Does Mr. The Dragon have your respect now?

[Motion Spark 7,806]

I can't stress enough how much I hear that Spike is useless, a slave, a wimp, always ruin everything, a bad character, awful, annoying and more and more and more.

 

I have to agree there, that is, until these past 2 weeks, which, who would know! they were 2 Spike episodes in a row! I don't like Spike for these same reasons, because there isn't anything deep to work with on him. In one side you see him as a support point for Twilight in Lesson Zero, but then you see him being completely irrational and stupid following idiotic concept of a dragon code, oh! and don't forget his small bits when he usually ruins everything, for example when he ruined the breezies travel when he cut off that leaf when he was dancing on a tree's branch. In that same episode you could see in the mane6 faces the 'ugh, Spike you ruined something again, let's move on' when he was apologizing to Fluttershy.

 

What I'm saying is that Spike is usually the character that you want to see out of the way, that you don't care about or appreciate at all. And that's why he had that stigma within him.

 

But, even myself, have to admit that Inspiration Manifestation and Equestria Games where major highlights for him, and actually those 2 episodes gave him a nice amount of depth to his character that wasn't seen before.

I don't know if it's late to realize or what. But what makes Spike annoying or a 'bad character' is his own personality, that, in my opinion, hasn't been exploited in depth despite how many episodes he had in the past. He's a baby dragon, after all. He's super naive and innocent and I belive his maturity is a little above the CMC's, and those are things we usually know about him but we don't put in practice when we critizise his character.

 

I'm not going in depth analyzing these 2 episodes I mentioned but in Inspiration Manifestation we could see that even if Spike doesn't seem to have the same crush he had on Rarity in the past, he still seems to have an admiration and care for her. It's a feeling he can't have for Twilight or any of the other ponies, because he, crushed or not, puts Rarity in a pedestal when he interacts with her, and this feeling is so real like and relatable. I have seen shitons of reactions already and most of them were like, 'Spike what are you doing? tell the truth' while always praising Owlowiscious constant pressure for Spike to do the right thing.

Yes, Spike was annoying in this episode, because he wasn't able to stop Rarity from destruying Ponyville even if he always knew from the very beginning what he had to do, always trying to persuade her or trying to find short term solutions, because he feared of losing Rarity's friendship.

Not having the guts of telling someone you love what they're doing is wrong despite you knowing is bad, is a feeling many of us have struggled with, which in my opinion, makes Spike a character that has self-esteem issues and lack of confidence. This may sound bad, but this is good for him because Spike could be gaining some complexity to him.

 

Now in Equestria Games, which I never imagined, would've been a Spike episode. We can see a very vulnerable Spike that acted so down to earth and realistic despite him embarrassing his ass in from of thousand of ponies. I don't think I have to explain much here, but I cannot stress enough how good this episode was for him.

Now I get why he usually felt useless, like he said in Power Ponies. Like in Power Ponies I didn't get that feeling despite him saying it, but in Equestria Games I got it but he didn't need to mention it, I just felt it.

 

Anywho, I have more respect for the little one now...I still don't like Spike that much, but I appreciate these episodes they were both great for him!

 

 

[Tholos 145]

You can't really appreciate Spike fully unless you've been an unpaid intern before.

[Megas 27,095]

I've always liked and respected Spike

[Grumpy Enchantress 586]

Nope, I think he proved himself to be even more pathetic than I thought and only got lucky with his fire breath. Still a slave. 

[Scootalove 10,684]

I still respect him. Spike may have flaws and some problems, but I can still respect him.

[Jamaican Jam 112]

I've always liked Spike since the first season. Infact, I like him more than the main 6, lol.

[PrymeStriker 408]

What Spike did and faced in Inspiration Manifestation wasn't annoying. That was a fantastic way to mature his character and for him get past his crush on Rarity to do what's right for Ponyville.

[Motion Spark 7,806]

Nope, I think he proved himself to be even more pathetic than I thought and only got lucky with his fire breath. Still a slave. 

didn't you think that he probably likes to serve others?

 

 

What Spike did and faced in Inspiration Manifestation wasn't annoying. That was a fantastic way to mature his character and for him get past his crush on Rarity to do what's right for Ponyville.

what was great about Spike in Inspiration Manifestation was that he is a flawed character, but a flawed one that makes sense. There wasn't anything mature about leaving his true duty for last, trying to solve it with short term solutions. But it's okay because he learned the lesson in the end.

[Wind Chaser 4,767]

All the plot of "Inspiration Manifestation" could do was keep calm and drag on. I could get Spike being a yes man for Rarity, but with the developments of him apparently getting over his crush for her, should he really have continued doing so when Rarity was obviously going insane? How does he, as a child, understand the grip of insanity that Rarity was under?

 

Though I think "Equestria Games" failed to deliver on its hype, it was still a thoroughly enjoyable episode and one of the season's better outings. The moral really hits home, and Spike was definitely the best character to deliver a self-confidence moral. Though such morals have been done umpteen times before in this show, Spike was due for one, especially considering his poor treatment from the writers recently.

 

What I must say is this. From an objective standpoint, Spike is a complete misfit in this show. He is probably the least important character, considering how easily his place in the show can be interchanged. He gets to go on heroic adventures with his friends, but mostly as nothing more than a tagalong kid. The Mane 6 and the Crusaders are also portrayed as having life goals and the supportive ponies surrounding them to help them towards those goals. With the Crusaders occupying the role this show has for kid characters, one now sees why Spike is all too easily switched into a secondary role which usually entails ruining something or being the target of a joke and why there is little thought given to character development on his part. Why have a means when there is no end?

 

This episode is a step in the right direction, finally putting Spike's character through the 22-minute wringer he so sorely needed after the many episodes which ranged from mediocre to bad. I only hope this continues to happen next season, but I see the reasons for why it doesn't.

[Grumpy Enchantress 586]

didn't you think that he probably likes to serve others?

Yeah, he does like to, but he also has no choice. 

[DryGuy84 (Inactive) 927]

All the plot of "Inspiration Manifestation" could do was keep calm and drag on. I could get Spike being a yes man for Rarity, but with the developments of him apparently getting over his crush for her, should he really have continued doing so when Rarity was obviously going insane? How does he, as a child, understand the grip of insanity that Rarity was under?

 

Though I think "Equestria Games" failed to deliver on its hype, it was still a thoroughly enjoyable episode and one of the season's better outings. The moral really hits home, and Spike was definitely the best character to deliver a self-confidence moral. Though such morals have been done umpteen times before in this show, Spike was due for one, especially considering his poor treatment from the writers recently.

 

What I must say is this. From an objective standpoint, Spike is a complete misfit in this show. He is probably the least important character, considering how easily his place in the show can be interchanged. He gets to go on heroic adventures with his friends, but mostly as nothing more than a tagalong kid. The Mane 6 and the Crusaders are also portrayed as having life goals and the supportive ponies surrounding them to help them towards those goals. With the Crusaders occupying the role this show has for kid characters, one now sees why Spike is all too easily switched into a secondary role which usually entails ruining something or being the target of a joke and why there is little thought given to character development on his part. Why have a means when there is no end?

 

This episode is a step in the right direction, finally putting Spike's character through the 22-minute wringer he so sorely needed after the many episodes which ranged from mediocre to bad. I only hope this continues to happen next season, but I see the reasons for why it doesn't.

 

Spike being a misfit is the point of his character, he's not a pony, he's not a pet, he's just different. He doesn't understand how to fit in or many aspects of friendship, but he's learning. There's also a consistent set of themes in almost all of Spike's appearances. They are: dedication, insecurity, self-sacrifice, and greed (latter has been absent for a lot of the season admittedly). Spike may occasionally be on the butt end of the joke (not as much as people make him out to be), but he's definitely not worthless.

 

Post #7 details a short list of his accomplishments: http://mlpforums.com/topic/96202-why-does-spike-get-a-bad-rep-in-the-fandom/

[pony.colin 156]

I had low standards for him. These last two episodes he finally came out kicking and swinging, about time too, the season's almost over

He did well and I was hoping he would finally get thrown a bone before the end.

 

 

Spike being a misfit is the point of his character, he's not a pony, he's not a pet, he's just different. He doesn't understand how to fit in or many aspects of friendship, but he's learning. There's also a consistent set of themes in almost all of Spike's appearances. They are: dedication, insecurity, self-sacrifice, and greed (latter has been absent for a lot of the season admittedly). Spike may occasionally be on the butt end of the joke (not as much as people make him out to be), but he's definitely not worthless.

 

Post #7 details a short list of his accomplishments: http://mlpforums.com/topic/96202-why-does-spike-get-a-bad-rep-in-the-fandom/

 

 

I keep forgetting we had the "Dragon Quest" episode. Now that I think about, that was also a good episode too for Spike.  Spike's always going to be a bit a different.  The obvious thing - he's a dragon living in a pony society.  So there will be some differences that Spike will experience that will be a bit more unique to him.  But Spike has well adjust to being the ONLY dragon living in pony society since birth probably, (previously in Canterlot).  I figured Spike having to deal with being different thing would have gone further, but it seems like there's not going to be a real need for that. 

 

 

Hmm interesting that you mention some of those themes for Spike episodes, now that I think about, those are some good connections.  

 

Anyways, I've had expectations for him, Spike's overcome them now.  Now new expectations for the little guy are in order.

[Dattebayo 2,850]

Mah boi Spike will always have ny respect.

[spacestorm 183]

I think that the problem with Spike is similar to issue with Fluttershy who often suffers from very bad writing which results in a lot of hate from people towards her character.

He has done a lot to deserve to be called mane 6 true friend. Especially for Twilgiht, he accompanied her from her childhood, he always supports her, especially when no other pony is around.
He is a very important figure though very underrated.

And he is different as you mentioned, which makes his character even more interesting.

[Kel_Grym 1,917]

You have no idea.

 

New word for ya'll!

 

Fremdschämen.

 

It's what you feel when you watch and feel someone's embarrassment. Did any of you cringe or even look away when Spike was humiliated before thousands of judging eyes?

 

I sure did.

 

That's what that word means. I can relate to spike a lot in this episode, cause I've done some embarrassing, and downright shameful things in my life I thought I would never recover from.

 

But look at the moral. Spike did recover from it. In fact, it made him stronger.

 

Same thing for me. Same thing for all of us.

 

I feel this especially more so, since I was pretty much a pitiful piece of shit back in the day. Had my ego crushed 9 different ways from hell.

 

P.J.Carrol once said that the clearest view is from the mountain of all your previous dead selves. I really, can't stress that enough.

 

So, as hard as the episode was to watch (cause I feel fremdschämen, probably more so than others) it actually means a lot to me.

Edited May 4, 2014 by KelGrym

[Motion Spark 7,806]

Yeah, he does like to, but he also has no choice. 

is kinda true he has no choice, that's why I prefer to say he wants to serve his friends.

 

@, your post makes me think if it was a mistake to turn something as big as the Equestria Games a Spike episode. They've been preparing for that since season 3 and people were so eager to see how the Equestria Games would be like. From my point of view, even if I didn't get to see the games, the episode was an absolute thrill to watch because it felt so real, the atmosphere of the games felt so real-like.

 

 

 

It's what you feel when you watch and feel someone's embarrassment. Did any of you cringe or even look away when Spike was humiliated before thousands of judging eyes?

I can totally see how this episode can be a lot more emotional that it seemed to be. Spike's reaction when he found out he didn't lit the torch. The awkward aura of the stadium and him when he sang Cloudsdale anthem felt so real... especially when he said 'and it keeps going lalala' it was so funny, so clever yet so awkard. I may not have cringed or looked away, but I felt it so hard.

Also this episode was filled with so many small details that makes the episode worthwhile, for example when he kicked the bag to pretend that he was packing when Twilight found him. And the moral along with that touching bg music...'all the praise in the world means nothing if you don't feel it inside', it's so mature and relatable. 

[Espurr 449]

Spike is a good character. I don't hate him.  Nor do I think he's useless. You're just seeing into this too much.

[Grumpy Enchantress 586]

is kinda true he has no choice, that's why I prefer to say he wants to serve his friends.

I prefer to call him a slave or pet because it's funnier.

[DryGuy84 (Inactive) 927]

Spike is a good character. I don't hate him.  Nor do I think he's useless. You're just seeing into this too much.

 

Or not enough as the case may be, because most of his accomplishments recieve more subdued praise.

[Espurr 449]

Or not enough as the case may be, because most of his accomplishments recieve more subdued praise.

Do you ever think that you're seeing into it too much? He's kind of a kid and kids get praise differently. And maybe in Equestria that's all the praise they can give.

[DryGuy84 (Inactive) 927]

Do you ever think that you're seeing into it too much? He's kind of a kid and kids get praise differently. And maybe in Equestria that's all the praise they can give.

 

Um...I absolutely love Spike, and I didn't mean what I said as a bad thing. In fact, I was agreeing with you, but adding on to your statement, that's all. 

[silvadel 1,393]

What says it all is just how very bad the ratings for Inspiration were.  This shows that Spike is really not a draw to the show as a lead character. 

[Espurr 449]

Um...I absolutely love Spike, and I didn't mean what I said as a bad thing. In fact, I was agreeing with you, but adding on to your statement, that's all. 

Sorry. I didn't know. Spike is good.

[Wind Chaser 4,767]

@, your post makes me think if it was a mistake to turn something as big as the Equestria Games a Spike episode. They've been preparing for that since season 3 and people were so eager to see how the Equestria Games would be like. From my point of view, even if I didn't get to see the games, the episode was an absolute thrill to watch because it felt so real, the atmosphere of the games felt so real-like.

The problem is that the Equestria Games were built up for a year and three months, only to be merely a backdrop for a Spike episode. A good Spike episode? Yes, but it does not match the buildup which was pointing to something of a grander scale.

 

I liked the atmosphere of the whole thing, but it was one great missed opportunity not to have done more with this. Despite everything, the buildup episodes of the arc had self-contained payoffs within them that probably would have rendered anything that would come up now as redundant. The arc of the Equestria Games was disjointed and problematic on the whole and this episode sealed the deal on that.

 

I still find this to be a good, fun episode to watch with the story and the atmosphere, but if you take it into the context that it came out with and its high expectations, it falls flat. I'd love to do a blog on this, if I had the time, about how this show's rigid formatting causes problems for arcs such as this.

[Kel_Grym 1,917]

I loved the episode. Then I watched Tommy's analysis. I usually don't listen to analysists, but he had a point.

 

They missed out on the Equestria games plot. The episode in of itself is still good.

 

[edit: Also, I can't help but feel it was sorta pointless to have back to back Spike episodes]

Edited May 4, 2014 by KelGrym