MLP and its represntation of female characters

[Shanks 10,816]

as his mind deteriorated from Alzheimer's.

My Dad slowly deteriorated from kidney failure, he got an infection and bad drug reaction in 2008 and had been on a rather steep decline since then. He had kidney failure before then but there was at least some hope at the time of him getting a kidney. Even if I didn't know he would when he did I knew that he at most only had a couple of years left in him.

[DryGuy84 (Inactive) 927]

My Dad slowly deteriorated from kidney failure, he got an infection and bad drug reaction in 2008 and had been on a rather steep decline since then. He had kidney failure before then but there was at least some hope at the time of him getting a kidney. Even if I didn't know he would when he did I knew that he at most only had a couple of years left in him.

 

I'm sorry for your loss. I'm sure he was a great guy.

[Steel Accord 6,660]

My Dad slowly deteriorated from kidney failure, he got an infection and bad drug reaction in 2008 and had been on a rather steep decline since then. He had kidney failure before then but there was at least some hope at the time of him getting a kidney. Even if I didn't know he would when he did I knew that he at most only had a couple of years left in him.

 

My sincerest condolences. 

I am male and I think they do a good job. Even the stereotypical "whiny girl" rarity is given a lot of depth and branches out a lot. She has a good personality and does the right thing when it calls for it. Even I get tired of seeing the stereotypical male-female dynamic and love it when a woman gets a good role, it really changes it up and offers a new experience. As for this:

 

 

I do kind of feel guys are negatively stereotyped a bit, but not as bad as they could be. The only instances that really bugged me were when, in, I believe The Ticket Master Spike is uncomfortable towards how the Mane Six are acting and Applejack responds "Well isn't that just like a boy, can't handle the least bit of sentiment" and in Dragon Quest the way the Dragons are portrayed are SOOOO stereotyped it's not even funny.

 

Well, when I was watching it, I think that had more to do with them being dragons, than them being guys.

 

Gilda wasn't too much of a far cry from them in terms of personality.

[Eloquence 2,076]

 

I HATE that character!

 

I don't give a damn about the romance, no it's not that! ( . . . Fluttershy is my type anyway.)

 

What I can't stand is him being basically the most one note, one dimensional, cardboard cutout to ever be associated with this show!  

-He's nice

-He plays guitar

-He dated Sunset Shimmer for no adequately explained reason

 

THAT'S IT!   There's nothing else about him! You could've replaced him with a lamp and the plot would be the same!

 

Amongst this incredible cast of multifaceted, complex characters, he stands out like . . . . LIKE . . . .

 

 

THAT!

 

I think Flash had more to do with Equestria Girls being... what it was, and less to do with him just being a bad character. He felt very much like a character created to get the checkmark in the box, so they could have a stereotypical romance subplot. Thing is, I'm guessing no one wanted to write a stereotypical romance subplot for Twilight, so they just minimized everything about that part of the movie as much as they could, including Flash himself.

 

I don't know, maybe it's just that I have this personal headcannon that the writers for EG were given a list of stereotypes they had to show and then tried their best to fill them while harming the integrity of the show as little as possible.

[Steel Accord 6,660]

 

 

This is one of my favorite scenes from MLP:

 

 

That has a good "funny because it's true" quality. I'm not so proud to admit, I've had my share of heroic, damsel saving fantasies, of which Rarity has been in a couple. (Mostly Fluttershy though.  )

 

Hell even the aesthetics were similar, I'm always cast as the knight in shining armor, wielding a sword, and addressing my love as "my lady."

I think Flash had more to do with Equestria Girls being... what it was, and less to do with him just being a bad character. He felt very much like a character created to get the checkmark in the box, so they could have a stereotypical romance subplot. Thing is, I'm guessing no one wanted to write a stereotypical romance subplot for Twilight, so they just minimized everything about that part of the movie as much as they could, including Flash himself.

 

I don't know, maybe it's just that I have this personal headcannon that the writers for EG were given a list of stereotypes they had to show and then tried their best to fill them while harming the integrity of the show as little as possible.

 

You may be right. It's just that DHX are usually so good at working with those "checkboxes." Hasbro said they needed a character that was into fashion, Lauren gave us Rarity, an artist who's medium just happens to be clothes.

 

My problems with Flash would disappear as long as they had just ONE scene of Twi and him actually connecting. Show he was good at chemistry, or maybe he was on the school's chess team, SOMETHING that Twilight would identify with and they could bond over! That would also serve the double purpose of giving Flash some more depth which he so desperately needs.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Steel Accord

[DND 2,355]

I know what you mean. My Little Pony and Littlest Pet Shop have got to be the girliest thing I've ever liked despite me being female. The reason is definitely quality. There's some really well-rounded and strong female characters out there that have been featured in mixed gender media like Sam Manson for instance, but it is quite rare to get a show like this with all the goodies of an female cast, storylines, fantasy, lore, lessons, clever humor, and strong personalities. ^^ But yes, it does have It's drawbacks with the male cast. Feminisim is fantastic, but it doesn't mean you should interpret males rather negatively like MLP does. Spike is great and all, but he's typically shown as a secondary character who is generally shown as a screw-up and clean-up. I'd like Spike tons more if he was just written as well as the other main characters for once. Afterall, he is a main character, correct? 

 

Generally speaking that I feel Spike has the most potential, that is. XD

[Pixel Stick 927]

IMO, MLP:FiM does one thing very well: It uses female characters in a very gender-neutral way.  All of the main characters in this show could be male and otherwise exactly the same, and you would have a very similar show.  Why?  Because they're real characters, with real ambitions, real jobs, real personalities and real flaws.  They aren't stereotypical at all.  The show succeeds simply because you can BELIEVE in these characters, and thus you can relate to them very well.

 

Which is why, I believe, this show appeals to both men and women nearly equally.  (At least, I've been led to believe the distribution of bronies is roughly equal parts men and women.  Could be wrong.)  Because we all see something in these characters that we can relate to and learn from.

 

 

 

Before you ask, yes, I hate Luna and Trixie with a firey passion. That's actually not true, I'd be fine with them were it not for the hornet's nest of fanboys/fangirls that comes with them

 

Each to their own, I suppose, but as a Luna fanboy, let me at least try to explain WHY I like her so much.  I have a fascination with powerful characters who are essentially good but have a dark side to them.  Luna, being both literally dark and having a dark past, is particularly fascinating in her portrayal - she was truly evil at one point, apparently mostly by choice, but she was brought back to the good side and now has a lot of lost time to make up.  A bit like Darth Vader, perhaps, but with the ability to actually make good on her terrible choices instead of dying as soon as she saw the light.

 

I think many of us see Luna as one of the characters with the greatest potential for development, and I personally think it's a shame she doesn't play a larger role in the show.  Her writing thus far (especially in "For Whom the Sweetie Belle Toils") shows how deep a character she is - she's not just another princess.  Ponies fear her and revere her at the same time.  She's powerful but socially awkward.  Over time, she's learned how to become a mentor of sorts for young ponies.  And while she teaches them valuable lessons (and in Sweetie Belle's case, helps her more directly), she learns more about herself and how to put her past into perspective.

 

As someone who's done a few things I'm not particularly proud of in the past, I see Luna as a great role model.  And yes, I think she's pretty, too.

[DND 2,355]

@@Steel Accord,

IDK, Luna is also a pretty huge cut out, so is Trixie. At least Flash Sentry had a few funny lines(One no comes to mind)

 

Before you ask, yes, I hate Luna and Trixie with a firey passion. That's actually not true, I'd be fine with them were it not for the hornet's nest of fanboys/fangirls that comes with them 

 

Pfft- the fandom is no reason to hate a character. XD That's like saying you hate all Cheez-Its just because of what particular box it lies in. (Wow, sorry. That's a pretty dumb example)

[Pixel Stick 927]

 

 

Pfft- the fandom is no reason to hate a character. XD That's like saying you hate all Cheez-Its just because of what particular box it lies in. (Wow, sorry. That's a pretty dumb example)

 

It's like saying you hate the sun because everyone likes going outdoors when it's sunny out.   (Okay, that's a pretty bad example too, but you get my point.)

[Hive King 2,001]

@@Pixel Stick,

Rather off topic, but I'll answer. Yes, I know it's dumb to be jaded by the fanbase, but still, I can't help it. Unfortunately, most Luna fanboys seem to be the type to claim she's an innocent angel and that Celestia is an evil bastard 

[SomeReallyRandomGuy 137]

 

 

Mlp is one of the only female targeted shows that has done female characters well

 

As a male, this really does not bother me.

The characters are well written & developed very well (most of the time). I stopped watching most things on TV because characters are badly written or badly represented. 

 

MLP defiantly does a good job with female characters, and it makes the show very entertaining to see something different.

[Pixel Stick 927]

@@Pixel Stick,

Rather off topic, but I'll answer. Yes, I know it's dumb to be jaded by the fanbase, but still, I can't help it. Unfortunately, most Luna fanboys seem to be the type to claim she's an innocent angel and that Celestia is an evil bastard

Really? That hasn't been my experience at all. What I've seen more of is people being critical of Celestia for being really shallow, which is why Luna, being such a deep character, is liked so much more. Ignoring the whole Molestia/Trollestia meme, I've only seen a few people claim that Celestia was evil or mean-spirited.

 

I will agree that Celestia strikes me as a bit of an exception to the anti-stereotypes of this show, though. With only a couple of exceptions, she's been pretty shallow and really only there to be the beloved benevolent ruler of the land, and I kinda wish we could get to learn more about her as well.

 

As I said, though, I think Celestia is the only significant exception to the anti-stereotypes rule in this show. (Not counting background ponies, some of whom obviously are there just to be eye candy.)

[Moved to Elsewhere 11,331]

I think mlp is one of the best shows that shows an accurate representation of female characters. Well most shows only have females obsessed with fashion and romance, mlp has a wide range of female characters with different personalities, tomboys, nature lovers, bookworms, party animals all friends together. It really goes against the female stereotypes. 

[Hive King 2,001]

@@Pixel Stick,

Go to Youtube, look under the comments for "Daylight's End" or "Children of the Night". That was my first experience with Luna fanboys and it's left me jaded

[RED20 289]

They're the only femal characters who act like people I know, instead of froofy princesses.

[Pixel Stick 927]

@@Pixel Stick,

Go to Youtube, look under the comments for "Daylight's End" or "Children of the Night". That was my first experience with Luna fanboys and it's left me jaded

Saw those. I can see what you mean, but I tend to ignore YouTube comments because people there in general act really dumb no matter what the topic. Can I encourage you to ignore them and keep an open mind? If you genuinely dislike Luna because you think she's a bad character, that's totally up to you. To each their own. I just want to encourage people to form their own opinions and not just rail for our against the fan base.

[Hive King 2,001]

 

 

Saw those. I can see what you mean, but I tend to ignore YouTube comments because people there in general act really dumb no matter what the topic. Can I encourage you to ignore them and keep an open mind? If you genuinely dislike Luna because you think she's a bad character, that's totally up to you. To each their own. I just want to encourage people to form their own opinions and not just rail for our against the fan base.

I think she's average, nothing too special but nothing too bad either. Still...ugh, her fanbase annoys me and I can't help but detest Luna because of it

 

Same thing with Trixie.  

 

I really wish I could let it go, but it's stuck in my head

[FatPat 77]

IMO, MLP:FiM does one thing very well: It uses female characters in a very gender-neutral way.  All of the main characters in this show could be male and otherwise exactly the same, and you would have a very similar show.  Why?  Because they're real characters, with real ambitions, real jobs, real personalities and real flaws.  They aren't stereotypical at all.  The show succeeds simply because you can BELIEVE in these characters, and thus you can relate to them very well.

 

Which is why, I believe, this show appeals to both men and women nearly equally.  (At least, I've been led to believe the distribution of bronies is roughly equal parts men and women.  Could be wrong.)  Because we all see something in these characters that we can relate to and learn from.

 

 

Nicely said. I've always believed that the trick to writing a good female character is to not think of her as a female, think of her as a character. That's why our mane 6 work so well. In fact you could change their genders and it wouldn't have a huge effect on their characters. If Twilight was a guy he would still be an OCD bookworm. If Fluttershy was a guy he would still be a shy individual who loves animals. A good character is defined by who they are, not what they are.

 

That's why other characters like Cadance, Shining Armor and Flash don't work out. They were created with the 'what' in mind, not the who.

[Singe 2,111]

Strong female characters. Not tied to their lives as high school, fashion, and boys. It's more on duty and responsibilities. Just not like WITCH where the girls are doing everything. This is not a show where one sided characters can exist.

 

I find some similarities between this show and the WITCH comics. Like the New Power arc was pusing Friendship is Magic in order for the WITCH to unite their powers to seal the enemy in stone.

 

The added factor to this series is that all the characters are naked. They can get away with things like DT and SS making fun of other girls flanks or shaking their flanks like Twilight/Fluttershy.

[SomariFeyWright 776]

What I find interesting about My Little Pony is that it applies some of the more commonly noted stereotypes the media often places on females in media (nerdy geek, athletic tomboy, country tomboy, shy extremely cute girl, zany party girl, fashionista), yet still provides them with a deeper character and sense of development than most shows would. I've seen so much character development and growth in these four seasons than a lot of shows have been willing to give in their entire run-time.

 

I think the show represents females PHENOMENALLY, because it's showing all these different archetypes of females, and showing them existing in harmony and love, rather than how such groups would often conflict and oppose in other media. Let's face it, in most any other show, Rarity would be a villain.

 

This is one of the many reasons Diamond Tiara ticks me off. She represents a bitter and mean-spirited archetype the show shouldn't be working with. She's bitter and cruel, her high status and supposed charm allowing her to have all but the CMC wrapped around her hoof. She represents mean-spiritedness and conflict in a land of peace and love without her properly receiving full and significant punishment for her actions. It hurts to be evil, and staggering backwards into a few cans of ink aren't going to be satisfying enough compared to forcing three little fillies to butcher their social lives.

 

Excluding the pile of pony dung that is Diamond Tiara, the show does female representation phenomenally, and well-written females is something I want to see more of.

[Hive King 2,001]

 

 

That's why other characters like Cadance, Shining Armor and Flash don't work out. They were created with the 'what' in mind, not the who.

IDK, Cadence could still be prince of love, but considering the really weird double standard, a few people would be crying rape when Male!Cadence did love magic. Shining Armor can be turned female fairly easily, just a military girl. Flash is a rocker....there's nothing to stereotypically masculine about him 

 

Diamond Tiara is very hard to gender bend as is Iron Will, mostly due to them both being pure estrogen and testosterone...respectively

[FatPat 77]

IDK, Cadence could still be prince of love, but considering the really weird double standard, a few people would be crying rape when Male!Cadence did love magic. Shining Armor can be turned female fairly easily, just a military girl. Flash is a rocker....there's nothing to stereotypically masculine about him 

 

Diamond Tiara is very hard to gender bend as is Iron Will, mostly due to them both being pure estrogen and testosterone...respectively

 

It could be possible, but it would be difficult to change their genders. Plus they still lack personality.

 

The problem with those three is that they were made to fill roles in a plot, which all happened to be gender specific.

 

Cadence was created because they needed a character who's a pink princess, which requires being female. She had to get married, so Shining Armor was created and thus had to be male. All those two have done in the show so far is play those roles, and because those roles are gender specific it becomes one of the few traits that defines them. The only other thing that defines them is that they both know Twilight, which ends up making them satellite characters.

 

I understand that the writers had these two forced on them, which would explain why they haven't done anything to expand on either of their characters. Personally I'm disappointed in them for taking the easy way out and simply having these two serve their purpose and then be discarded. It would take more work, but the writers could give more 'who' qualities to our royal couple. Shining Armor did get some expansion in the comics which I enjoyed (Cadence did not, unfortunately).

 

Iron Will and Diamond are actually not hard to gender bend, as their genders don't have anything to do with their character definition. Diamond is defined by being spoiled, rich, snobby, mean, aggressive, and a bully towards others. Iron Will is defined by being very assertive, putting on a good, effective show and developing a self help seminar. None of those things are gender dependent, so they don't fall into that trap.

[Hive King 2,001]

 

 

Iron Will and Diamond are actually not hard to gender bend, as their genders don't have anything to do with their character definition. Diamond is defined by being spoiled, rich, snobby, mean, aggressive, and a bully towards others. Iron Will is defined by being very assertive, putting on a good, effective show and developing a self help seminar. None of those things are gender dependent, so they don't fall into that trap.

True, but Diamond would be...weirder if it was a boy doing that. IDK, boys typically bully in a different way. And while Iron Will could be genderbent, I am unsure how to make the Hulk Hogan/Hercule/The Rock kind of stage presence he has

[FatPat 77]

Yeah having Iron Will as a female character would be going against the norm. It would definitely stand out to have a muscular woman putting on a seminar about being macho.

 

If Diamond was a guy he would probably be similar to Draco from Harry Potter.

[hawkflame 3,310]

Ever heard of the Bechdel Test?  It's a test used to show how male centric most popular media are.  A work passes the test if:
1) There are two or more female characters

2) that have at least *one* conversation

3) about something other than a guy. 

 

It'll really surprise you how many works of fiction fail this test. 

 

MLP:FiM, however, annihilates this test.  In every single episode.  That is amazing.

 

In fact, it's rather difficult to find the opposite in the show.  How often do you find two male characters talking to each other, about anything?  I mean, Snips and Snails talk to each other, so there's that, but otherwise...

 

Still having  gender imbalance within a show is not itself a problem.  I think it's fine to have a show that's mostly (or entirely) one gender or the other, the problem is when the majority of media swings heavily in one direction...  MLP is a welcome exception to that rule.