S07:E10 - A Royal Problem

[Jeric 46,851]

3 minutes ago, Nightmare Muffin said:

She said it was

You mean ... she thought it was!

[Kyoshi Frost Wolf 41,435]

You know what would have won me over a bit more in this episode? One SIMPLE thing: Have the episode clearly establish that what Starlight did WAS wrong to some extent, because of how dangerous that use of that magic is. There should have been something, ANYTHING said along those lines. Instead Starlight was celebrated for doing it and that is a big part that loses points for me. She should have had some words said to her to deter her from doing that crap again. That isn't a bad lesson for someone to learn, that impulsively doing something like that is not a smart move, even with the best intentions and even if the outcome was good that one time. It is a good lesson and Starlight's intentions can be glorified, not her actions. 

If they would have done that instead, I would have put this episode above average at least. 

[Will Guide 21,360]

Oh my gosh! First, Twilight communicated with someone by becoming a drawing in a book, and now she's the dancing figure on a music box!

What's next for her? Through a painting?

[Mesme Rize 15,683]

1 minute ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

Oh my gosh! First, Twilight communicated with someone by becoming a drawing in a book, and now she's the dancing figure on a music box!

What's next for her? Through a painting?

She will transform into a Lamia.

[Will Guide 21,360]

"I think you might be biased" said by an unamused Starlight. Bet it'll become a meme against haters.

Did Lunas just eat the banana peel instead of the banana? She DID!

[Photon Jet 5,491]

5 minutes ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

"I think you might be biased" said by an unamused Starlight. Bet it'll become a meme against haters.

Did Lunas just eat the banana peel instead of the banana? She DID!

So now we know Princess Luna is capable of eating banana peels.

[Jeric 46,851]

21 minutes ago, Photon Jet said:

Perhaps the map knew Starlight Glimmer has outstanding potential and is a very valuable reformed hero in all of Equestria thanks to Twilight Sparkle and her friends. Almost like it sees into the future.

Aye. This is the premise I'm going with. It is a product of the mysterious Tree of Harmony after all. 

[Castle Bleck 19,341]

Sudden Daybreaker sure was, well, sudden.

 

Also, was that Discord's dream or The Smooze's?

[Goat-kun 2,527]

As suspected. Our glorious writers are not only using Starlight as a MacGuffin but are bestowing upon her the characteristics of your basic RPG hero of yore inside such episodes that demand greater things from the character driving the plot. At the same time we are being constantly assured that Mane 6 are meant for greater things even though the greatest achievement inside their obligatorily uneventful slice-o-life episodes is acceptable writing. Now, I have full confidence that at the end they will be granted episodes this paragraph demands. But does it matter? The well has already been poisoned by the failure to pay tribute to the old hierarchical structure of characters. Inside a show without sturdy story arcs, this takes precedence before practicality. You all are beginning to understand: whatever great role Mane 6 will have in the future shall not recreate the previous status quo. Once the tables are turned this fandom shall shatter, its bits and pieces paving the way for a fanxit where emotionally involved parties shall no longer want to have anything to do with one another. Not only that, we shall witness an advent of even stronger tribalism that could only become viable once the scales have been evened out after three-seasons worth of conditioning. Think of it as overcompensation.

 

I am sorry, but your wishes shall not be granted. This fandom shall not retire like prominent communities. May Daybreaker's fire illuminate our twisted path.

 

... On an unrelated note: does the nightmare battle mean board wipes can become a thing? Wrath of God yay or neigh?

[Mesme Rize 15,683]

3 minutes ago, A.V. said:

Sudden Daybreaker sure was, well, sudden.

 

Also, was that Discord's dream or The Smooze's?

What if they are...both the same entity?

[Will Guide 21,360]

Blink and you'll miss it:

As Celestia enters the dream world, you can see some dreams in the background such as:

Fluttershy riding a giant Angel Bunny

Flurry Heart DJ'ing for her mother, Princess Cadence.

Discord and the Smooze having a pillow fight.

And Pinkie Pie using Gummy as a surfboard to ride the waves!

Derpy is Royalty! 

Edited May 20, 2017 by WiiGuy2014

[Jeric 46,851]

31 minutes ago, Kyoshi said:

There should have been something, ANYTHING said along those lines.

She said something along those lines. The other characters and the writers however don't consider this to be an issue. Basically, impulsiveness will be one of her traits, which fans will either love or hate. Similar to how some detest  Rarity for her judgemental moments and Rainbow Dash for her confidence that borders on arrogance. This episode told me that the trait is here to stay. One of the curious morals and elements in this story (whether you believe in the Map guiding everything, or not) is that taking a risk and going with your gut is something you occasionally have to do.

However, this time it was Starlight herself that came to the conclusion it was a mistake. That thinking is what created the visualized obstacle that the sisters needed. 

I love what they did particularly because it has allusions to some of the greatest works of narrative fiction ever. It becomes a vessel for thoughtfulness without being forcefully ponderous with the messages. 

3 minutes ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

Blink and you'll miss it:

As Celestia enters the dream world, you can see some dreams in the background such as:

Fluttershy riding a giant Angel Bunny

Flurry Heart DJ'ing for her mother, Princess Cadence.

Discord and the Smooze having a pillow fight.

And Pinkie Pie using Gummy as a surfboard to ride the waves!

And ..   AJ or Granny dreaming about baby AJ in her parent's arms.  

[BastementSparkle 20,326]

I adored this episode. While Starlight was there and played a role it's clear the characters of real importance this episode were Celestia and Luna. Most of the episode focused on them and they're the ones who learned the important lesson, and boy do I love the developments here. This episode really showed just how difficult and stressful the Royal Sisters jobs can actually be, with Celestia constantly having to work to keep up a good public appearance, and Luna having to deal with all those nightmares all on her own. Celestia put's on a nice smile, and still tries to do nice things for her sister and others despite this, but both of them are pretty exhausted by their work.

I think their arguments were handled pretty well and made sense. While Celestia raised the moon in Luna's absence, I imagine that's the only aspect of her job she really did. No dreamwalking or any of that other stuff, so of course she wouldn't realize just how hard it is to do Luna's work. Both of them are tired from their jobs and stressed and so it's not too surprising that stress might lead them to arguing like this. This was some great development for both of them.

As for Starlight's role...People keep saying she messed up here, and I think that's both sort of true, and yet not. People are saying she should have learned her lesson to never use magic to solve problems, but I don't feel like that's a lesson she's ever learned or ever should learn. Magic can be used as a tool to solve problems, of course it can! In "Every little thing she does" she learned that using magic isn't always the best way to solve your problems and can sometimes make them worse if used incorrectly, and in "To Where and Back again" she learned that she can solve problems without it, but that doesn't translate to "Never use it! EVER!" Magic is a tool, just like technology.

 In this case, her spell clearly worked out for the best and was a good solution. While she cast it impulsively, likely from the panic of seeing the royal sisters fight like that, it was ultimately the right decision. It certainly carried it's risks and I think she should have taken more time to think this over before going through with it, yes, but magic did indeed turn out to be the solution here. That map clearly knows what it's doing, and trusted her to make the right call, even if she did so in a stressed out panic. She obviously regretted her decision later, since she had the nightmare.

 So, yeah. Great episode for the royal sisters, and great episode for Starlight too.

[Kyoshi Frost Wolf 41,435]

4 minutes ago, Jeric said:

She said something along those lines. The other characters and the writers however don't consider this to be an issue. Basically, impulsiveness will be one of her traits, which fans will either love or hate. Similar to how some detest  Rarity for her judgemental moments and Rainbow Dash for her confidence that borders on arrogance. This episode told me that the trait is here to stay. One of the curious morals and elements in this story (whether you believe in the Map guiding everything, or not) is that taking a risk and going with your gut is something you occasionally have to do.

However, this time it was Starlight herself that came to the conclusion it was a mistake. That thinking is what created the visualized obstacle that the sisters needed. 

I love what they did particularly because it has allusions to some of the greatest works of narrative fiction ever. It becomes a vessel for thoughtfulness without being forcefully ponderous with the messages. 

And ..   AJ or Granny dreaming about baby AJ in her parent's arms.  

It being 'one of her traits' doesn't solve the problem I have. If being impulsive is part of who she is, then fine, but there has to be some type of line drawn somewhere, right? In this case it was using a magic that is forcing something on other characters, and a magic that Starlight used in the past for horrible things. There needed to be some better closure to this problem. 

[Will Guide 21,360]

For years, fans have speculated what would happened if Celestia turned in her version of Nightmare Moon. In this nightmare, we meet just that: Daybreaker!

[Jeric 46,851]

Just now, Kyoshi said:

It being 'one of her traits' doesn't solve the problem I have. If being impulsive is part of who she is, then fine, but there has to be some type of line drawn somewhere, right? In this case it was using a magic that is forcing something on other characters, and a magic that Starlight used in the past for horrible things. There needed to be some better closure to this problem. 

Right. As I said, it's now come to the point where what you see is what you have. Nothing wrong with disliking a character for that. I've never been one to have any emotion over people hating Rarity for example. Not everyone can appreciate characters the same way, since we come at them with our own biases. It's a Roland Barthes thing.

As far as the closure, on that we will have to agree to disagree. Your opinion is valid, it's just not one I share since my life experiences are unique to yours. 

[Will Guide 21,360]

I'm actually tearing up as Celestia and Luna regroup and witness their Evil sides battle! 

Edited May 20, 2017 by WiiGuy2014

[That Guy with the CMB 5,873]

It was pretty good, I guess. Nice moral, and better than I thought it was going to be. I was worried Starlight would switch the cutie marks out of more than impulse.

[Mesme Rize 15,683]

BTW, a little something on a side note.

Saying that Starlight shouldn't use her magic as something to help her is bullshit. That's like saying a Lumberjack shouldn't use a chainsaw, because he could take someones life with it, or that a surgeon shouldn't open up someone to give him a bypass, because he could kill him.

I don't say that Starlights methods weren't extreme, but there are so many jobs in this world that are very risque. Sometimes, we have to make quick decisions for the greater good. Humans act on the gut all the time and sometimes become heroes.

[Kyoshi Frost Wolf 41,435]

5 minutes ago, Jeric said:

Right. As I said, it's now come to the point where what you see is what you have. Nothing wrong with disliking a character for that. I've never been one to have any emotion over people hating Rarity for example. Not everyone can appreciate characters the same way, since we come at them with our own biases. It's a Roland Barthes thing.

As far as the closure, on that we will have to agree to disagree. Your opinion is valid, it's just not one I share since my life experiences are unique to yours. 

I don't know. Looking around I am starting to get this slight feeling that if one has anything negative to say about Starlight in any way whatsoever, even if it is proper criticism, then that person's opinion automatically becomes invalid. Just something I've noticed. 

[Will Guide 21,360]

And I always say, "Mission Complete!" once a Cutie Mark glows happily at the end of a Map episode!

[M'gann M'orzz 745]

How much fan art will there be of Daybreaker within 2 days?

[Photon Jet 5,491]

Just now, M'gann M'orzz said:

How much fan art will there be of Daybreaker within 2 days?

Probably a mountain of them soon enough.

[Jeric 46,851]

Just now, Kyoshi said:

I don't know. Looking around I am starting to get this slight feeling that if one has anything negative to say about Starlight in any way whatsoever, even if it is proper criticism, then that person's opinion automatically becomes invalid. Just something I've noticed. 

That is unfortunately not a new thing, and not exclusive to Starlight. 

I can say that following the S5 finale I was not sold on her. This season they are doing exactly what I hoped they would, which is why I like discussing her. 

Also, I need to find that Luna frown image. Adorable!

1 minute ago, M'gann M'orzz said:

How much fan art will there be of Daybreaker within 2 days?

I'm waiting on staff to approve my FC. Then she shall rise again! 

[M'gann M'orzz 745]

5 minutes ago, Kyoshi said:

I don't know. Looking around I am starting to get this slight feeling that if one has anything negative to say about Starlight in any way whatsoever, even if it is proper criticism, then that person's opinion automatically becomes invalid. Just something I've noticed. 

It's because it's become a fucking cycle at this point, people are just REALLY sick of it. If you don't like a character fine but Starlight's hatedom seems to flat out obsess over her. No one likes having the same freaking argument over and over and over and over.

Edited May 20, 2017 by M'gann M'orzz