Octavia's Hall Critics

[Killian Jones 2,656]

Dear fellow ponies of the forums. Heed our call! We have noticed a slight trend going around the halls of Octavia. A trend in which critique seeking artists have gone empty handed in their quest for contructive comments. The problem is not the fact that some ponies do not wish to praise; it's the fact that advice and tips are often nonexistent inside the comments following a posting of art. Sometimes, artists value some of that harsh negativity or simply want to see the end result through another's eyes.

 

So what we are proposing is a dedicated team of members who wish to lend helping hoof to those hoping to seek a proper critique of their art. To provide a positive, and well thought out, response in the discussions within Octavia's Hall. All we ask of you is to be able to provide positive criticism to pieces of art posted. Encourage our artists to make things better. We would very much appreciate members who wish to dedicate themselves to help make our forums even better.

 

But that doesn't mean the other members should hold back on creating critiques, but these members who are approved are to provide quality critiques as well as encouraging members to make lengthier posts, with more quality than we have seen in the recent past.

 

So who is with me? Who thinks they have the ability to provide quality critiques and help supply positive and supportive criticism on each piece of art posted on the forums?

 

If you feel that you are qualified, please apply today at the following link:

 

Link the to application

[Skye Starlight 223]

This is a good idea... Although, I'm not that great a critic, so I won't be applying

[Tom 891]

This does sound like a good idea, I won't be participating though.

But I hope you can get some members to help out with this.

[Strife 455]

Interesting.

 

I like the fancy application form.

 

Application forms please my OCD.

[Finesthour 7,289]

I have applied~

[FedoraMemes 582]

I'm thinking about applying, but I think it would just be easier if I commented on art that I liked. I don't know, I'll think about it some more and then see.

[Killian Jones 2,656]

Please do remember to always be insightful and nice, and if possible, lend your own expertise or keen eye..

[Typhoid Libby 1,265]

Criticism cannot be based on elective method, this will set the baseline of critique, and that critique will be bland.

 

If there is no input to be given, it should not be forced or tried to be forced in to existence.

 

Criticism should never be rewarded, noted, but not rewarded.

By this, you set standards on art by a very limited target group set by very limited standards.

 

You dedicate a team to this, and the quality of critique will drop.

And critique is quality, even more so than the art.

If it did not happen before, it was not done because people chose to do so. (or, rather, choose not to do so.)

 

Do this, and you will have the same "chosen" members running around copy-pasting their "critique" to every thread that pops up because it is their "job" to do so.

Who sets the standards to the selection of this team, will set the standards for art in this forum.

 

Art does not have standards and there are only personal viewpoints on it.

Technical aspects of the pieces of art are subjective as well and this is enforcing hard set of limits on subjective content.

 

Enforced bias on subjective content is de-constructive in a environment that is supposed to be based on free sharing of information.

 

Nevermind the fact that people applying for this will apply based on bragging rights more than on any real merit.

Your pool of possible draftees is biased from the get-go.

 

Might wanna re-think this, honestly.

[Doctor XFizzle 8,672]

everything said above

 

I agree with this. Others should be encouraged to give critiques, not assigned to. If a piece of art doesn't receive the input it desires, then it just doesn't. If the artist is going to grow, the advice/criticism should be natural and organic and given by anyone, not a select group of users.

Edited June 16, 2012 by Doctor XFizzle

[Shankveld 4,951]

I applied, but I'm not sure if it was received or not? ~

[FALCON PUNCH 244]

did you receive my application?

[Nas 2,874]

How about something like DeviantArt's “Critiqie” feature? This picture actually expresses my take on this situation quite perfectly~

 

[go away seb 367]

I have a kind of talent on criticizing other people's stuff. I just never really use it because I'm afraid I would be looked at as some idiot.

[Twilight Sparkle ✨ 8,529]

To those concerned, this is only an experiment for now. The idea is to create a small group of members whom artists can generally count on to get more than just a "that's the best picture I've ever seen!" comment from. That's really the whole point of it. It was not mentioned at any point that these critics would be rewarded in any way. There was a system similar to this at an old forum I used to go to, and it generally worked very well. I don't see the harm in trying.

 

I'm aware that it's not perfect and that there are a number of problems with this approach, but we want to see how it will go down. If it crashes and burns, or we implement a better "system," I don't feel any regrets in dropping it.

 

I applied, but I'm not sure if it was received or not? ~

 

did you receive my application?

 

Yes, both of your applications have been received.

 

How about something like DeviantArt's “Critiqie” feature? This picture actually expresses my take on this situation quite perfectly~

 

 

Nothing in the IPS suite can natively accommodate something like that, which is why we want to try having a "critic team" whose responsibility it would be to write constructive feedback. Our current "system" for posting art has the artist creating your everyday forum thread (OP + replies to it). Creating a critique system like deviantART's would require custom development, which we don't have too many resources for. I agree that it's a more elegant solution, though. I'll see what I can do.

[Neikos 968]

words

 

Just let users put a 'critique-wanted' tag into the tag field, it would allow everyone to quickly find pieces to... critique?

[Doctor XFizzle 8,672]

I guess the next question I would ask is, will the critique crew only go into topics where the artist is looking for advice/feedback? If I'm just displaying my work to share, then I wouldn't want someone telling me how to edit it and fix it.

 

Neikos ninja'd me with a great idea that would solve what I just said lol

Edited June 16, 2012 by Doctor XFizzle

[NavelColt 22,883]

I'll try and give lengthier, 'critique' material on pieces more often, but I'm not about to join a team that is going to expect me to do it frequently xP

 

Nice idea though, should help out quite a bit.

[Nah 3,182]

In the process of applying, I'm kinda known for giving small advice for changes.

[Strife 455]

-snip-

 

That feature on DA is nice, but anything that deals with a number / star system leads to lazy critiques and assuming statistics. Oftentimes, people will be more inclined to pop in some star ratings and rely on those to say what they mean, giving far less detailed feedback than they would need to write down when compared a system that does not use number/stars.

 

Furthermore, anyone viewing the critique will be far more inclined to take the TL;DR approach and just look at the numbers/stars and ignore the text.

 

I agree with this. Others should be encouraged to give critiques, not assigned to. If a piece of art doesn't receive the input it desires, then it just doesn't. If the artist is going to grow, the advice/criticism should be natural and organic and given by anyone, not a select group of users.

 

The team is by volunteer only. No one is being assigned to anything, the person is volunteering to help people by critiquing work.

 

-snip-

 

Elective is the only way to properly give feedback. Nothing is being forced. A person elects to volunteer for the position.

 

As for bias, of course that will be present. That exists in nearly every critique in existence, as the nature of the critique (in part) is to say if and how you liked it.

 

Although any good critique will be a two-part system. One part that includes subjective matters (grammar, style, tone, and other literary techniques) and objectives matters (likes/dislikes, etc).

 

I guess the next question I would ask is, will the critique crew only go into topics where the artist is looking for advice/feedback? If I'm just displaying my work to share, then I wouldn't want someone telling me how to edit it and fix it.

 

Neikos ninja'd me with a great idea that would solve what I just said lol

 

I would imagine that the system would be submission based.

 

A person submits their art for critique and then the kraken reviewers are released.

[Chigens and Kay 3,833]

I agree to this proposal.

 

Good, quality feedback is something that I hardly see here.

 

Not to bash anyone but seeing "awesome, good job" or something along those lines doesn't cut it. For me anyway.

[Finesthour 7,289]

I really don't see why people are complaining.

 

I actually already critique people's work from time to time. And if I had a job to do so, I would have the motivation to do so much more.

Just because it would be someone's job to critique something, doesn't mean it is bland.

 

Using that logic, every single movie reviewer whose job is to review movies is bland, because it's their job.

[FedoraMemes 582]

I've made my decision. I have chosen not to apply, because I don't feel as if I have the time to be able to critique all of the art that I have been assigned to do. However, I will still pop into Octavia's Hall and comment on peoples art. I feel as if it would be easier for me to do that, as I can do it in my spare time, and decide how long or short my comment would be.

[Killian Jones 2,656]

I guess the next question I would ask is, will the critique crew only go into topics where the artist is looking for advice/feedback? If I'm just displaying my work to share, then I wouldn't want someone telling me how to edit it and fix it.

 

Neikos ninja'd me with a great idea that would solve what I just said lol

 

There is nothing keeping people from pontificating exactly why they liked a piece.

 

Make quality posts. Posts - and threads - that lack content are not allowed and may be deleted without notice. Repeatedly creating posts and/or threads that are off-topic, spammy, or otherwise pointless will result in your posting capabilities becoming restricted.

 

When a lot of people simply post "well done" "I like it" "you did good". They aren't truly adhering to this rule, and because it is such a widespread case, we'd rather encourage members to try harder. By seeing others do so. It's nice to know that you are being appreciated, it's better to know why you are being appreciated. That is the least you can do.

 

I'm not saying a critique wanted tag is a bad idea, but it shouldn't stand in the way of simply making good posts.

Edited June 17, 2012 by Tichonea

[Strife 455]

-alert-

 

 

Question:

25ish hours from the thread creation, what is the project's progress thus far? Simply curious.

 

And a question I meant to ask yesterday:

Will those who have applied be made aware if their application was rejected?

[FedoraMemes 582]

When a lot of people simply post "well done" "I like it" "you did good". They aren't truly adhering to this rule, and because it is such a widespread case, we'd rather encourage members to try harder. By seeing others do so. It's nice to know that you are being appreciated, it's better to know why you are being appreciated. That is the least you can do.

 

I'm not saying a critique wanted tag is a bad idea, but it shouldn't stand in the way of simply making good posts.

 

This is what I technically do already. If I feel that there is room for improvement in the piece, I will add my points, and praise the work that has already been done.