Jan animations shut down by hasbro/C&D

[Fhaolan 4,483]

Thank you. I understand that. This is why every site that has a pony being shown has been "politely asked" to take them down too right?

 

No. This didn't happen. They are targeting Jan Animations because they have some magical scale of nonsensery where Jan Animations got to "TOO BIG!" and it's suddenly a threat.

Of course.

 

You seem to be under the impression that I think this is a good thing, or that I think Hasbro is handling this correctly. I don't. They're following in the footsteps of Disney, who is even more aggressive with this kind of thing. To the point of suing a *daycare* for having their trademark characters painted on their walls. While Warner Brothers stepped in and donated their artists' time and materials to repaint the daycare using their trademark characters in one of the biggest PR coups of the time.

 

Yes, this trademark thing is what Hasbro's legal consul is using as an excuse. It's a common excuse used by a lot of big company's legal teams.

 

Each time that team has issued a C&D before, there was some kind of reasoning behind it. Fighting is Magic crossed the Gameloft license deal. The Lyra plushie was a sex toy. I'm not sure the Molestia tumblr was a full C&D or not, but again it was likely brought to Hasbro's legal team by a 3rd party complainer about the sexual humor. There were several DeviantArt people who were asked to remove pricing lists for plushies. Not to stop selling plushies, but just to remove the pricing lists in order to not look like the legal definition of a 'manufacturing' business.

 

But I'm not seeing anything with this one that would trigger that response. Jan had actually been big enough of a deal prior that if simply being successful was the issue, he should have gotten this earlier. In fact, in his Tumblr he's said he will still be doing commission work, so the C&D had nothing to do with his making money off of pony animations. And his comics are untouched by the C&D.

 

There some detail in this whole thing that is missing.

[Lightning-flickr 214]

In honor of hasbro's dickory here, I made this, 

[cuteycindyhoney 13,306]

I know this is an unpopular viewpoint, but Hasbro has every LEGAL right to protect their holdings. They own everything MLP:FIM related, and it's their call if they choose to send a C-D order when they think something is infringing on THEIR property. The Button Mash videos, and Picture Perfect Pony were done so well, they can very easily be mistaken for official Hasbro approved content. So many people are saying "They should just let this content alone." If they do, Hasbro sets a dangerous legal precedent that could actually lead to any company openly producing unlicensed MLP:FIM merchandize. They'd just point to Button Mash and anything else and say "Hasbro permitted that, how dare they turn around now and say no to us?" Hasbro could actually lose their rights to MLP:FIM if they don't actively protect their copyrights.

 

It's a shame such a cool fan made production was stopped, but Hasbro is well within their rights. 

[Adorkable 2,737]

I know this is an unpopular viewpoint, but Hasbro has every LEGAL right to protect their holdings. They own everything MLP:FIM related, and it's their call if they choose to send a C-D order when they think something is infringing on THEIR property. The Button Mash videos, and Picture Perfect Pony were done so well, they can very easily be mistaken for official Hasbro approved content. So many people are saying "They should just let this content alone." If they do, Hasbro sets a dangerous legal precedent that could actually lead to any company openly producing unlicensed MLP:FIM merchandize. They'd just point to Button Mash and anything else and say "Hasbro permitted that, how dare they turn around now and say no to us?" Hasbro could actually lose their rights to MLP:FIM if they don't actively protect their copyrights.

 

It's a shame such a cool fan made production was stopped, but Hasbro is well within their rights. 

 

You've made some good points.

 

I've literally been telling people this all day. ^^"

 

In honor of hasbro's dickory here, I made this, 

 

Run, Button! Run! D':

Edited March 23, 2014 by Adorkable

[Harmonic Revelations 8,835]

Aw... I liked those videos! I hope someone saved them and can reupload them! 

I have the first episode of Button's Adventures downloaded if anybody wants it and doesn't have it already. I have a few other Jan Animations videos downloaded, too.

Edited March 23, 2014 by Singularity

[Singe 2,111]

The request permission form is right there. Jan Animations can just fill it out and submit it for Hasbro's approval.

[The Leafeon Pinkeh 3,603]

Did JansAnimations not give rights to the characters on the video? D: 

Would that of even helped? And.. IS ASKTHECRUSADERS STILL HERE?! 

I checked, phew, its just on a hiatus 

[ParsoOfEquestria 1,490]

guys, its simple, upload the videos to an under the radar video streamer site, use a different name, keep producing episodes under Jan's name, if Hasbro notices, its not Jan its just some random that thought of stealing the videos and uploading on their channel

[Adorkable 2,737]

Did JansAnimations not give rights to the characters on the video? D: 

Would that of even helped? And.. IS ASKTHECRUSADERS STILL HERE?! 

I checked, phew, its just on a hiatus 

 

I think Jan still owns the rights to Button and his Mom, but the style they were drawn in were Hasbro's.

 

So, if they redesign Button and his Mom, I think they'll be okay. ^^

 

guys, its simple, upload the videos to an under the radar video streamer site, use a different name, keep producing episodes under Jan's name, if Hasbro notices, its not Jan its just some random that thought of stealing the videos and uploading on their channel

 

 

That doesn't sound very safe. ^^"

Edited March 23, 2014 by Adorkable

[FoxyCryptid 4,330]

I know this is an unpopular viewpoint, but Hasbro has every LEGAL right to protect their holdings. They own everything MLP:FIM related, and it's their call if they choose to send a C-D order when they think something is infringing on THEIR property. The Button Mash videos, and Picture Perfect Pony were done so well, they can very easily be mistaken for official Hasbro approved content. So many people are saying "They should just let this content alone." If they do, Hasbro sets a dangerous legal precedent that could actually lead to any company openly producing unlicensed MLP:FIM merchandize. They'd just point to Button Mash and anything else and say "Hasbro permitted that, how dare they turn around now and say no to us?" Hasbro could actually lose their rights to MLP:FIM if they don't actively protect their copyrights.

 

It's a shame such a cool fan made production was stopped, but Hasbro is well within their rights. 

 

Actually, there's the difference is that bootlegs are being solid for profit, where as fan-work generally doesn't make money. 

[Adorkable 2,737]

Hasbro could always just buy the whole Button series off Jan, then let Jan work for them making Button stuff. ^^

Edited March 23, 2014 by Adorkable

[Metemponychosis 1,261]

 

 

You seem to be under the impression that I think this is a good thing, or that I think Hasbro is handling this correctly. I don't. They're following in the footsteps of Disney, who is even more aggressive with this kind of thing. To the point of suing a *daycare* for having their trademark characters painted on their walls. While Warner Brothers stepped in and donated their artists' time and materials to repaint the daycare using their trademark characters in one of the biggest PR coups of the time.

 

 

No. I don't think that. I'm just pointing out what I see as, for lack of a better word, "bullshit". Not on your part. Your explanation of the situation is sound as far as I can see. I'm calling bulshit on Hasbro's motivation for doing this. And I didn't know that about WB. Kudos to them.

 

 

 

Yes, this trademark thing is what Hasbro's legal consul is using as an excuse. It's a common excuse used by a lot of big company's legal teams. Each time that team has issued a C&D before, there was some kind of reasoning behind it. Fighting is Magic crossed the Gameloft license deal. The Lyra plushie was a sex toy. I'm not sure the Molestia tumblr was a full C&D or not, but again it was likely brought to Hasbro's legal team by a 3rd party complainer about the sexual humor. There were several DeviantArt people who were asked to remove pricing lists for plushies. Not to stop selling plushies, but just to remove the pricing lists in order to not look like the legal definition of a 'manufacturing' business. But I'm not seeing anything with this one that would trigger that response. Jan had actually been big enough of a deal prior that if simply being successful was the issue, he should have gotten this earlier. In fact, in his Tumblr he's said he will still be doing commission work, so the C&D had nothing to do with his making money off of pony animations. And his comics are untouched by the C&D. There some detail in this whole thing that is missing.

 

I don't think that Hasbro is some evil force trying to deny the fans something that they like. The problem with Hasbro is (this will sound too liberal) that they are a gigantic corporation. In a way this is good, because it allows them to produce and distribute their products to almost everyone. But they are also an immense beast that exists to generate profits that has evolved in an environment of crony capitalism.

 

Like any species that suffers some sort of evolutionary pressure, they developed this "immunological system" that actively seeks out threats and finds the most efficient way of dealing with them. It figured that it needs to bring down these people for whatever reason and then it sends out its feelers to feel the environment and figured that this was an acceptable strategy. The problem is that the people that give the "GO!" command seem to be dissociated from reality. Yes... Sexual jokes can be seem as off-limits in the actual state of affairs, as much as putting products in the market. But my point is that their claimed motives might have nothing to do with the real reason these people got hammered. But I suppose that this is a bit more than I can say without being opinionated.

 

It's just sad, because it didn't need to be like this. It's like a scared monster running around clawing at anything that makes enough noise to draw it's attention. Sometimes it hits something that needed to be hit, and sometimes it hits something completely innocuous.

[Shenron00 366]

Hasbro could always just buy the whole Button series off Jan, then let Jan work for them making Button stuff. ^^

But then they'd have to actually pay Jan, and we all know how much people don't like doing that.

[Adorkable 2,737]

But then they'd have to actually pay Jan, and we all know how much people don't like doing that.

 

You have to give a little to make a little. ^^

[Adorkable 2,737]

I don't think people like to give at all. That and they probably wouldn't want to hire a dude they sent a C&D to.

 

The C&D wasn't in anger, it was in business terms, nothing personal.

Edited March 23, 2014 by Akavi
Quoting hidden post

[cuteycindyhoney 13,306]

Actually, there's the difference is that bootlegs are being solid for profit, where as fan-work generally doesn't make money. 

It doesn't make a bit of difference if they make no money. Hasbro owns every single aspect of MLP:FIM. Say you wrote a book. You sell that book and it becomes very popular. Someone online writes a sequel to your book that totally changes the direction of what you have developed, and maybe even kills off a character or two. (Cupcakes, anyone?) They distribute it for free. It's written well enough where many people think YOU wrote it. Wouldn't you demand it be stopped?

 

So many bronies are of the opinion. "I like it, that means Hasbro MUST allow me to do whatever I want with it." The legal world does not work that way. Frankly, many are acting like spoiled babies with the "Whaa-whaa, Hasbro is mean!" attitude. People keep complaining that Hasbro is just being evil. That's just foolish. Hasbro invested literally MILLIONS of dollars in MLP:FIM. They have every right to control every aspect of THEIR PROPERTY. 

Edited March 23, 2014 by cuteycindyhoney

[Adorkable 2,737]

It doesn't make a bit of difference if they make no money. Hasbro owns every single aspect of MLP:FIM. Say you wrote a book. You sell that book and it becomes very popular. Someone online writes a sequel to you book that totally changes the direction of what you have developed, and maybe even kills off a character or two. (Cupcakes, anyone?) They distribute it for free. It's written well enough where many people think YOU wrote it. Wouldn't you demand it be stopped?

 

I understand what you're saying. ^^

 

That's why, hopefully, whoever wrote that book would put "by" and then their name.

 

In Jan and Hasbro's situation, Jan always put his "JanAnimation" on his films, so people wouldn't think it was Jan unless they started in the middle of the video and didn't watch the comments.

 

That makes sense, right? ^^"

[Sugar Cube 4,843]

Stay on-topic and abide by the forum rules!

 

I have had to and am in the process of removing a number of posts here due to abusive behavior, flamebaiting, and/or being pointless. I realize this thread pertains to controversial subject matter, but you must post in accordance with the rules at all times. I don't want to see any more insults or trolling here or this thread will be locked.

 

Thanks.

[Shenron00 366]

In a nutshell, it was mean. ^^"

 

 

The C&D wasn't in anger, it was in business terms, nothing personal.

Aw come on, it wasn't THAT mean.

I never said it was in anger, I just meant that something happened that would make then send a C&D in the first place so they wouldn't just hire a dude that almost cost then big time.

Stay on-topic and abide by the forum rules!

 

I have had to and am in the process of removing a number of posts here due to abusive behavior, flamebaiting, and/or being pointless. I realize this thread pertains to controversial subject matter, but you must post in accordance with the rules at all times. I don't want to see any more insults or trolling here or this thread will be locked.

 

Thanks.

Yeah, it's probably gonna go back to Hell quickly so you might as well just lock the thread. Also, why'd you delete my post man? It couldn't have been THAT bad.

[Metemponychosis 1,261]

I don't presume to tel people what they can talk about, but I don't think that the discussion here shouldn't be wherever Hasbro has the legal right to C&D these projects. They do. Period. That's been established in a lot of posts up there.

The discussion should be wherever they SHOULD have done it.

 

 

 

To that end of educating people, this is Hasbro's 'Permission to Use' request form for the public, which is listed on one of their sites' pages.   Page --> http://www.hasbro.co...equest-form.pdf   Like I said, I wish it were more widespread and known to bronies who are making show-quality animations and the such. Perhaps it can be spread by bronies themselves.

 

Also, can someone ask EqD to get on the horn and spread the word around? I don't know how to.

 

EDIT: typo...

Edited March 23, 2014 by moonlightavenger

[cuteycindyhoney 13,306]

I understand what you're saying. ^^

 

That's why, hopefully, whoever wrote that book would put "by" and then their name.

 

In Jan and Hasbro's situation, Jan always put his "JanAnimation" on his films, so people wouldn't think it was Jan unless they started in the middle of the video and didn't watch the comments.

 

That makes sense, right? ^^"

They still were using content that they quite literally had no legal right to touch. Don't get me wrong. I really enjoyed Button Mash and Picture Perfect Pony. (P P Pony is wonderful. I'm glad I downloaded it.) It's just I understand a bit of what's happening here. It really bothers me when people decide a company is evil or wrong, just because they want to protect their own legal rights. Jan, I'm sorry to say, does not have a legal leg to stand on.

Edited March 23, 2014 by cuteycindyhoney

[Adorkable 2,737]

Jan, I'm sorry to say, does not have a legal leg to stand on.

 

BUT

 

He owns the characters (Button and his Mom), that's still something, right? ^^"

 

Just not the style they were drawn in.

[cuteycindyhoney 13,306]

BUT

 

He owns the characters (Button and his Mom), that's still something, right? ^^"

 

Just not the style they were drawn in.

Button's mom is, I believe, an original character. Button, although unnamed, actually appears in the episode "Hearts and Hooves Day". The animation also duplicates backgrounds and character design perfectly. Many series regular ponies also appeared in "Picture Perfect Pony" too.

[Metemponychosis 1,261]

 

 

He owns the characters (Button and his Mom), that's still something, right? ^^"

 

As far as I know, not, he doesn't. It's derivative work. 

[Sir Cal Stonehoof 596]

*sighs* Well this just adds to a crappy day...

 

But like Vox said, they own the characters of Button Mash (at least voice, name and personality) and Button's Mom (in all aspects, she never had appeared on the show), just not the style they were drawn in.  

 

While I do feel Hasbro is biting the hand that feeds, they are within their rights. 

 

It doesn't make a bit of difference if they make no money. Hasbro owns every single aspect of MLP:FIM.

 

By this logic, the entire creative aspect of the fandom is doomed. Which can kill of the fandom entirely..

 

 

Jan, I'm sorry to say, does not have a legal leg to stand on.

 

Actually they do when it comes to fair use, but as Vox said himself, in the long run it could bad for him or Jan. That's why they decided to comply with the C&D.

 

The message from Vox himself:

http://vocaroo.com/i/s0IUXMulZbO1