S04:E07 - Bats!

[H.P.Lovecolt24 107]

I cannot believe that there are actually people who think that Fluttershy's fang is a permanant change, it is clearly just a little nod towards horror movie endings. Fluttershy was cured of her vampirism... OR WAS SHE!? It is a littlle gag, nothing more and it certainly will not appear in future episodes.

I think we all know that but she's just soooooooo adorable with fangs! Can you really blame us for hoping agest hope that she keeps thous cute fangs

[DragonKing235 198]

Man frist it was flutter hulk now flutter bat what next lol anyway awesome episode.

[Quill 10]

Just what is so scary about bats? They are so adorable! They get rid of pesky mosquitoes.

Depends on the bat. You can like them all you want but you don't like bats flapping their wings in your face. It's like a bee or wasp.

Also bats can bite so that's a painful experience.

[Pixel Stick 927]

Depends on the bat. You can like them all you want but you don't like bats flapping their wings in your face. It's like a bee or wasp.

Also bats can bite so that's a painful experience.

 

Just like with most other animals, bats tend not to bite people unless (1) they're rabid, or (2) they're being threatened.

 

As for whether they're cute or not, beauty (and cuteness) is in the eye of the beholder.  I find most bats to be adorable, myself.

Edited December 31, 2013 by Pixel Stick

[DiscordAnarchy 770]

Just a thought to those who say "Oh, Twi screwed up another spell!"

 

She never screwed up the spell. It worked - the bats stopped eating the apples. They didn't go beserk either and eat other things as the Parasprites did. As such, the spell clearly worked.

 

HOWEVER

 

What she didn't realize was how the spell could effect Flutter during the Stare. It has nothing to do with Twilight being a lousy spell caster but the fact that I doubt any unicorn has experience in dealing with magic during something that is similiar too The Stare hence the error was not in her inability to do magic but from unexpected circumstances.

[Cantankerous 106]

In terms of plot this was actually one of the show's more complicated, deep stories. It had really good characterization for Applejack and Fluttershy to boot. Not to mention it was really nice to see those two characters interacting as they've been kept largely separate before now. While I'm not sure I'd go quite as far as calling this a great episode I am liking it more the more I think about it and I've yet to see any compelling arguments against it. 

Edited December 31, 2013 by ByTheTides

[Oofer56 58]

Just what is so scary about bats? They are so adorable! They get rid of pesky mosquitoes.

Especially the Flutterbat xD

[Xon 2]

I feel that this episode kinda did have somewhat of an environmental message that's not in you're face (looking at you captain planet) as in applejack wanting to get rid of the vampire bats food source and home because they were consuming her apples even though without them the bats would not have food,  Overall I liked the episode it certainly did cover a subject I didn't quite expect to be covered and the part where they were searching through the orchids at night was my favourite 

[Neutrino 47]

In my opinion, I think they've stopped whipping the writers.

I enjoyed the episode but the end!!! Wtf happened?

[Anilewe 2,178]

I feel that this episode kinda did have somewhat of an environmental message that's not in you're face (looking at you captain planet) as in applejack wanting to get rid of the vampire bats food source and home because they were consuming her apples even though without them the bats would not have food,  Overall I liked the episode it certainly did cover a subject I didn't quite expect to be covered and the part where they were searching through the orchids at night was my favourite 

 

Why not? They're vampire fruit bats, not vampire apple bats. There's a lot of other fruits they could eat and I'm sure that there are some fruits in other parts of Equestria, in Everfree Forest for example  

[BronyMan 3]

I like the shaders/filters in the episode. It was the best part. DHX is having good creativity now.

[Metemponychosis 1,260]

Just a thought to those who say "Oh, Twi screwed up another spell!"

 

She never screwed up the spell. It worked - the bats stopped eating the apples. They didn't go beserk either and eat other things as the Parasprites did. As such, the spell clearly worked.

 

HOWEVER

 

What she didn't realize was how the spell could effect Flutter during the Stare. It has nothing to do with Twilight being a lousy spell caster but the fact that I doubt any unicorn has experience in dealing with magic during something that is similiar too The Stare hence the error was not in her inability to do magic but from unexpected circumstances.

Isn't Twilight supposed to know that stuff goes wrong? Specially with the way unicorn magic is treated like a science in Equestria?

What, did she miss the Magical Interactions class? Specially since it seems that everything is magic in Equestria.

[Dashabel 381]

Cree-pee!

 

I was so not expecting that! And that's a first, because I'm always on the ball with the episode synopsis, when a song is coming etc, but I've been away and not had internet so I didn't see that coming! The song was quite good — I had suspected the reference to the musical "Cats!"

[Dzastur 1,719]

I love the reference in this episode to Helen Lovejoy on The Simpsons:

 

[DiscordAnarchy 770]

Isn't Twilight supposed to know that stuff goes wrong? Specially with the way unicorn magic is treated like a science in Equestria?

What, did she miss the Magical Interactions class? Specially since it seems that everything is magic in Equestria.

 

Let me put it to you like this.

 

Let's say you are a programmer. You've studied code and you know how to use code and you know how it all works. You make a program and it doesn't work at first. so you take what didn't work and you make it work as time goes on.

 

Now, the program work beautifully as you test it. However while running the program one time, you have something else running in the background of your computer and suddenly the program doesn't work because it clashes with that other object. If the program wasn't running int he background, yours would be working.

 

You get what I mean? she KNOWS the spell works. It DID work. What she didn't expect was how it would backfire with The Stare. This is exactly how science works. When something works but is suddenly introduced to a foriegn variable, suddenly it won't work or it will work very differently.

 

Twilight made the spell work but she never expected The Stare to alter the spell like it did. You think tht while testing and learning magic, she uses EVERY SINGLE VARIABLE in existance to see if the spells will not act up? No one does that.

[Metemponychosis 1,260]

Let me put it to you like this.

 

Let's say you are a programmer. You've studied code and you know how to use code and you know how it all works. You make a program and it doesn't work at first. so you take what didn't work and you make it work as time goes on.

 

Now, the program work beautifully as you test it. However while running the program one time, you have something else running in the background of your computer and suddenly the program doesn't work because it clashes with that other object. If the program wasn't running int he background, yours would be working.

 

You get what I mean? she KNOWS the spell works. It DID work. What she didn't expect was how it would backfire with The Stare. This is exactly how science works. When something works but is suddenly introduced to a foriegn variable, suddenly it won't work or it will work very differently.

 

Twilight made the spell work but she never expected The Stare to alter the spell like it did. You think tht while testing and learning magic, she uses EVERY SINGLE VARIABLE in existance to see if the spells will not act up? No one does that.

We are in the same page here, but this assumes that of all the books Twilight has read, in all the things that she has learned, there has never been any similar occurrence. I bet there must be whole books about stuff like this: spells doing something unexpected because of other things happening in the area, since unicorns must have been studying magic even before Equestria.

 

I'm saying that in a decent book that teaches this spell, there must be a section about how this spell interacts with other "stuff", since this is apparently a possibility. For example: Caution: when used on parasprites this spell will cause them to eat everything else".

 

I mean, she assumed that Fluttershy's patented Stare would not interact with her magic (or didn't even think about it). You say that she can be excused because there has never been anything recorded about this or it's so rare and obscure that even if there is some mention about this it didn't come to Twilight's knowledge. I'm saying that she was irresponsible. Either because she didn't think that this could be a problem or because she didn't know that this could be a problem.

 

Or are you saying that magic is so random and wild that even though the unicorns study it, there is always a big chance things will wrong, even if the unicorn casting the spell took all care and was prepared to cast the spell? Also, is the Stare a magical ability?

[Scootalove 10,689]

I enjoyed the episode from beginning to end. I was really intrigued when they showed the Mane 5 turn against Fluttershy for the risk of allowing the bats to have the other half of the orchard but, the song was okay. Seeing Ingram use Danny Elfman's style to make the song was pure genius. I think the episode is worth watching, if you're into that kind of stuff.

[DiscordAnarchy 770]

We are in the same page here, but this assumes that of all the books Twilight has read, in all the things that she has learned, there has never been any similar occurrence. I bet there must be whole books about stuff like this: spells doing something unexpected because of other things happening in the area, since unicorns must have been studying magic even before Equestria.

 

I'm saying that in a decent book that teaches this spell, there must be a section about how this spell interacts with other "stuff", since this is apparently a possibility. For example: Caution: when used on parasprites this spell will cause them to eat everything else".

 

I mean, she assumed that Fluttershy's patented Stare would not interact with her magic (or didn't even think about it). You say that she can be excused because there has never been anything recorded about this or it's so rare and obscure that even if there is some mention about this it didn't come to Twilight's knowledge. I'm saying that she was irresponsible. Either because she didn't think that this could be a problem or because she didn't know that this could be a problem.

 

Or are you saying that magic is so random and wild that even though the unicorns study it, there is always a big chance things will wrong, even if the unicorn casting the spell took all care and was prepared to cast the spell? Also, is the Stare a magical ability?

 

 

Well that is assuming that the books she reads are strictly magic. I am sure she studies various subjects from History to Magic. Plus considering the fact she reads SO Much, I am not 100% sure she can retain every little bit of knowledge she runs across. We have seen from previous episodes that she does forget things so we know that she doesn't have a photographic memory. It only makes logical sense that if she has come across something like this or the knowledge that sometimes magic runs amuck, that she may not remember it right away OR that she doesn't think something as odd as The Stare would have adverse side effects.

 

It's like medicene. Doctors study countless of articles over and over and over but sometimes there comes a moment where a medication reacts abnormally because the person they gave it too has a very unique genetic structure, you know what I mean?

 

As for Magic as a whole - the ONLY character who has NEVER had an issue with magic is Discord. Every magical character has had some issue with their spells one way or another.

[Metemponychosis 1,260]

Well that is assuming that the books she reads are strictly magic. I am sure she studies various subjects from History to Magic. Plus considering the fact she reads SO Much, I am not 100% sure she can retain every little bit of knowledge she runs across. We have seen from previous episodes that she does forget things so we know that she doesn't have a photographic memory. It only makes logical sense that if she has come across something like this or the knowledge that sometimes magic runs amuck, that she may not remember it right away OR that she doesn't think something as odd as The Stare would have adverse side effects.

 

It's like medicene. Doctors study countless of articles over and over and over but sometimes there comes a moment where a medication reacts abnormally because the person they gave it too has a very unique genetic structure, you know what I mean?

 

As for Magic as a whole - the ONLY character who has NEVER had an issue with magic is Discord. Every magical character has had some issue with their spells one way or another.

Twilight had her books right at her hooves. If you recall, she got the idea and decided to go back to the library. She did review the literature. Of course, I can't expect Ponyville's library to have every book on the subject nor the unicorn's accumulated knowledge to mention something that specific or even to anticipate all sorts of side effects.

 

I was thinking with an analogy of drugs that alter the function of enzyme systems, like CYP450. We know that drugs that require enzymes of this system so that they are changed into their active forms will have reduced effect if the patient is making use of anything that messes with the function of these enzymes. Or worse, if the drug requires alteration from these enzymes to be excreted, and these enzymes are at a low efficiency, then the drug accumulates and adverse effects may make themselves more noticeable. You see, this is not some sort of "elite knowledge". Physicians are supposed to know this, and which drugs would be involved, or at least know enough to check the literature for these kinds of interactions.

 

So, should unicorns already have noticed and published literature evidencing that spells involving "the total attention of the subject" act over some component that is also acted upon by spells that "keep the subjects attention". This is why I totally bought Twilight's explanation of what went wrong, but also why I felt that she should know this before attempting the spell, since she understood the problem right away.

 

Maybe I just have been expecting too much of poor Twilight since her coronation. XD

 

Disclaimer because I know people will point this up: I know that the writers don't think stuff too thoroughly. This is a friendly discussion about stuff that happens in the show. Remember: I love this episode. And Twilight.

[Snake Eater 4]

This may be a biased review because it was heavily focused on Fluttershy, my favorite, but what the hay! Let's do it!

 

The writing was good, the characterization was great, the jokes were funny, the song was memorable and set up the mood for the conflict of the episode, the song was also catchy, the pacing was impecable, the idea for Flutterbat was awesome. I mean, I can't find one thing wrong with this episode, except for Rainbow Dash constatly reminding us that she loves cider and the fact that the ponies didn't trust Fluttershy more than she deserved, I mean, she was the one who reformed the Discord, the Spirit of Chaos! Have some faith in her! But overall, what a great episode! That's why this show is awesome!! Also, "Fruit bat round up, fruit bat round up!" Haahaha, oh Pinkie. You always make me laugh.

 

9.5/10 it was near perfect.

 

Did anyone catch the Batman references?

[packmule1123 55]

I absolutely loved this episode!  It was really good. I especially loved the song. I thought it had a good feel to it.  And pinkie pie's song...haha...that was epic 

[Music Chart Fan 819]

My point is, in a magical world, you should expect magical things to happen. Transforming into a bat pony is a magical thing. I don't say we should just accept that anything goes, but in exactly what way is the transformation itself inconsistent with the show's logic? Given what we've seen, how is this a contradiction of anything?

 

Note that I said I think it's difficult to explain events that happen in the show in real-world terms.  That's what I was getting at.  I'm not saying we should just accept everything that happens - the show wouldn't be good if the only way to enjoy it was by suspending ALL disbelief.  What I meant was that I don't think you can explain things like Fluttershy's transformation in terms of any real-world mechanisms.  To say it's a magical side-effect is a universe-consistent statement.  To say it happened by altering her DNA is speculation at best, and IMO tries to impart too much complexity to the situation.

 

You said you believe the world should be internally consistent, and I agree.  And it's pretty glaring when they're not.  I just don't expect them to be consistent with the real world.  So that's why I balk at comments like "I don't think flashlights are that powerful."

 

What I don't understand is how any of the components of the situation - Twilight's spell intended to alter the mindstate of fruit bats, the fruit bats' desire to be fruit bats, and "The Stare" - would result in an altering of Fluttershy's physical anatomy, even from within the paradigm of the show. First, previously in the show, we've observed that spells which unicorns cast using their horns are supposed to perform intended actions in certain categories, and the consequences of those spells, even if they aren't what the caster wanted, should be in the same category as the intended spell. But here, a spell intended to produce a mental effect apparently produces an anatomical effect, which is a categorically different result than was intended. And as far as I know, this is not something we've seen before in the show, nor is it something I would expect given previous observations of unicorns casting spells with their horns. Furthermore, the desire to be a fruit bat is categorically different than taking on the anatomical characteristics of a fruit bat, so I don't see why transferring the desire to be a fruit bat to Fluttershy would cause such anatomical changes to her.

 

Regarding the world of Equestria, I thought that the creators of the show meant for the default starting point of the viewers to be that the world of Equestria operates as our world does, but with certain specific exceptions. In other words, after accounting for the presence of certain specific, established deviations from our world, I think the default starting point when seeing new things or events in the show seems to be that they should behave as they do in our world; our familiar rules of physics, chemistry, biology, etc. should apply. And I think this view is borne out by the sheer number of things and events in the show that, for the most part, look and act like they do in our world - plants, animals, tools, social conventions, natural phenomena, etc.

 

Consequently, when we see things like a phonograph or a projector or a clock or a bathtub, I think we the viewers are meant to assume that those things are the same as in our world. It is on that basis that I said that I wouldn't really expect a handheld flashlight (presumably) like the ones Pinkie and Applejack were carrying to be able to make such a big, bright signal in the sky. And if we are meant to assume that their flashlights are some multiple brighter than the flashlights we're familiar with, then wouldn't Pinkie have done serious damage to Applejack's vision, and maybe even blinded Applejack, by shining her flashlight directly in Applejack's eyes? Yet we don't observe any indications of such serious damage, and it doesn't seem that that's what the episode's creators intended.

 

Why is the Stare magical? Well, turning something to stone is magical, isn't it? When using her Stare in The Stare Master, it slowed down the petrifying effect of the cockatrice's stare. And even the fact that the spell backfires in this episode because she was using the Stare implies it to be magical. And it's not just a "method of looking at animals," it pretty much hypnotizes them and allows Fluttershy to command them. Sounds like a form of magic to me.

 

I'm still not convinced that "The Stare" is actually a magical ability. When I look back at that episode, it's not clear to me that Fluttershy's use of "The Stare" actually slowed the cockatrice's petrification of her, nor is it clear to me that "The Stare" in itself stopped or reversed her petrification. I think a different explanation could be that the cockatrice's petrification of Fluttershy simply failed when it stopped trying to petrify her, and it stopped because Fluttershy's stern non-magical stare and talking-to made the cockatrice think better of it, and/or broke the cockatrice's concentration. Furthermore, Fluttershy ordered the cockatrice to turn Elizabeak and Twilight back to normal, so the cockatrice apparently has the power to undo its own petrification, making it possible that it could have just done that to Fluttershy as well.

 

The fact that "The Stare" makes animals focus their attention on Fluttershy and do what she says isn't necessarily an indication that it's a magical ability either. It's difficult to discuss this, however, without first knowing how Fluttershy is able to talk to these other animals at all, and how she usually gets other animals to pay attention to her and do what she says anyway, without using "The Stare".

 

Moreover, if we are to believe that "The Stare" is a magical ability, that opens a whole other can of worms. How and when did Fluttershy (a pegasus, no less) obtain this ability? Is it unique only to her, or has any other pony ever been able to do it? Are we to believe that certain non-unicorns are just born with certain magical abilities like this one? Or did she suddenly gain this ability when her cutie mark was bestowed upon her? If so, why did the bestower of cutie marks deign to give this ability to her, and how is it decided which non-unicorn ponies will get magical abilities, and what specifically those magical abilities will be? Do any other non-unicorns in the show have magical abilities like this that we didn't realize or haven't seen yet? If so, why hasn't it been brought up before now? It seems to me that believing that "The Stare" is a magical ability might create more complexity and trouble than it's worth.

[Captain Hurricane 4]

Drastic measures?! Sure Fluttershy isint going to like that....but her little animals are the ones in danger so i guess she will accept the deal they are offering her..This episode is sure gonna be great!!!!!

[Sunny Fox 5,950]

 

What I don't understand is how any of the components of the situation - Twilight's spell intended to alter the mindstate of fruit bats, the fruit bats' desire to be fruit bats, and "The Stare" - would result in an altering of Fluttershy's physical anatomy, even from within the paradigm of the show. First, previously in the show, we've observed that spells which unicorns cast using their horns are supposed to perform intended actions in certain categories, and the consequences of those spells, even if they aren't what the caster wanted, should be in the same category as the intended spell. But here, a spell intended

Edited January 1, 2014 by SolarFox

[Vampire_Pony 13]

The best part was when Fluttershy was a vampire pony.    She got popular pretty quick.