When will America die out?

[Steel Accord 6,658]

Nah mate, the US would just invade Canada for resources.

 

We tried that once.

 

http://www.cracked.com/article_18722_5-unfought-wars-that-would-have-changed-everything.html

 

All came down to a "not worth it," they make better neighbors who already sell their resources.

 

And they gave us Tara Strong! 

 

GOD BLESS YOU CANADA!

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

We tried that once.

 

http://www.cracked.com/article_18722_5-unfought-wars-that-would-have-changed-everything.html

 

All came down to a "not worth it," they make better neighbors who already sell their resources.

 

And they gave us Tara Strong! 

 

GOD BLESS YOU CANADA!

Yea, but they got rid of their british friends. No large army to help them out against the worlds largest navy, and second largest army now.

And all those hungry Americans, looking for new sources of hamburgers.........

[Steel Accord 6,658]

Just to point out; the government and regimes of those "countries" you have mentioned have changed greatly, roughly at about the 300 year mark. In our context, if America had a war among itself resulting in a President that drafted a new constitution and governed for 30 years before selecting a successor, I would not call that America as founded in 1776. Thus a different country, although "America" it would still be called. Same situation with Japan (power going back and forth between different Emperors and Shogun ) , China ( Dynasties galore ), Egypt ( Dynasties, Sultans, and plenty others ), and countless others throughout time, and let's not talk about how many times the government was overhauled in France during the 1800's.

 

I'm not insulting any country, just pointing out that when one speaks of nations throughout time, you are not necessarily talking about the same country; Example: Which Egypt? Old Kingdom, New Kingdom, Ptolemy dynasty, Ottoman Egypt, or it's current Modern Day form? And even that is a very short list for a single country, especially in the case of Egypt.

 

I'm well aware of the reality of a regime change. My point is that that actual identity of what it means to be American is much more resilient than any American Government.

 

"One who believes in pan-human liberty, not limited by race, gender, or creed" casts a pretty wide net in my thought. 

Yea, but they got rid of their british friends. No large army to help them out against the worlds largest navy, and second largest army now.

And all those hungry Americans, looking for new sources of hamburgers.........

 

Dude, it ain't gonna happen!

 

You'd have Americans near the border fighting the army to defend their neighbors! The army would not even get so far as to marching because no General would be stupid enough to invade a friendly ally, no President would jeopardize his reelection chances, and Congress already can't decide shit!

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

I'm well aware of the reality of a regime change. My point is that that actual identity of what it means to be American is much more resilient than any American Government.

 

"One who believes in pan-human liberty, not limited by race, gender, or creed" casts a pretty wide net in my thought. 

 

Dude, it ain't gonna happen!

 

You'd have Americans near the border fighting the army to defend their neighbors! The army would not even get so far as to marching because no General would be stupid enough to invade a friendly ally, no President would jeopardize his reelection chances, and Congress already can't decide shit!

They need their burgers man. And Canadia has plenty of room for more mcdonalds farms. Plenty of new oil to take, and tons of trees for our Big Mac boxes.

[Steel Accord 6,658]

They need their burgers man. And Canadia has plenty of room for more mcdonalds farms. Plenty of new oil to take, and tons of trees for our Big Mac boxes.

 

All of which can be sold to us without bloodshed! Canada is already a trading partner of ours. Why damage that friendship?

[Aura 120]

I don't see how a country like the United States of America could die out, only lose its status as a superpower as well as the respect of its allies.  

[DubWolf 16,619]

Maybe another civil war will break out? Then extremists take over and we become the next North Korea...

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

All of which can be sold to us without bloodshed! Canada is already a trading partner of ours. Why damage that friendship?

Because, freedom isn't free, it costs folks like you n' me.

Will you chip in your buck 'o five?

[Steel Accord 6,658]

Maybe another civil war will break out? Then extremists take over and we become the next North Korea...

 

Well we already had one. And that's actually a scenario that comes up in fiction a lot. My thinking is that, if we are aware enough of something that we can make up fictional scenarios of it, the chances of it actually happening decrease dramatically.

Because, freedom isn't free, it costs folks like you n' me.

Will you chip in your buck 'o five?

 

You're right, it isn't. I and . . . probably thousands of Americans would not stand to fight our allies, our own soldiers would throw down their rifles in protest if it came to that.

 

Why? Because waging war against those who have been our friends is not freedom.

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

Well we already had one. And that's actually a scenario that comes up in fiction a lot. My thinking is that, if we are aware enough of something that we can make up fictional scenarios of it, the chances of it actually happening decrease dramatically.

 

You're right, it isn't. I and . . . probably thousands of Americans would not stand to fight our allies, our own soldiers would throw down their rifles in protest if it came to that.

 

Why? Because waging war against those who have been our friends is not freedom.

It is freedom. Because the government says it is. And what they say goes.

Now eat this Big Mac or I'm calling the NSA.

[Discordian 6,013]

When and if America dies out all people like myself (as in: People who don't care about what happens to the country or the politics behind it one bit) have to do is move to another country that is relatively similar to this one and life will go on exactly the same as it did before.

 

That's assuming that by "dying out" you mean that as a country it is reformed to be like another country that is completely different from what we have no or becomes the victim of a mass nuclear war or something.

 

If America were to, say, be totally taken over by a country exactly like ours then there wouldn't necessarily be any change at all.

 

So it's not so much of a "when" but a "how"

[Steel Accord 6,658]

It is freedom. Because the government says it is. And what they say goes.

Now eat this Big Mac or I'm calling the NSA.

 

Call them and I'll shove that Big Mac up their ass and introduce them the definition of the real Big Mac's Apple Bucking!

 

In general, the Government can go to Hell for all I care.

 

At this point, I can tell you aren't being serious so I apologize for not getting the joke. But if there's one thing most Americans can agree on, a government that can order you to shoot your neighbor is not one worth supporting.

It is freedom. Because the government says it is. And what they say goes.

Now eat this Big Mac or I'm calling the NSA.

 

Do you truly believe the government defines what freedom means?

[DubWolf 16,619]

Well we already had one. And that's actually a scenario that comes up in fiction a lot. My thinking is that, if we are aware enough of something that we can make up fictional scenarios of it, the chances of it actually happening decrease dramatically.

The rebels lost. The United States was later reconstructed to its former self. I meant to say a revolution where things change drastically and radically. Other countries would do to us what we didn't do to North Korea earlier this year...

 

Aaand guess who just "re-newed" their threats again?

Edited May 13, 2014 by Super80 Wolf

[Virgil 685]

I'm well aware of the reality of a regime change. My point is that that actual identity of what it means to be American is much more resilient than any American Government.

 

"One who believes in pan-human liberty, not limited by race, gender, or creed" casts a pretty wide net in my thought. 

 

So you view America as an idea or ideal then? That is certainly an interesting concept; I'm reminded of the scene at the beginning of the movie "Gladiator", when Marcus Aurelius discusses "What is Rome?" with Maximus. Because one could say "Rome" still exist. But that is a different question, and deserves it's own thread (and is more of a Philosophical discussion, albeit a very interesting topic). For if we are to go by the way a Practical Historian of the distant future would tell, they would write "America lasted 1776 until it's eventual collapse in year 'X'". Which is more along the line of of questing SCOOTS was inquiring. But that is my thought on the subject.

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

Call them and I'll shove that Big Mac up their ass and introduce them the definition of the real Big Mac's Apple Bucking!

 

In general, the Government can go to Hell for all I care.

 

At this point, I can tell you aren't being serious so I apologize for not getting the joke. But if there's one thing most Americans can agree on, a government that can order you to shoot your neighbor is not one worth supporting.

 

Do you truly believe the government defines what freedom means?

No, thus the constant allusions to McDonalds and fast food. I mean, I said "make room for hamburger farms". But America will not just "fall" as most media portrays, it will be a slow decay, and removal of american ideals until all that is left is no longer american in anything other than name.

[CosmicHooves 2,705]

I feel like the only one on this thread who still cares about America and it's government.

[Steel Accord 6,658]

The rebels lost. The United States was later reconstructed to its former self. I meant to say a revolution where things change drastically and radically. Other countries would do to us what we didn't do to North Korea earlier this year...

 

Aaand guess who just "re-newed" their threats again?

 

Not surprised, but I'm not worried in terms of who we are. We've already established a legacy of liberty and human rights, the star and stripes, the eagle, the statue of liberty; that's not all what's important.

 

What's important is what they meant for everyone.

So you view America as an idea or ideal then? That is certainly an interesting concept; I'm reminded of the scene at the beginning of the movie "Gladiator", when Marcus Aurelius discusses "What is Rome?" with Maximus. Because one could say "Rome" still exist. But that is a different question, and deserves it's own thread (and is more of a Philosophical discussion, albeit a very interesting topic). For if we are to go by the way a Practical Historian of the distant future would tell, they would write "America lasted 1776 until it's eventual collapse in year 'X'". Which is more along the line of of questing SCOOTS was inquiring. But that is my thought on the subject.

 

Indeed, Marcus Aurelius is one of my favorite philosophers for that very belief.

 

The U.S. is not a nation of race, but a nation of ideals. Even our conflicts are about them. Representation, equality, the threat of a global evil. Very little in the way of, "they are not us", "they have spilled the blood of our people".

 

I would even go so far as to call myself "Roman" by that same definition. Or English, or whatever nation champions liberty and humanity.

No, thus the constant allusions to McDonalds and fast food. I mean, I said "make room for hamburger farms". But America will not just "fall" as most media portrays, it will be a slow decay, and removal of american ideals until all that is left is no longer american in anything other than name.

 

Well that is a true fall. But I think the opposite will happen.

 

The name may die, the government will fall (and I might just lend a hammer  ), but the ideals we've held and inspired in others around the world will never die.

I feel like the only one on this thread who still cares about America and it's government.

 

Really?!

 

I almost got into a silly fight because I believed Americans wouldn't wage war against their neighbors! Rest assured I'm a patriot.

Edited May 13, 2014 by Steel Accord

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

Not surprised, but I'm not worried in terms of who we are. We've already established a legacy of liberty and human rights, the star and stripes, the eagle, the statue of liberty; that's not all what's important.

 

What's important is what they meant for everyone.

 

Indeed, Marcus Aurelius is one of my favorite philosophers for that very belief.

 

The U.S. is not a nation of race, but a nation of ideals. Even our conflicts are about them. Representation, equality, the threat of a global evil. Very little in the way of, "they are not us", "they have spilled the blood of our people".

 

I would even go so far as to call myself "Roman" by that same definition. Or English, or whatever nation champions liberty and humanity.

 

Well that is a true fall. But I think the opposite will happen.

 

The name may die, the government will fall (and I might just lend a hammer  ), but the ideals we've held and inspired in others around the world will never die.

But Mr. Anderson, you can kill an idea. Simply make the populace think the old ideal is wrong, that it is backwards, that the way that would actually benefit them most is wrong, and you've killed that ideal.

"He who controls history, controls the future" and as it stands, the people are no longer in full control of their history.

[CosmicHooves 2,705]

In general, the Government can go to Hell for all I care.

Please explain this then.

[-Nobody- 514]

I think the decay has already started. Our country is getting weaker, and I don't see us getting back up to where we were during our peak. We will end up falling, like all empires do, but I have no idea when or how.

I do think most modern "empires" are decaying though.

[Steel Accord 6,658]

But Mr. Anderson, you can kill an idea. Simply make the populace think the old ideal is wrong, that it is backwards, that the way that would actually benefit them most is wrong, and you've killed that ideal.

"He who controls history, controls the future" and as it stands, the people are no longer in full control of their history.

 

"While there will always be those who prefer the truncheon in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth." Said, ironically by the same man, if not the same character.

 

We are more armed as the guardians of history than we ever have been. The internet is the greatest archive of information in human history. You can alter the articles all you want, but the truth will always be there for those willing to seek it.

 

I would think you, above most ponies would appreciate that.

[M'aiq the Liar 5,804]

"While there will always be those who prefer the truncheon in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth." Said, ironically by the same man, if not the same character.

 

We are more armed as the guardians of history than we ever have been. The internet is the greatest archive of information in human history. You can alter the articles all you want, but the truth will always be there for those willing to seek it.

 

I would think you, above most ponies would appreciate that.

"Those willing to seek it". The American people as a majority are not. Hell, even CNN got the location of the Ukraine wrong. The truth may exist yes, and you can never fully remove it, but they have done great strides to remove the peoples want to pursue it.

[Steel Accord 6,658]

Please explain this then.

 

Well, I'm not the biggest fan of government on the whole, of any nation. I think it if it MUST exist, it's functions should be to enforce law, run the army and . . . yeah that's pretty much it. A government, if there absolutely MUST be one, that no longer serves the ideals I hold, is one I withdraw my support from.

 

One can be American without approving of it's Government you know?

"Those willing to seek it". The American people as a majority are not. Hell, even CNN got the location of the Ukraine wrong. The truth may exist yes, and you can never fully remove it, but they have done great strides to remove the peoples want to pursue it.

 

I believe that is where you are wrong. Every person is smarter than the other gives them credit for. A different perspective, a different kind of knowledge they have.

 

We have plenty of historians, archeologists, detectives, scientists, and other seekers of truth. I don't judge our nation's intelligence by our news sources, at least not CNN.

[Discordian 6,013]

Well, I'm not the biggest fan of government on the whole, of any nation. I think it if it MUST exist, it's functions should be to enforce law, run the army and . . . yeah that's pretty much it. A government, if there absolutely MUST be one, that no longer serves the ideals I hold, is one I withdraw my support from.

 

One can be American without approving of it's Government you know?

 

 

I believe that is where you are wrong. Every person is smarter than the other gives them credit for. A different perspective, a different kind of knowledge they have.

 

We have plenty of historians, archeologists, detectives, scientists, and other seekers of truth. I don't judge our nation's intelligence by our news sources, at least not CNN.

Even going farther than that, why would one care about government when one's main concern is personal freedoms? What does a government have to do with how you spend your time and your life? That's up to a person, not invisible people who you'll never meet in your life.

[Dawn Arethia Whooves 9]

it shall happen when people are stupid enough to try going underground and building things down there. It shall slowly collapse and die.