I Suggest That The Usage Of Emoticons Should Be Restricted In Some Way In Debate Symposium

[EpicEnergy 23,240]

Before I begin I want to clarify that this is not an attack against any particular users who use emoticons in Debate Symposium.

In regards to the usage of emoticons in Debate Symposium, I suggest that it should be restricted at the least and outright banished at the most.

Support for a restriction is as follows:

1) Emoticons are being overused and abused in Debate Symposium.

2) It normally comes across as condescending when emoticons are used in a post there.

3) Emoticons often infuriate your opponents and overemphasize your points.

4) Emoticons are not essential to a debate. Although they can be used to emphasize your point, other options are available to emphasize your point instead, such as putting your text in bold, italicizing it, or underlining it. Therefore to restrict it would not hurt anything.

There are three ways I suggest to restrict emoticons:

1) You can create a Debate Symposium rule that prohibits the usage of emoticons in that forum.

2) You can change the code in the forums to where it is impossible to use emoticons (not sure if it's feasible though).

3) You can create a rule that prohibits a particular usage of emoticons, such as in a condescending or infuriating way, just like the "laugh" reaction.

With that said, there is one other thing that I want to address. I highly suggest considering whether to ban certain emoticons or ban all of them. Some emoticons do not necessarily come across as condescending and can be used to emphasize a point. For example, let's say Joe Biden wins the election. I respond by saying, "I am greatly worried about what will happen to America now with Biden in office! " or by saying, "This is not what I want to happen! The election was rigged! ". In both cases, my usage of emoticons do not come across as condescending and they both emphasize my point. Therefore, perhaps outright restriction emoticons is not the answer, but rather restricting them being used in a particular way or particular context.

[Megas 27,969]

I don't mind emoticons used in debates, but you can tell when they feel normal or not, and the lengths I've been seeing it from certain users just make them come off as a sarcastic ass

[Dark Bun 681]

No, this is a violation of my free speech!  How very authoritarian of you to suggest. 

[AppleButt 8,680]

19 minutes ago, Scar said:

I definitely agree with that. I may have used one or 2 so I am guilty myself, but, I think they should be completely removed from it.

Same.   I used a laugh react like one time in the debate section but the person was clearly a troll, and is banned now so I don’t feel like I need to defend my reasoning there.  

 

But I think it’s best they be done away with in that section.

[AppleButt 8,680]

1 minute ago, Scar said:

I would rather the section be removed completely. I only interact there out of boredem.

I’m neutral on that standpoint, but I haven’t actually browsed that section in ages. 

[Here No Longer 5,281]

Frankly I just want the entire section gone and some previous actions taken by the mods reverted.

 

This to me is just something that doesn't really matter in any way whatsoever. Removing reactions might be worth a look into but emotes? I honestly don't see the point. If anything I think that emotes actually go both ways. On one hand, they can be used for the sake of being passive-aggressive. And on the other hand they can also be used to communicate certain things that may not be as communicable in words like tone in particular.

Edited September 16, 2020 by Dusknoir

[SharpWit 2,800]

The issue is less the emoticons but rather their abuse  for the purpose of provoking a reaction which goes against the spirit of the debate symposium. Smugness plays into the positive competitiveness that occasionally occurs in topics but only so much can be tolerated before the discussion falls apart.

I don't think emoticons should be removed or banned from the debate symposium, but they should be used in moderation.

[Meson Bolt 2,650]

I agree with @Dark Bun, it's a violation of free speech. Let the emoters emote.

[BornAgainBrony 2,398]

1 hour ago, Scar said:

I would rather the section be removed completely. I only interact there out of boredem.

I've felt that way more and more as time has gone on. Seems it's outlived its usefulness. Maybe once upon a time it made sense to have it, but not anymore.

[Misty Shadow 8,055]

I disagree with this proposal because I do not believe we should be encouraging people to get mad over smileys. I do not like the Debate Symposium anymore, therefore, I do not use it. People making fools of themselves in DS with snide, haughty remarks have the right to an opinion and are only hurting their arguments by having a bad attitude. Censoring/removing DS is, at best, a solution to an external problem, it won't change the internal problem of such people not having a good attitude. Just live and let be. 

[Splashee 28,589]

Why do we have a section that hurts people? Come on!

[BornAgainBrony 2,398]

2 hours ago, CloudMistDragon said:

I disagree with this proposal because I do not believe we should be encouraging people to get mad over smileys. I do not like the Debate Symposium anymore, therefore, I do not use it. People making fools of themselves in DS with snide, haughty remarks have the right to an opinion and are only hurting their arguments by having a bad attitude.

That's assuming they even care if their arguments are bad. Some of the activity that is being called out was, IMO, indistinguishable from trolling.

Why are you more concerned about "encouraging people to get mad over smileys?" First I'm guessing that was poorly-worded, because there's no logical way banning emotes there would "encourage" anything.

Keeping it around, why don't we just rename DS to the "troll bridge" and be done with it?

Or just have it redirect users to 4chan.

[ExplosionMare 18,113]

How about people actually be nice to each other? After, all, this is a Friendship is Magic forum 

[Bastian 13,321]

The answer to why there is a debate forum is simple.

If it hurts you, don't go there, easy right?

No one is forcing anyone to watch that place, everyone is free to steer clear of it.

I have fun in it to be honest, I like discussing, if the people who are discussing with me get angry that's their problem, they shouldn't have gone to the place at all.

Back to the point, I support the idea of banning emotes.

Bureaucratic answer: they can be used in two ways, to communicate certain things or to be sarcastic and aggressive. Not everyone is going to be the latter but for the sake of those people who are I would ban the emotes.

Logical answer: Common guys emotes are only used in one way, I would have expected you to ban them long ago.

[Lord Valtasar 12,704]

not this again, we've had the same shit with reactions in the past, it's a classic case of blaming the tool, there is a place for debate and emotes are just a way to express yourself more clearly, if someone abuses them then they're the problem, not the tools and it all comes back to the most basic of rules "don't be an asshole"

[Lord Valtasar 12,704]

what's next. ban typing altogether? it does enable people to be assholes after all... i stand by what i said, you blame the killer not the knife

[BornAgainBrony 2,398]

9 minutes ago, Lord Valtasar said:

what's next. ban typing altogether? it does enable people to be assholes after all... i stand by what i said, you blame the killer not the knife

After observing what has gone on there for months, it would take constant policing, even independent of reported posts, which seem to be disproportionately high. To actively regulate it (and/or respond to the number of reports) would be ridiculously unreasonable without it being at minimum, a part-time paid gig. That's very sad, given the relatively small number of users that typically frequent that part of the forum.

[Lord Valtasar 12,704]

anyone who asks for it to be removed can have it so by staying away from it, removing it willl just result in those debates seeping into other places in the forum, making it worse for everyone

[BornAgainBrony 2,398]

3 minutes ago, Lord Valtasar said:

anyone who asks for it to be removed can have it so by staying away from it, removing it willl just result in those debates seeping into other places in the forum, making it worse for everyone

You make it sound like its purpose is to serve as some kind of hornet-trap. If removal of political debates causes aggressive behavior to spread to other parts of the forums, those who are guilty of it would be better off questioning why they are part of this fandom in the first place.

[Goat-kun 2,530]

Look fam, here's the deal. There are only two emoticons native to Poniverse that I use. The rest cannot be blocked. Are you then gonna be asking staffers to restrict copy pasta too? Come on, man.

 

Just to be clear: I am against any such action. Deal with it.

[Lord Valtasar 12,704]

1 minute ago, BornAgainBrony said:

You make it sound like its purpose is to serve as some kind of hornet-trap.

first of all, not all debates are political, a debate could be about whether pinkie has horn hidden under her mane or not or any number of other stuff, the symposium has some special rules that help contain those debates in there because not everyone is in the mood for a debate all the time, you can go there when you are, while not seeing it otherwise

7 minutes ago, BornAgainBrony said:

If removal of political debates causes aggressive behavior to spread to other parts of the forums, those who are guilty of it would be better off questioning why they are part of this fandom in the first place.

and yes, maybe they should, but would they? it just makes it shittier for everyone, it's why i said above that it's not the tools we should blame, keep in mind that i don't blame any member in particular as i haven't been to the debate symposium in 2 years, it's the actions i condemn, not the people taking them

[Jeric 46,873]

This argument is really over before it began, because I can’t restrict emoticons or reactions at a forum level anyway. I mean it’s possible with modifications to the source code, but I have better things to do with my time than intervene technically in something that can just be ignored. 
 

For consistency sake, I’m not in favor of managing to the exception. A few people who annoy others with emotes doesn’t justify the hours it would take to research, develop, and implement a restrictive system. I mean, I’ll just tell people how I feel when I see over reliance for smugness. 
 

For clarification and transparency sake, and since I speak for myself, I have personally shown concern with how debate is currently moderated and how users have conducted themselves. Not all tools are being used as I feel that they should have. I have suggested a temporary closure of debate pit after another Administrator suggested that they might be on board with its permanent closure. Other staff have suggested specific topics be restricted (as we current do have a few banned topics). None of this has been fully vetted or discussed among Administrators or other Moderators. 
 

The situation is certainly more fluid. What would make this a non-issue would be taking a step back and everyone not taking every opinion as a personal attack. Schadenfreude is not a death threat, criticism of an organization is not in and of itself racist, and 80% of the reports I see are basically whining. That whining may actually cause several staffers to start reacting. 
 

I am not asking for peace and harmony. I’m far to pragmatic for that. But can you all in debate please stop using the report button like a tattle button?