Is the animation even good at all?

[Pastel 7,630]

I for one think the animation is very good, there're some great landscapes:

 

 

 

 

 

 

And the motions are decent too.

 

Actually I find that the animation is better than in many other cartoons (but maybe that's just me).

Edited January 14, 2015 by Blobulle

[Admiral Regulus 2,769]

Sure it doesn't require as much skill as some other styles, but the results are good. Actually, it's quite amazing how good it looks considering the shortcuts they take, like using the same body model for most of the cast.

 

But perhaps more than the quality, it's the style that I like. It's actually cute! Smooth, natural curves and shapes that make sense in 3 dimensions for the most part. So many other cartoons have sharp corners and perfect circles/ellipses all over, which only make sense from certain angles, and look harsh and unnatural. Not that such styles shouldn't be done, but I don't like it, and it's especially rare to see anything else in Flash since it's particularly well suited to geometric shapes. And even in non-Flash shows, ever since Simpsons and all the Nicktoons took off in the early 90's, most cartoons seem to have a deliberate ugliness to them.

 

I disagree on the excessive tweening point. Even though a lot of motions (especially walk cycles) are created by deforming the models rather than drawing new frames, they're not just rotating and scaling rigid shapes. The motions look smooth and natural, and have more weight and momentum to them than a lot of cartoons. And whenever something moves very far, they do switch to a new frame, so the stretching/tweening never becomes obtrusive.

 

I was going to say something similar to this.

 

OP is getting quality confused with difficulty. Using flash to animate like in MLP isn't terribly difficult, but that doesn't mean it isn't good. Likewise, even some cartoons that put a lot of man-hours into animating may not necessarily look appealing.

 

The animation is very simplistic, yes, but it's the style that I like. Consider these two examples:

 

 

 

The one on the top would clearly take much more effort to animate. It's far more detailed, with better form, anatomy, and shading. It shows a much higher skill level on the artist's part. However... which one would you rather look at? The top one is more anatomically correct, but the bottom one has its own unique style. The bottom one is much simpler, and it has a certain charm to it. It's smooth. It's expressive. It's cute. It's more pleasing to the eye.

 

The animators of FiM aren't trying to compete with shows and movies that use detailed frame-by-frame animation. They're trying to make their show as appealing as possible, while keeping it simple so that they can give us more episodes in any given timeframe. They're not trying to push the boundaries of animation—they're trying to be efficient.

 

TL;DR: You're comparing potato salad to chocolate cake.

Edited January 14, 2015 by Regulus

[newfrickinshow 100]

The animation is not and never has been justification for the fan base; a well animated piece of crap is still a piece of crap.  The animation is merely one positive aspect of the show.  Characterization and character development, morals, storylines, and the humor of the show are all other aspects of the show that have created the fandom. 

[Discordian 6,015]

Doesn't have to be the best animation to be good animation.

 

There's a level of detail put into it (where it matters) that some cartoons completely overlook, while alternatively it puts less detail in places where other cartoons put too much. Because of that we don't have to see every little drop of mucus but we still get to see facial expressions that many remember vividly and it tends to really make the scene. Faces such as the "so awesome" one or when Twilight goes nutso in Lesson Zero.

 

The animators also seemingly know how to use the flash medium to their advantage without a lot of the errors that amateur flash animators make such as limbs being appended solely to their shoulders and their movement from that point being very visible or being unable to represent the third dimension so when something turns they skip a million frames to do it. Though MLP doesn't completely avoid those things they aren't particularly noticeable by the majority of it's viewers unless you're specifically looking for it.

 

Even in the first season there were videos of people pointing out small animation errors like desynced wing flapping but very few ever noticed them until someone pointed them out.

 

By now this is probably just beating a dead horse but the animation isn't the only thing to enjoy and whether it's good or not, while up for debate, is just one piece of the puzzle. Even if it was considered pretty average or horrible animation the fact that it matches what the series is going for adds to it. By itself it may not be much but as a part of the whole the show works.

[Sceethe 704]

You are definitely right about the pure animation quality.There are a lot of shows that are far better animated than MLP.

But i think that you fail to see what people actually refer to when they talk about "animation".

Usually, it´s not the technical animation quality itself, but the overall "graphics" of the show.

People care about the backgrounds, the character designs, the overall architecture design, and, of course, the "actual" animation, referring to how anatomically correct the characters movements are, and all that good stuff( i am not an expert on this)

.

Mlp does an amazing job at all of those things, that´s why we have so many fan artists in this community.

There are well-drawn backgrounds for every frame( even though they get re-hashed from time to time)

We have cute anime-ish eyes for the characters, with big heads and round forms everywhere, even in the architecture.

I could talk about why that´s important, but i don´t feel like writing a book here. you can ask me about that specifically, though.

 

 

Now here is the part where i did get a bit upset.

You are basically telling us that the animation of Mlp requires little effort,because "you are an animator", and then continue to mock the animators of the community by calling them "teenagers in their basements".

 

Jananimations is a professional animator, he gets payed to do things like that.

I am not sure about Duo Cartoonist, but i am pretty sure they have spent tons of time perfecting their craft.(their style is different from the show anyways:higher quality, of course, but they obviously had more time, and fewer episodes to make.

 

Do you realize how stupid that sounds?

[Discordian 6,015]

This. Youtube comments are almost as toxic and vile as nasty old 4chan. I wouldn't look there for insight. You get insulted there everywhere. We're a lot more lax(aside from a few bad eggs). 

 

OT: I find the animation fluid and easy on the eyes. It's not perfect, but it's definitely colorful and the models are good for flash.

Case in point: Being told you're on something because you enjoy a game that another person doesn't. Because it's not opinions, it's drugs. Remember that, kiddies!

[Dark Qiviut 22,514]

Anyone who believes the animation in mlp is "great" has obviously never watched a well-animated show.

You're factually wrong. My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic has objectively great animation, and it only got better in subsequent seasons.

 

In season one, the animation was great, although somewhat basic if going by today's standards. That said, there were many moments where they pushed the boundaries such as the dress reveal during Suited for Success's climax and The Best Night Ever. When Return of Harmony premiered, the animation greatly improved thanks to more concentration on the details and more complex animation.

 

Observe the snapping of Pinkie's legs during The Smile Song:

 

The snapping of the legs makes Pinkie look very happy and adds depth to the already powerful animation of the song.

 

Seasons three and four improved even more by using a variety of angles, visual effects (including a blur to blend light and dark to create a better illusion of roundness), and more attention to composition.

 

Friendship Is Magic deserves plenty of credit for putting plenty of care in the animation. One big reason bronies became bronies is the high-quality writing, but the animation is possibly the most significantly improved. Previously, flash animation was synonymous with cheap, lazy animation. Contrary to what you assume, there's significant effort into FIM's animation to make Flash a useful, organic tool rather than a gimmick. Flash cuts the cost, but takes as much effort and talent to develop and master as any other animation.

 

When you claim it takes little effort to use Flash, you're showing disrespect to the art of animation. Simple animation doesn't translate to bad-quality animation.

 

Is it the only thing bronies get attracted to? Of course not. And again, it's not even the main thing that attracts them; it's the great writing. But there's definitely a level of charm and care into their product when the animation itself is extremely good. Good animation clues unsuspecting people of good overall production values (barring exceptions, of course), and FIM certainly has that.

 

The entire basis of it's style is copy-and-pasting the same images over and over and moving them around, an animation technique referred to as “tweening.” It requires little to no talent and only look decent when the images being used are of great quality. Have you guys even seen shows like “Superjail,” “Futurama,” and “Black Dynamite?”

By this paragraph alone, it's extremely obvious you don't know much about flash animation. I've used it, and it's much harder than you think. Adobe Flash is extremely complicated, can be frustrating to work with, and you must spend a lot of time to learn the program. On its own, tweening can be your best friend or worst enemy. It's one thing to learn Flash; it's another to master Flash. DHX and Top Draw mastered it.

Edited January 14, 2015 by Dark Qiviut

[Princess Lona 382]

I think the confusion arises because people say that the animation is good when what they really mean is the art is good. Animation refers to the movement of the pictures. For animation to be good (in a very general sense, I understand that "good" is subjective) the movement has to be smooth, the physics have to adhere to their own laws, and light and shadow have to move together. MLP does this, but not in any way which stands out from other adequately animated 2D animations. The art on the other hand, is fantastic in many bronies' opinions, despite the fact that most characters in the show have the exact same body model. The backgrounds are beautiful, there is a whispy quality to things like clouds, plants and manes that we enjoy, and the various creatures and monsters that appear are creatively designed and styled. Plus, as many have pointed out, the colour palette is soft and calming to look at, which is a nice juxtaposition to the abundance of goofball comedy and action that occur in the script.

[Discordian 6,015]

@@Dark Qiviut,

 

I've seen a lot of people accuse flash as being nothing more than copy-pasting everything. I'm no animator but even I know that's not the case.

 

From what I know:

 

You can copypasta the base models and some of the features such as eyes but when each mane is designed differently they have to be animated differently. Especially in two particular cases: Pinkie Pie and Rarity. Rarity's mane adds a third dimension that the other manes don't really have so there's a need to take that into account when it moves and also where it lays still again. In Pinkie's case she moves in a lot of atypical ways that each movement would need it's own animations. Between her hair blowing up and then falling down in Party of One to the episode with Iron Will when IW himself is holding onto her tail and she's...walking away on air.

 

Plus one thing that MLP does that a lot of flash animators don't is consider the third dimension more seriously. When Fluttershy is spinning around at the end of her workout montage there would be a need to consider all angles of her, including her mane.

 

Now, don't get me wrong. I could be talking out of my ass because I don't know anything about Flash but know a bit about programming in general and copy-pasting is one of the big no-nos of any type of programming.

[Tilt 286]

I like it more for the writing mainly because the Animation isn't actually that good, I watch tons of different shows but I say that MLP is sub-par animation, if you have a keen eye MLP has a ton of Animation errors, clipping hair, missing assets and even putting things on the wrong layer.

[Celli 4,341]

Case in point: Being told you're on something because you enjoy a game that another person doesn't. Because it's not opinions, it's drugs. Remember that, kiddies!

Wait, what are you talking about?

[Discordian 6,015]

Wait, what are you talking about?

I was merely commenting on the fact that Youtube is a terrible place and should never be used as any sort of fact checking.

[Blaze Bronson 343]

Most of the points regarding, easy to animate =/= bad bad animation, has been made so here is another one.

 

 

What a lot of people might be referring to when they say the animation is good, might actually be that the aesthetics are good.

Basically how the colors, lines and curves look and feel.

 

Personally I love the smooth movement, colors and cuteness of the show. However, it is only a part of why I watch the show, among many other things.

I guess another reason you might hear about animation is because it's an easy argument to make, and other people can relate to it.

The strange pull this show has on me, and I know many others, is hard to explain. Even to myself.

 

Edit: wording + spelling

Edited January 14, 2015 by Blaze Bronson

[Espurr 449]

Good animation? I don't know good animation. If I think the cartoon's ok then it's ok and that's ok with me. It doesn't have to be good animation to be a good show. Animations isn't what makes the show good. So bad animation can get annoying at times, but I've never really seen good or bad animation so I can't really be a judge here. By the way, Animation wasn't what started the fandom.

[Odyssey 5,718]

Honestly, MLP:FiM is pretty impressively animated, especially on a program like Flash. The animation may be one of the better things about the show, except it is not what draws in fans. It's more often than not the quirky humour and the characters, which are probably more important for a show like MLP:FiM than how pleasing it is to the eye.

 

Another thing about the animation is it doesn't need to be super difficult or detailed for it to be a good show. The ponies have a simple body shape with distinctive mane styles so the audience have a better understanding on which pony is which. And to be fair, the different kinds of manes and tails are just enough for a good character design. Less is more, after all.

[TheJLeeTeam 914]

I think it's well animated for Flash animation. Flash can look crappy and worse than hand drawn if it's not done correctly like in a show such as Johnny Test but if Flash is done well you can make really stunning animation that is on par or better looking than hand drawn. I wouldn't say it's the absolute best looking animation I've ever seen but it's up there.

Edited January 15, 2015 by TheJLeeTeam

[Eloquence 2,076]

Looks like a lot of what I could have added has already been said. A lot of people say that the animation is good when they mean that the aesthetic is good. I guess what I'll add is that aesthetic is usually the more important of the two.

 

The major game companies provide an excellent example of this. Nintendo has pretty consistently had worse graphics than its main competitors (Sony and Microsoft) over the years, but it's games still looked better. Why? Because while the other two companies were focusing on competing for the best graphics, Nintendo focused on the aesthetic of their games, meaning that while the other companies churned out games full of Uncanny Valley humans, the gaming industry continued to be dominated by a cartoony Italian plumber and his friends, because they may have been less "realistic", but they sure as hell looked better.

 

MLP also has this advantage. It has a very distinct deliberate style, where everything is taken into careful consideration. The creator, Lauren Faust, has always been big on giving her shows a very fitting, deliberate style, as can also be seen in the Powerpuff Girls and Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends (two other successful projects of hers). Even the colors are carefully chosen to create the happy, calming effect that the show is meant to have in most of its episodes (I could go on further about color theory but I'll leave it at that for now). 

 

And as many have pointed out, the animation has really improved over time. If you haven't, I would consider watching a recent episode to see why the animation is considered good by most of us. Castle Mane-ia is a great one for animation and aesthetic quality, in my less-than-expert opinion

[JanisJopleyBird 22]

I think they do a lot with the limited resource they have.

 

Ponyville is just so warm to me. The colors are so vibrant and inviting, the rolling hills outside of town... They really gave it such a sense of serenity, you just wanna sit underneath an apple tree with a good book until sunset.

[Judgement 445]

I agree with a lot of your points, and personally It's not the quality of the animation that keeps me interested, but rather the art style. Faust's designs really stick out compared to other shows.

 

 

In all due respect, It's funny that you are criticizing MLP for bad animation when your avatar is Ralphie from "The magic school bus", and that show has some pretty bad animation as well. Sure it came out in the 90s and MLP FIM came out in 2010, but I remember seeing shows in the 90s with far better animation. My point is that people still loved that show despite it's animation.

 

 

Still, I personally find the animation in MLP FIM to be great, especially compared to the Generation 1 and 3 cartoons from the 80s and early 2000s.

[KiwiPony 125]

Hey there, so often people are comparing that to the other generations of MLP and trust me, FiM is great compared to that But that aside, its not that common for a good point of the show to be the animation from what I've seen. The shows good, the animation doesn't really play a part in how I see the show and I'm sure that's the same for many bronies

[Rainboom Dash 1,056]

For Flash, it's great animation. The colors and movements are always so vivid.

[RainbowTashie 378]

well i think it looks buckin awesome the expressions are endless