Otherkin Bronies?

[Techno Universal 2,575]

2 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

 

Wait a minute, let me get this straight.  Not only do you identify as an equestrian pony but you think you're a freaking Alicorn (basically a freaking god).  Damn dude, curb that ego.

Yeah really I'm actually extremely OP for a human in real life because of how talented I am. Plus my personality is literally a perfect combination between the main six so that really does say something to.

[Soaring Symphony 372]

17 minutes ago, Techno Universal said:

Yeah really I'm actually extremely OP for a human in real life because of how talented I am. Plus my personality is literally a perfect combination between the main six so that really does say something to.

Again, curb the ego.

 

2 hours ago, Buck Testa said:

Living in this world is strange and confusing, and you only get one shot at it. After you die, you're just gone. People cope with that fact in different ways. Some believe in magic fairy gods who will give them Heaven after they've been good and send all the bad people they don't like to Hell.

That is a gross oversimplification.  There's a lot more to it then that.  Besides, regardless of religion, there must be some being on a higher plane of reality than us who created the universe.  After all, the universe couldn't have created itself.  It's too complex to just be the result of random chance  It had to come from somewhere.  Not to mention that String theory states there are at least ten dimensions (not just the three we're all familiar with) and the highest dimension is characterized by infinite possibilities.  I don't know about you, but that sounds a lot like God to me.

Edited December 9, 2017 by Soaring Symphony

[Buck Testa 5,505]

10 minutes ago, Soaring Symphony said:

That is a gross oversimplification.  There's a lot more to it then that.  Besides, regardless of religion, there must be some being on a higher plane of reality than us who created the universe.  After all, the universe couldn't have created itself.  It had to come from somewhere.  Not to mention that String theory states there are at least ten dimensions (not just the three we're all familiar with) and the highest dimension is characterized by infinite possibilities.  I don't know about you, but that sounds a lot like God to me.

That's the "god of the gaps" fallacy. Everything science hasn't figured out yet is somehow evidence of god. However the gaps in our knowledge of things like that shrink with each passing year, and no evidence for a god ever creeps up. Nor will it ever, because it is a lie we tell ourselves to get over the finality of death. Just like this otherkin nonsense, or reincarnation, or those suicide cults who think they are going to a spaceship when they die. Not knocking ya for it, death is a scary thing. If you need to believe a magic fairy god exists to make you not have an existential crisis all the time more power to ya. Personally I'd rather face reality as it is. 

 

[Soaring Symphony 372]

30 minutes ago, Buck Testa said:

That's the "god of the gaps" fallacy. Everything science hasn't figured out yet is somehow evidence of god. However the gaps in our knowledge of things like that shrink with each passing year, and no evidence for a god ever creeps up. Nor will it ever, because it is a lie we tell ourselves to get over the finality of death. Just like this otherkin nonsense, or reincarnation, or those suicide cults who think they are going to a spaceship when they die. Not knocking ya for it, death is a scary thing. If you need to believe a magic fairy god exists to make you not have an existential crisis all the time more power to ya. Personally I'd rather face reality as it is. 

God is real dude.  The fact that there are millions of dedicated scientist who are also devout Christians (Ken Ham for example) is a testament to that.  You're just in denial.

 

As for the whole Otherkin thing, I admit it's kind of weird.  But the reason they exist is because they feel on a deep, visceral level that they are something non-human.  I know that's how it is with me and the eagle-fox.  But unlike some Otherkin, I don't attribute that fact to reincarnation or being psychically linked to an AU version of myself or whatever other BS explanation they can come up with.  I know it's all in my head.

Edited December 9, 2017 by Soaring Symphony

[Buck Testa 5,505]

3 minutes ago, Soaring Symphony said:

God is real dude.  The fact that there are millions of dedicated scientist who are also devout Christians (Ken Ham for example) is a testament to that.  You're just in denial.

Ken Ham is a horrible example. He's a YOUNG EARTH creationist, which is like, even more removed from reality than otherkin at this point. He also spent a couple million on making that ark, which just ended up being a waste of lumber and tax dollars and just showed how implausible that story really was. Young Earthers are about as bad as Flat Earthers in terms of just how badly they are ignoring the scientific facts laid out before them. 

Even if you didn't pick someone who wasn't a complete hack ( Francis C Collins for example. He was the director of the Genome Project. fantastic work from him in the past even though I do not agree with his religious angle to some of his theories.) Someone being smart does not mean they cannot be fooled to believe a scam like religion. Hell even Einstein was one, and it ended up preventing him from doing much work in quantum physics because of that whole "god doesn't play with dice" thing. His belief got in the way of him getting further in science than he already achieved. It was a hindrance to him, not a boon. 

Anywho, since this is veering off topic, I'm gonna call it here. You can respond if you like, but this topic's about otherkin.

[Soaring Symphony 372]

2 minutes ago, Buck Testa said:

Ken Ham is a horrible example. He's a YOUNG EARTH creationist, which is like, even more removed from reality than otherkin at this point. He also spent a couple million on making that ark, which just ended up being a waste of lumber and tax dollars and just showed how implausible that story really was. Young Earthers are about as bad as Flat Earthers in terms of just how badly they are ignoring the scientific facts laid out before them. 

Even if you didn't pick someone who wasn't a complete hack ( Francis C Collins for example. He was the director of the Genome Project. fantastic work from him in the past even though I do not agree with his religious angle to some of his theories.) Someone being smart does not mean they cannot be fooled to believe a scam like religion. Hell even Einstein was one, and it ended up preventing him from doing much work in quantum physics because of that whole "god doesn't play with dice" thing. His belief got in the way of him getting further in science than he already achieved. It was a hindrance to him, not a boon. 

Anywho, since this is veering off topic, I'm gonna call it here. You can respond if you like, but this topic's about otherkin.

 

Okay, I admit, Ken Ham wasn't' a great example.  I just don't know very many scientists is all. 

 

But regardless of your own beliefs, I would strongly encourage you to respect the beliefs of other people, even if you don't personally agree with them, and try to exercise some compassion.  No matter who you talk to, you most likely don't know everything about them or what events in their lives led them to the beliefs they have.  When you approach beliefs which differ from your own with statements like this,

Quote

Some believe in magic fairy gods who will give them Heaven after they've been good and send all the bad people they don't like to hell.

you end up showing all the grace of a bull in a china shop.  Are you trying to piss people off?  Be careful what you say to people.  It really does make a big difference. 

[Techno Universal 2,575]

1 hour ago, Soaring Symphony said:

Again, curb the ego.

 

That is a gross oversimplification.  There's a lot more to it then that.  Besides, regardless of religion, there must be some being on a higher plane of reality than us who created the universe.  After all, the universe couldn't have created itself.  It's too complex to just be the result of random chance  It had to come from somewhere.  Not to mention that String theory states there are at least ten dimensions (not just the three we're all familiar with) and the highest dimension is characterized by infinite possibilities.  I don't know about you, but that sounds a lot like God to me.

Yeah honestly I'm just being myself there!

[Flutterstep 47,073]

I met a "pony" once online. They were that convinced they were a pony they took offence every time someone called them a human, even just out of ignorance. They would then attack that person with insults and spread rumours around about them being bullies...hypocrite much? This happened to a few people for the same reason. Worst part was, they would always act as the victim and get more people to harass those who did nothing wrong, and those people would always support them. I just left them to continue living as a selfish egotistical immature human  I must admit, it put me off the fandom a little. I've got nothing against people wanting to identify as things they aren't, but when it goes to the extreme of attack others for simply having different opinions, or for just being unaware of the situation, then you've got serious issues that need sorting out. 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Flutterstep said:

I met a "pony" once online. They were that convinced they were a pony they took offence every time someone called them a human, even just out of ignorance. They would then attack that person with insults and spread rumours around about them being bullies...hypocrite much? This happened to a few people for the same reason. Worst part was, they would always act as the victim and get more people to harass those who did nothing wrong, and those people would always support them. I just left them to continue living as a selfish egotistical immature human  I must admit, it put me off the fandom a little. I've got nothing against people wanting to identify as things they aren't, but when it goes to the extreme of attack others for simply having different opinions, or for just being unaware of the situation, then you've got serious issues that need sorting out. 

Sounds like you've met someone who is somewhat of a tool. lol

Edited December 9, 2017 by Guest

[Will Guide 21,360]

This post is for everyone, but I especially want the people below me to know

@Techno Universal @Buck Testa

I personally don't care if you're human, animal, real, mythical, imaginary, or anything. As long as you're doing good and helping others, instead of doing evil like murder, it's doesn't matter what you see yourself as.

I will however strongly disagree that ALL of Humanity is evil. I believe that all beings start out as blank slates with the capitcity for being good, evil, or even a little of both. It all comes down to the choices we make and what we decide to do with our abilities.

[Azatrot 66]

4 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

Besides, regardless of religion, there must be some being on a higher plane of reality than us who created the universe.  After all, the universe couldn't have created itself.  It's too complex to just be the result of random chance  It had to come from somewhere.

Does the same logic apply to whatever created the universe? This argument is just special pleading.

 

4 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

Not to mention that String theory states there are at least ten dimensions (not just the three we're all familiar with) and the highest dimension is characterized by infinite possibilities.  I don't know about you, but that sounds a lot like God to me.

String theory doesn't state that the 10th dimension is "characterized by infinite possibilities" (whatever that means). That's just something made up by new agers, in the same way as they pretend that quantum physics support various of their claims when it actually doesn't (like psychic powers). It's called quantum quackery, and actual quantum physicists hate that stuff when new agers twist their ideas to support claims that they actually don't support.

3 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

God is real dude.  The fact that there are millions of dedicated scientist who are also devout Christians (Ken Ham for example) is a testament to that.  You're just in denial.

Even if we disregard the poor example of Ken Ham, this is a horrible argument. Just because people believe in something doesn't make it right (Newton believed in astrology, for example). The validity of ideas should be judged on their own merits, and nothing else. And while there is nothing that ourright disproves the existence of an unspecific god, there is nothing that points to it either, and per Occams Razor, it should not be a preferred explanation to unexplained phenomena.

3 hours ago, Buck Testa said:

Someone being smart does not mean they cannot be fooled to believe a scam like religion. Hell even Einstein was one, and it ended up preventing him from doing much work in quantum physics because of that whole "god doesn't play with dice" thing. His belief got in the way of him getting further in science than he already achieved. It was a hindrance to him, not a boon.

Einstein didn't believe in any gods. He was a pantheist (and that was what he was referring to when he talked about god), and as Richard Dawkins said: "Pantheism is just sexed up atheism".

 

3 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

But regardless of your own beliefs, I would strongly encourage you to respect the beliefs of other people, even if you don't personally agree with them, and try to exercise some compassion.  No matter who you talk to, you most likely don't know everything about them or what events in their lives led them to the beliefs they have.  When you approach beliefs which differ from your own with statements like this,

No. Ideas should not be respected. They should be mercilessly analyzed, torn to pieces and have all their flaws pointed out. Only if an idea can stand up to this brutal scrutiny on it's own merits should it be respected, and even then only until new data becomes available that challenges it again. Anything else would be dishonest. And the feelings of those who hold the ideas are completely irrelevant. The universe doesn't care about feelings, and an idea doesn't become more true just because of "feelings". Only merits matter.

 

 

Edited December 10, 2017 by Psychopathrik

[Techno Universal 2,575]

52 minutes ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

This post is for everyone, but I especially want the people below me to know

@Techno Universal @Buck Testa

I personally don't care if you're human, animal, real, mythical, imaginary, or anything. As long as you're doing good and helping others, instead of doing evil like murder, it's doesn't matter what you see yourself as.

I will however strongly disagree that ALL of Humanity is evil. I believe that all beings start out as blank slates with the capitcity for being good, evil, or even a little of both. It all comes down to the choices we make and what we decide to do with our abilities.

Yeah like with me I've actually got quite a few negative traits that are built into me but what's amazing is that those negative traits mix into me in such a way that they cause me to do more good. Like one of them is desire for power and control but it's really so I can make sure everything runs better than how others would run stuff. Though even if I was in power I would still be highly dependent on the opinions and criticism from the community for making my decisions so I can basically make everything accomodate the best to everyone.

[Soaring Symphony 372]

1 hour ago, Psychopathrik said:

No. Ideas should not be respected. They should be mercilessly analyzed, torn to pieces and have all their flaws pointed out. Only if an idea can stand up to this brutal scrutiny on it's own merits should it be respected, and even then only until new data becomes available that challenges it again. Anything else would be dishonest. And the feelings of those who hold the ideas are completely irrelevant. The universe doesn't care about feelings, and an idea doesn't become more true just because of "feelings". Only merits matter.

Actually, when you really think it through, the universe does "care" about peoples emotions to some extent.  After all, it's those very emotions that drive human behavior, which in turn can alter the course of history.  For example, one of the main reasons that black people in America aren't still slaves is because one dude more than 150 years ago thought they were being treated unfairly and wasn't having any of that.  His actions were fueled by his empathy and strong sense of justice, and look what it lead to.  

 

I will rephrase my earlier statement though.  Ideas shouldn't necessarily be respected, but the people who believe those ideas should.  Like I said, if you disagree with someone else's beliefs, odds are you don't actually know that person very well.  You probably don't know what sort of events happened in that persons life to lead them to the conclusions they've arrived at.  Even crazy, radical suicide bombers, in a way, can be sort of sympathetic in the sense that they only believe what they do because most of the time, they've been brainwashed all their lives and don't know any better.  

 

The point I'm trying to make is that it's important to actually listen to the other person and try to understand things from their point of view before you straight up call BS on their beliefs, no matter how much you might disagree.  I know from personal experience that exercising some compassion and understanding, rather than just being a bull in a china shop, goes a long way toward making life a lot less crappy for everyone. 

 

In other words, as they often say in Christian churches, love the sinner, hate the sin.  Or, in Brony terminology, "love and tolerate".  I know we've all heard that phrase a million times, but when was the last time you actually tried to live by it.

 

Regardless of how you frame it, it's the same idea.  Treat other people with agape love (look it up), respect and compassion, no matter who they are, what they believe, or even what they've done.  Do that, and you're life will go so much better.

Edited December 10, 2017 by Soaring Symphony

[Azatrot 66]

8 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

Actually, when you really think it through, the universe does "care" about peoples emotions to some extent.  After all, it's those very emotions that drive human behavior, which in turn can alter the course of history.  For example, one of the main reasons that black people in America aren't still slaves is because one dude more than 150 years ago thought they were being treated unfairly and wasn't having any of that.  His actions were fueled by his empathy and strong sense of justice, and look what it lead to. 

I, umm... I guess you got me there. I will give you that. But what I meant was that while the feelings themselves can drive us to change the universe (usually a rather small part of it), they don't influence the validity of an idea; The Earth doesn't become flatter just because we feel that it should, or because it would hurt our feelings if the idea of a flat Earth wasn't true. Feelings CAN however motivate us to build a giant rolling pin to flatten the Earth with. So in that way the universe care about our feelings.

8 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

I will rephrase my earlier statement though.  Ideas shouldn't necessarily be respected, but the people who believe those ideas should.

Yes, I agree. We should be completely merciless to ideas, but not to the persons holding the ideas. It would also be logically fallacious to attack the persons rather than the ideas, since as I said: Ideas should stand on their own merits.

9 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

Like I said, if you disagree with someone else's beliefs, odds are you don't actually know that person very well.  You probably don't know what sort of events happened in that persons life to lead them to the conclusions they've arrived at.

But that's irrelevant. As I just said: Merits! The events that lead a person to hold a particular idea have no impact on the validity of the idea. The Earth doesn't get flatter just because the flat-earther have a sympathic reason to believe that the Earth is flat. Ideas must stand on their own.

9 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

The point I'm trying to make is that it's important to actually listen to the other person and try to understand things from their point of view before you straight up call BS on their beliefs, no matter how much you might disagree.

Partly agree, partly disagree. It's important to listen to the empirical evidence and logical reasoning that lead the person to believe what they believe. Ideas should be given a fair chance, even outlandish ones.

9 hours ago, Soaring Symphony said:

Regardless of how you frame it, it's the same idea.  Treat other people with agape love (look it up), respect and compassion, no matter who they are, what they believe, or even what they've done.  Do that, and you're life will go so much better.

Compassion is of course good. I'm not contesting that. But when analyzing ideas, the purpose isn't to make ones life "go so much better". It's to figure out if the idea have any validity. It's about being honest, even when it's difficult.

[Buck Testa 5,505]

11 hours ago, Psychopathrik said:

Einstein didn't believe in any gods. He was a pantheist (and that was what he was referring to when he talked about god), and as Richard Dawkins said: "Pantheism is just sexed up atheism".

Even more reason not to take other peoples words at face value and scrutinize everything. I didn't know that about Einstein, went to go look it up after I read this. His quote on the subject definitely feels more thought out than other religious ideas I've seen (though it does have a bit of a watchmaker fallacy to it), I can respect that. 

 

11 hours ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

This post is for everyone, but I especially want the people below me to know

@Techno Universal @Buck Testa

I personally don't care if you're human, animal, real, mythical, imaginary, or anything. As long as you're doing good and helping others, instead of doing evil like murder, it's doesn't matter what you see yourself as.

I will however strongly disagree that ALL of Humanity is evil. I believe that all beings start out as blank slates with the capitcity for being good, evil, or even a little of both. It all comes down to the choices we make and what we decide to do with our abilities.

I...agree I guess? Not sure why I'm @'ed here

[Concerned Bystander 2,902]

The main problem I have with the entire otherkin thing is being uncertain of intent of those claiming it.  If they see it as being some sort of roleplay thing then I would take no issue with that as long as they know when its use is, and is not, appropriate.  Similarly if someone sees a fox, dragon, pony or whatever else as being some sort of a totem animal that they think represents their personality in some way then again, circumstances willing, such a thing is not entirely untoward.

The problem comes with a third category, those people who claim that they are in fact a non-human spirit inhabiting a human body.  The problem I have with these people is that I just do not buy for a second that they genuinely believe this.  I'm sure most of those people would deny that it is nothing more than wilful fantasy, but there isn't much that will convince me that that they are not doing it to fit in with a certain crowd, to stand out in another, or for some other reason.

That being said, at the end of the day people are entitled to their fantasies and it doesn't really affect me personally in any way apart from those few occasions where I decide to weigh in on a discussion on the subject such as I am doing in writing this.