Why did Discord betray the Mane 6?

[NomDeSpite 452]

Because Discord is still new to this whole "friendship" thing and he has some growing to do (hence, no throne). Back when he was a villain, he didn't have any friends. So it's understandable (wrong, but understandable) that he would think, for a moment, out of ignorance, that there is something greater than the love of friendship.

[Truffles 2,033]

What if he didn't? What if he captured Tirek and did his job like he was told?

 

Everything would be fine and dandy, but Twilight still wouldn't have gotten her key. There is still the possibility in a world like Equestria that an even greater evil is out there. There always is. Discord saw the problem with Twilight, bookmarked the parts in the book she needed to put the pieces together and capitalized on Tirek's return to accelerate the process of unlocking the box.

 

^^^^THIS. This is what I think has been bothering me about Discord's motivations during the episode. He went through the trouble of basically leading the Mane 6 right to the answer on how to unlock the box, presumably thinking its power would be needed to beat some enemy - maybe Tirek, or maybe somepony else later.

 

But the trouble is, you're right that if it was to beat Tirek, it wasn't necessary to bookmark anything because all he had to do was lead Tirek to Celestia in chains, problem solved. So logically speaking it seems to indicate it really is for some future evil that Discord knows about that he's not telling.

 

So I guess the thing about Discord that's bugging me (or more accurately the story) is when the episode ended, there weren't any questions asked by the Mane 6 why Discord did the bookmarking for them? If he's powering them up for the future battle, a little foreshadowing would have been good right before the episode closed.

 

I guess another possibility with the bookmarking is Discord didn't trust himself to turn in Tirek, and led the ponies to the rainbow power as a backup plan in case his conscience failed.

[Glike 487]

To me, it seemed Discord's only true friend before this whole fiasco was Fluttershy. None of the other Mane Six truly did try and make an effort to befriend him, and it seems like Fluttershy was the only one who saw him on a daily basis. So because of this, he felt it was better to have a friend with power then one who couldn't give anything but friendship. Plus, he's the god of chaos, so the fact that he was practically born to spread chaos has to have some bit of a factor in this.

[Metemponychosis 1,259]

I knew Discord was going to betray them at one point ever since Keep Calm and Flutter On.

Prick...

 

At least now I think that his turnaround was better implemented.

[Kel_Grym 1,917]

 

 

I guess another possibility with the bookmarking is Discord didn't trust himself to turn in Tirek, and led the ponies to the rainbow power as a backup plan in case his conscience failed.

 

That is another possibility. Discord has a weird way of thinking. Being a being of chaos, I wouldn't be surprised if he could think of several different things literally at the same time. If were were to make a logic tree of his thoughts and plans, we'd probably find several hundred branches going off in crazy directions, and many paths stuck in a state of quantum indeterminacy, continually shifting the logical paths below them.

 

He probably can't make complete sense of them, so he has to make back up plans for back up plans, especially when he knows his conscious might fail him, or...

 

If he knows his conscious needs to fail him for a particular set of circumstances to happen.

 

Also, he could just be winging it.

[Quill Waver 1,408]

Because the allurement of power, wealth, and control is a tantalizing thing.

 

He traded out to hopefully gain back his throne he held 1000+ years ago along side Tirek.

[Kel_Grym 1,917]

It does bring up another question, though. Discord really didn't let loose the CHAOS like he could have done. No chocolate rain or trees running around on legs. He paved a way for Tirek, but didn't use the full of extent of his power as he would have if he were really going to go full on evil.

 

Simply put, he held back.

[Quill Waver 1,408]

It does bring up another question, though. Discord really didn't let loose the CHAOS like he could have done. No chocolate rain or trees running around on legs. He paved a way for Tirek, but didn't use the full of extent of his power as he would have if he were really going to go full on evil.

 

Simply put, he held back.

Potentially guilty-feeling for betraying his friends, which we did see throughout.

[Guest90210 3,568]

Discord had every chance imaginable to usher in his reign of chaos again ever since the season premiere, but he chose not to because he was reformed. It really doesn't make sense how he suddenly changes his mind and abandons all character development he's had since Season 3.

 

 

What if he didn't? What if he captured Tirek and did his job like he was told?

 

Everything would be fine and dandy, but Twilight still wouldn't have gotten her key. There is still the possibility in a world like Equestria that an even greater evil is out there. There always is. Discord saw the problem with Twilight, bookmarked the parts in the book she needed to put the pieces together and capitalized on Tirek's return to accelerate the process of unlocking the box.

 

He never implies that it was all a plan to "accelerate the process of unlocking the box". Even when Fluttershy is crying and the Mane 6 are locked in a cage, he still doesn't care or reveal any sort of scheme that in any way helps the ponies. While watching, I was waiting for something like this to happen but it never did.

 

Discord? OOC? He's chaos.

 

In character, out of character and notions of character, don't apply to the master of plans within plans.

 

That's old Discord. Reformed Discord refrains from using his chaos to harm anyone to any extreme extent, especially doing something such as what was shown in this episode (joining forces with an evil tyrant and planning to practically enslave everyone).

Edited May 11, 2014 by Rivendare

[Cuddleshy 49]

It was fate. It may have been temptation or it could have been out of fear. Either way, if it weren't for Discord's betrayal,  Twilight would not have gotten her key. That is the purpose Discord played.

[Captain Brony (MG11) 218]

Though Discord found that he liked friendship in Keep Calm and Flutter On he didn't actually know the real weight or power friendship had.

Despite being an ally Discord still believed that power was greater than friendship thus his priorities were skewed.

 

It wasn't until when he lost his power that he realized that friendship was more valuable than he originally believed.

What's so great about this is that we see that Discord understands the true weight of his betrayal. He mourns over the friendship he had while also apologizing for what he did. He continued to help the Mane 6 and expected no forgiveness because he understood why someone wouldn't take him back in after what he did.

 

This is a surprisingly big step for Discord which makes up for the lack of development for Twilight in the finale.

Edited May 11, 2014 by Captain Brony (MG11)

[Kel_Grym 1,917]

Discord had every chance imaginable to usher in his reign of chaos again ever since the season premiere, but he chose not to because he was reformed. It really doesn't make sense how he suddenly changes his mind and abandons all character development he's had since Season 3.

 

 

He never implies that it was all a plan to "accelerate the process of unlocking the box". Even when Fluttershy is crying and the Mane 6 are locked in a cage, he still doesn't care or reveal any sort of scheme that in any way helps the ponies. While watching, I was waiting for something like this to happen but it never did.

 

 

That's old Discord. Reformed Discord refrains from using his chaos to harm anyone to any extreme extent, especially doing something such as what was shown in this episode (joining forces with an evil tyrant and planning to practically enslave everyone).

 

You got a point. My theory would hold more water if there was just SOME implication of it, not that there needs to be an implication for it for me to still fancy my theory in my own head canon.

 

In the end, it's either my delusions that it was a convoluted plan of Discord, or facing the reality of mistreatment of Discord's character.

 

I prefer to substitute the truth with my own.

[Grumpy Enchantress 586]

Because he thought Fluttershy was best pony, but it turned out, Pinkie Pie was best pony, and he couldn't live with his sins.

Fixed that for you. 

 

PINKIE PIE IS THE BEST!!!!!!!! 

Same reasons Judas had to betray Jesus.

 

Discord knew he had to do it, even though he didn't like it.

This wasn't even remotely like the Gospel at all. Betraying them had no advantage unlike an argument you could make for Jesus dying for sins and needing to be betrayed. It's not even kind of similar. 

[LZRD WZRD 1,929]

He betrayed them because for 99% of his life he has wanted to be the chaotic ruler of Equestria. He was offered what he has always desired. His reformation was still rather recent and then he didn't have any real choice. His only real friend was Fluttershy and even then it's been clear all season he was not 100% reformed. This episode is the completion of a great/realistic character arc. Loved it and love Discord. His remorse was genuine and I think now he truly values friendship. I love the exchange when he tells Fluttershy that he's sorry and she says "I know". Not its okay or I forgive you, but I know. She knows Discord has faults but still refuses to give up on him and understands why he is acting this way. Great moment for both of them

[Kel_Grym 1,917]

Fixed that for you. 

 

PINKIE PIE IS THE BEST!!!!!!!! 

This wasn't even remotely like the Gospel at all. Betraying them had no advantage unlike an argument you could make for Jesus dying for sins and needing to be betrayed. It's not even kind of similar. 

 

It's not a play by play copy, that's for sure.

 

Consider it a very loose interpretation. The episode certainly has many of the themes of the Gospels.

 

Forgiveness (of discord)

Sacrifice (of the princesses)

A New Kingdom (twilight's kingdom)

Ascension (Rainbow Power)

Betrayal by a "friend" (Discord)

 

My logic is that Jesus would not have ascended to his glory without the role Judas played in his betrayal. Twilight would not have ascended to her glory without the betrayal of Discord.

 

It's a "loose" interpretation.

[Grumpy Enchantress 586]

It's not a play by play copy, that's for sure.

 

Consider it a very loose interpretation. The episode certainly has many of the themes of the Gospels.

 

Forgiveness (of discord)

Sacrifice (of the princesses)

A New Kingdom (twilight's kingdom)

Ascension (Rainbow Power)

Betrayal by a "friend" (Discord)

 

My logic is that Jesus would not have ascended to his glory without the role Judas played in his betrayal. Twilight would not have ascended to her glory without the betrayal of Discord.

 

It's a "loose" interpretation.

Twilight still could have defeated him if he was weak and pathetic, though. 

[Kel_Grym 1,917]

Twilight still could have defeated him if he was weak and pathetic, though. 

 

 

It's probably true, if she met him in  his weakened form.

 

However, if we were to grant my theory relevance, then the point wasn't to defeat Tirek, Tirek could have been handled by Discord.

 

The point, was to create that situation, in which Twilight gets her key and unlocks the Rainbow Power.

 

I feel that Discord felt, that for whatever reason, it wasn't happening fast enough, or might not have ever happened, if he didn't take his fall from grace and create those events.

 

Still it's just a theory.

[Steel Accord 6,660]

I think it was because Tirac knew how to select his words carefully enough to appeal to Discord. I mean think about it. Discord is the spirit of Chaos, he is pandemonium and spontaneity incarnate.

 

Sure, Discord wanted to reform because he never knew what it meant to have something given to him that he didn't have to take by force. However, Tirac was clever in pointing out that friendship is a responsibility. Which is entirely true!

 

"I like it better my way, but when you're friends, you can't always have things exactly the way you want." His words people! Ask those who were formerly addicts or even criminals. Not all, but in many cases, they struggle with not relapsing back into their old ways.

 

I think Discord's reformation is both heartwarmingly believable as well as believably fragile. He wasn't just magically zapped into being a good guy, he wanted to change for someone! By that very nature, he also is easily swayed to his old ways when it looks like the tables are turning in favor of a more powerful entity.

 

The lynchpin was that Tirec did not offer Discord power, which he had plenty of, but freedom, something that he then believed he had lost or was compromised.

Edited September 12, 2014 by Steel Accord

[Guest90210 3,568]

Tirek manipulated him. Discord is still fairly new at the whole "friendship" business, he's still not used to it. I doubt it would happen again.

 

"New"? He's been in the friendship business since Season 3. He's visited the Mane 6 several times in episodes, and it's implied that him and Fluttershy have picnics and friendly get-togethers often.

[Adorkable 2,737]

Discord needed to experience a serious situation, like the literal possibility of Equestria's end, all relying on the power of Princess Twilight. I don't think he was truly reformed until he realized how much of a messed up situation he was in from what he had caused joining forces with Tirek. He needed a life changing experience to be fully reformed.

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

http://boards.4chan.org/mlp/thread/17694690/implying-discord-actually-joined-up-with-tirek

I know it is 4chan, but it does make some sense. Tirak would have taken weeks to get enough power to directly challenge the Alicorns, all the while leaving Equestria without weather or food control. The disasters that could have set in would have killed more than Tireks very short, almost 3 day "rule" and uprising. Discord also bookmarked the pages were Twilight could come to the conclusion about the keys, and Discord just so happened to give twilight her key.

 

That wink at the end was him acknowledging that everything wen according to plan.

[Saphipony 22]

I just find it funny how Discord could be easily manipulated like that and beaten at his own game. I mean being the Master of Trickery and Deception and all things Chaotic, I didn't expect Discord to be overthrown, I expected him to fight back.

[Sindle 40]

It is fairly common for someone to experience a form of relapse, it happened to my brother after he quit smoking only for him to go back. So it isn't entirely OOC for Discord to go back to being a conqueror rather than the trickster.

 

But I guess even Fluttershy wasn't enough for him to not Relapse. Frankly i'm surprised he didn't ask her to join him, as even when he went into it he struggled to want to lose their friendship.

[Bucky McGillyCuddy 956]

Tirek promised him not only friendship but also the freedom to cause chaos. Which the Mane 6 couldn't offer him. So I can't say I'm surprised that he betrayed them, all the way through season 4 you could see that Discord was still showing signs of rebellious behaviour. He is the Embodiment of Chaos after all you can't expect someone to change who they are there will always be a little bit of villain in Discord if you ask me. 

[Guest90210 3,568]

http://boards.4chan.org/mlp/thread/17694690/implying-discord-actually-joined-up-with-tirek

I know it is 4chan, but it does make some sense. Tirak would have taken weeks to get enough power to directly challenge the Alicorns, all the while leaving Equestria without weather or food control. The disasters that could have set in would have killed more than Tireks very short, almost 3 day "rule" and uprising. Discord also bookmarked the pages were Twilight could come to the conclusion about the keys, and Discord just so happened to give twilight her key.

 

That wink at the end was him acknowledging that everything wen according to plan.

 

Then why did they go through the whole "Discord, you're my friend!", and Discord being all sad and whatever having to learn the same lesson of friendship again? Why wouldn't he have gone "Oh, by the way, this was the plan the entire time"? That's entering headcannon territory, which is fine, but I still don't buy it.