants and was under 40% effective for the variant it did cover, resulting in about a 10% effectiveness, making it seem almost pointless in getting the vaccine, so many other coworkers didn't get it. I and two other coworkers went and got ours together since we were more likely to catch the flu or spread it to children as we had more interaction with them.

When it comes to medical issues, we have to treat everyone individually. We're all people, but we have different bodies with different reactions to the same substances. This isn't something to be overlooked for the sake of speeding things along and getting it all over with.

I guess I could understand why some people would be against the flu shot.

Even though it does not prevent the flu, due to mutating strains, the vaccine can inhibit, aka reduce your severity.

Honestly, that does not even compare to actual antivaxxers, who are against all vaccines, whether it be for measles, polio, whatever. They would rather not eradicate these infections, but plague them onto other people. Unacceptable!

14 minutes ago, Victoria Sponge said:

I think they're selfish and cruel, they'd rather their kid get horrible diseases instead of preventing them with a mythical risk of autism, which isn't that bad even if it were true, it's certainly better than polio etc.

Urgh, probably because they do not believe in eradication of diseases like smallpox, despite it being eliminated in the late 70's.

And sadly, some nut named Larry Cook is trying to put a stop to mandatory vaccination, which has been put into law in some states in the US

PROBABLY BECAUSE OF MEASLES OUTBREAKS THAT HAVE BEEN CAUSED DUE TO UNVACCINATED CHILDREN! Just saying.

Now more states,  maybe even more countries are getting into this, which I understand why some people may not like it, well, blame the antivaxxers. Also, there is literally no reason not to vaccinate your kids! PLEASE GET THEM VACCINATED!

[Steve Piranha 29,432]

I hate them. They live in a delusion that their ignorance is worth more than a doctor's that studied years in the field, and they risk others by spreading diseases they refused to vaccinate

[Feather Data 131]

6 minutes ago, Steve Piranha said:

I hate them. They live in a delusion that their ignorance is worth more than a doctor's that studied years in the field, and they risk others by spreading diseases they refused to vaccinate

Couldn't agree with you more!

By the way. that site I referred to , the antivax site?

 

They actually AIRED COMMERCIALS TO STOP PARENTS FROM VACCINATING!

What is that? You don't believe me?

Well, look here 

 

[Nyactis Mewcis Catlum 672]

Anti-vaccination is a very dangerous stance to take, not just for yourself but for the people around you. It's not a harmless difference of opinion.

There was an outbreak three years ago in Disney Land, California for measles. There have been other outbreaks, of course, but I'm going to focus on this one specifically because it's one I've got information for.

Among the 110 California patients, 49 (45%) were unvaccinated; five (5%) had 1 dose of measles-containing vaccine, seven (6%) had 2 doses, one (1%) had 3 doses, 47 (43%) had unknown or undocumented vaccination status, and one (1%) had immunoglobulin G seropositivity documented, which indicates prior vaccination or measles infection at an undetermined time. Twelve of the unvaccinated patients were infants too young to be vaccinated. Among the 37 remaining vaccine-eligible patients, 28 (67%) were intentionally unvaccinated because of personal beliefs, and one was on an alternative plan for vaccination. Among the 28 intentionally unvaccinated patients, 18 were children (aged <18 years), and 10 were adults. Patients range in age from 6 weeks to 70 years; the median age is 22 years. Among the 84 patients with known hospitalization status, 17 (20%) were hospitalized. 

From, here.

28 of these people were intentionally unvaccinated because of "personal beliefs". Most of them were children. Many illnesses are far deadlier in children than they are in adults. Others still were either unable to get vaccinated, or had unknown vaccination history.

People choosing not to get vaccinated raises the risk for everyone to get the disease. This is because of herd immunity; when a high amount of the population is protected against a disease, it can't find as many hosts to travel through and infect, and thus makes the possibility of an outbreak far less likely. It is because of herd immunity that we have seen the eradication of certain diseases, and why we thought some were gone from the U.S. entirely until recently (e.g. measles). This is why we will have vaccines even for illnesses we haven't seen in a while here, to prevent the illness from coming back. By refusing to immunize themselves, anti-vaxxers are preventing herd immunity from being as effective. This disproportionately affects those who have their immune system compromised in some way (age, AIDS, immunosuppressants, etc.), and of course it's a bad habit that parents pass onto their children. This spread of misinformation may also turn off other people, which reduces our herd immunity further and further... And which leads to incidents like the measles outbreak. It's widely agreed that a good majority of the reason these outbreaks are happening is because of anti-vaxxers refusing to vaccinate themselves or their kids.

Anti-vaxxers like to spread horrible misinformation about how vaccines work. They will claim that vaccines are toxic, that vaccines have killed people (there have been deaths and injury related to vaccines, but I will get to that in a minute), that the "Big Pharma" is forcing them on us in order to make them more money, and of course the widely spread idea that it causes autism (and this is my rebuttal to that ridiculousness). There's even the smart enough to be dangerous type, who don't deny their effectiveness but tell you that the illnesses aren't here so there's no point in getting vaccines for them with the "risk" of vaccines, or tell you that vaccines are not 100% effective (which is true) so you shouldn't get them at all.

For one thing, vaccines are not toxic. They contain some chemicals that, at high dosages, would be toxic to the human body (and one of them was even completely done away with in vaccines years ago). You know what also is toxic to the body at high dosages? Water. Not kidding. That's how a lot of materials work. The ones that are in vaccines are perfectly harmless, save for aluminum which is there to purposely trigger the immune response in the body, but even then it's not a high enough dosage to cause any more than your typical inflammation you'd get if you caught the illness anyway. Give it a good sleep, you'll basically sleep it off. It's no lasting harm, and you'd probably suffer more from getting a common cold.

For another thing, yes, vaccines have killed people...as a result of an allergic reaction, and at far less a rate than the actual illness that the vaccines are supposed to be aiding in preventing. Nothing within the vaccine is harmful to a vast majority of the population, and those who do react to it (I'm one of them, by the way) usually only suffer from milder symptoms, such as a mild fever or some fatigue, again, quick sleeping it off and it's all good. It's extremely, incredibly rare for it to do any worse than that. If it does, it's usually either due to 1) poor sanitization of the needle, which is not the vaccine's fault, 2) overdosage when an immune system is weak (ShadOBabe's case), or 3) a very severe allergic reaction which is so rare... You're more likely to die on your way to the hospital or the clinic than you are from the vaccine itself. There is nothing in life that is without risk. Even taking a shower can be risky if you slip and fall. That's just the nature of the beast. Vaccines reduce the risks, not add to them.

The "Big Pharma" thing is tin foil hat nonsense that I don't feel obligated to say anything about, but if you're really curious, look up how much vaccines actually pay out, and then after that look at how much typical treatments for illnesses that vaccines prevent pays out for pharmaceutical companies. Generally speaking, vaccines don't make as much for them as the medications used to treat the illnesses after they have infected people.

 

Another personal beef with anti-vaxxers is that they're generally extremely prejudiced against autistic people. You know that "damaged, broken" mantra? Anti-vaxxers are the ones who say it the loudest. I'm not damaged, I'm not broken. I'm just different. And a lot of illnesses that vaccines prevent would damage me far more than autism ever had - you know, if they wouldn't kill me outright.

 

There's no reason to be anti-vaccination. Being cautious about your doctors, certainly. Feel free to ask them about what's in a vaccine, how many vaccines you can take at a time before it becomes unsafe, etc. They won't just answer these questions, they're legally mandated to. If they don't, or if a doctor puts you in danger through misinformation, you can get them in trouble for malpractice. You should ask them about any medication they prescribe you, not just vaccinations; it's good to know what you're taking and why you're taking it. But anti-vaccination in general is a poor stance.

 

EDIT: For those who are skeptical about water intoxication, there's actually been a death related to it that happened a few years ago. It's a helluva lot of water, but my point is that anything can kill you at high dosages. The dose makes the toxin.

[ShadOBabe 19,011]

Hot damn, @Scootaloved, very nice post!

[Feather Data 131]

Wow, that was a long post.

[Nyactis Mewcis Catlum 672]

6 minutes ago, ShadOBabe said:

Hot damn, @Scootaloved, very nice post!

 

1 minute ago, Feather Data said:

Wow, that was a long post.

It's something I feel pretty passionately about, if that wasn't evident. 

[Feather Data 131]

8 minutes ago, Scootaloved said:

 

It's something I feel pretty passionately about, if that wasn't evident. 

Care to take it out on this guy? He is a doctor of naturopathy.

 

 

EDIT: Wow, it took me a few tries to get the video on here

Edited April 17, 2018 by Feather Data

[Ganondorf8 11,370]

I'm okay with vaccinations seeing as I've been getting them for as long as I can remember.