S08:E01+02 - School Daze

[Silver Letter 1,832]

I was thinking lately that Applejack's line in the first song was that she couldn't teach honesty. Why not? That would be an ethics class. I think all the stuff that happened with the failed classes early on was due to Twilight not coming up with a curriculum? Things seemed ill prepared, despite working with the guidelines. I think all the elements would be easily translated into classes.

[Senko 459]

On 3/31/2018 at 7:43 PM, Justin_Case001 said:

That's as good an explanation as any, buuut....there's a reason that the Q continuum always had a sort of Prime Directive of their own, and why Q kept his meddling within certain boundaries, and why they do the same for Discord: if he starts going hog-wild and just creating massive stuff for them, then it becomes a slippery slope with no end.  Why not just create more and more?  Why stop at a school?  Why not snap his fingers and give her a bigger castle?  Why not snap his fingers again and give Rarity a palace-sized boutique in every city in the land?  Why not not snap his fingers again and give Applejack a bunch of android pony servants to run the farm?  Why stop there?  Why not just make the farm fully automated?  Why not give Rainbow some cloud palace, and Pinkie a Willy Wonka factory?  Why not just create a whole kingdom for them?  Why not a whole planet?  A whole galaxy?  Well, there's easy answers to some of those, but the point is where is the line?  If Discord is willing to do stuff like that for you, then how could you resist the temptation to just have him do everything for you?

Because if he did that he would face the most devestating weapon known to pony kind, the raised flutershy eyebrow.

More seriously we have seen him willing to create piles of bits before when setting up a tea party. Honestly a permananent school with lake and boarding for students is probably less damaging to the economy than what he did for that. The castle's not being sold, its not creating new currency, its just a place attached to Twilight's castle for her to teach in. If he did create it that is.

As for the rest of the episode I did like the contrast of the mane 6 teaching according to the "rules" and them teaching according to what they like.

I'm sure Neighsay will return in future episodes to have his revenge he just choose to withdraw for now.

I loved Pinkie's "You didn't tell me this was a pity party, I'd have brought icecream." when trying to cheer Twilight up.

Not a bad episode though I think I'm a little tired to properly appreciate it.

[bwrosas 252]

In response to Josh Scorcher's Review and other's review of the episode, here I discuss it once again, with some visual aids to go along with it.

Clips from Josh Scorcher's Review, are copyright of The Fiery Joker Productions

Comments are Welcomed

[TBD 17,263]

I think it was a bit cliche', i mean you can't seriously force friendship on everyone ya know. 

[Roughshod 720]

What are they doing to this show?

I mean the whole concept of a school of friendship is just asinine and contradictory to many of the themes established earlier in the show regarding how friendship is learned and expressed.

The longer this show goes on and -inevitably- the more corporate mediocrity poisons the well, the more blatant and desperate the merchandising becomes.  If you had told me back in 2011 that Twilight Sparkle and her friends would end up like this I never would have believed you. I'd have called you a worse cynic than myself. 

There is no specific moment that fully encapsulates the feeling of decline and corruption which I am indicting here(though some examples come to mind). Yet, the result that I see, that I perceive in so many aspects, both obvious and more subtle, big and small, is undeniable to me.

I need another drink of cider.

Edited July 19, 2018 by Roughshod

[gingerninja666 487]

1 hour ago, Roughshod said:

What are they doing to this show?

I mean the whole concept of a school of friendship is just asinine and contradictory to many of the themes established earlier in the show regarding how friendship is learned and expressed.

The longer this show goes on and -inevitably- the more corporate mediocrity poisons the well, the more blatant and desperate the merchandising becomes.  If you had told me back in 2011 that Twilight Sparkle and her friends would end up like this I never would have believed you. I'd have called you a worse cynic than myself. 

There is no specific moment that fully encapsulates the feeling of decline and corruption which I am indicting here(though some examples come to mind). Yet, the result that I see, that I perceive in so many aspects, both obvious and more subtle, big and small, is undeniable to me.

I need another drink of cider.

The thing is, while I agree that the mere concept of a friendship school is really asinine, the type of story they chose to wrap it in, at least in the season premiere, makes me feel like the writers are at least really trying to make it work.

 

Like, the type of story they chose to tell is one about governmental beaurocracy, accreditation, international incidents between nations. The whole thing is very... political. And the school's first cases of creating friendships didn't even come from it's lessons. The mere platform of the school as a hub for Equestria's allies brought children of disparate races together and allowed them to become friends pretty much on their own terms.

Edited July 19, 2018 by gingerninja666

[Roughshod 720]

1 hour ago, gingerninja666 said:

The thing is, while I agree that the mere concept of a friendship school is really asinine

Thank you. That's all I needed to see. I am an expert on asinine matters after all.

1 hour ago, gingerninja666 said:

the type of story they chose to wrap it in, at least in the season premiere, makes me feel like the writers are at least really trying to make it work.

Or destroy it! 

A bit of an extreme reaction you might say? Adds nothing to characterisation? Obvious foreshadowing is obvious? Nah. The wrap they used is the equivalent of a baby alicorn's soiled diaper, dipped in vampire bat guano and buried in the deepest depths of Tartarus.

1 hour ago, gingerninja666 said:

Like, the type of story they chose to tell is one about governmental beurocracy, accreditation, international incidents between nations. The whole thing is very... political.

Politics. But politics done badly. I see enough of that in other media outlets I don't need it corrupting this as well. The idea of introducing such things into FiM isn't a new one and admittedly not something I'm against on principle but doing it in this way was ill-conceived to say the least. So much potential and it's squandered on nonsense like this.

World War over five missing students? Sure, seems legit. After all kids are stupid so no need for clever writing! Just give them some meme-able faces to distract them from those pesky plotholes.

1 hour ago, gingerninja666 said:

And the school's first cases of creating friendships didn't even come from it's lessons.

Yes, the premise of the school and its structure contradicted the stated goal hence the thematic conflict. I saw the episode too. But the point of trying to 'educate' friendship in a formal or at least semi-formal setting as if manufacturing a product and then establishing said friendship in spite of the plot device of the school just reeks of hypocrisy on the part of the writing.

So the school didn't work. But it kinda worked. So maybe we can work to make it work, if we work it a different way? It misses the point entirely just so it can use some tired cliches of culture clashes between some out of touch elders and a big meanie racist. Lame.

1 hour ago, gingerninja666 said:

The mere platform of the school as a hub for Equestria's allies brought children of disparate races together and allowed them to become friends.

Wonderful. And no I'm not being entirely sarcastic. The idea is pretty good as far as extending the direction of the show. A progression from spreading friendship first primarily between Twilight and the remane 5 in Ponyville(seasons 1-4), then across Equestria(seasons 5-7) and now beyond kind of makes sense. Although I have to say there's less than a handful of non-pony characters I actually cared about before now and the introduction of more is a matter of indifference to me personally, so long as they don't detract from the show too much.

But the execution was bad! Not the worst by any stretch(even for premieres where there is a lower bar that's been set) but unfortunately it does epitomize a decline in a broader sense.

Change can be good or bad, I'm not against it outright. When the Golden Oaks library was destroyed I was impressed by the gravity of such a development(well, until I saw its gawdy successor). When the CMC got their marks I was ecstatic. 

But it hasnt always been this way. Gradually the show has become more self- aware, losing its sincerity in the process and replacing it with pandering, irony and the ever increasing need to capitalize on its own success. Sometimes in big displays, but more often in little things that are ignored or shrugged off. MLP may not be 'high brow' entertainment but it's shown in the past the ability to tackle weighty subjects with maturity and genuine feeling that far surpasses what was on display here. Look none of this is the fault of a single premiere, even if I do have issues with this one, but 'School Daze' is the prime example that the more this show tries to stuff into itself and the shinier it tries to look, the more hollow it can become and the more blemishes appear. 

Nothing stays true for long and expansion is not always the same thing as growth.

Edited July 19, 2018 by Roughshod

[gingerninja666 487]

1 hour ago, Roughshod said:

World War over five missing students? Sure, seems legit. After all kids are stupid so no need for clever writing! Just give them some meme-able faces to distract them from those pesky plotholes.

On this specific point, I like the episode quite a bit, while acknowleding the plot holes, and I don't particularly care for 90% of meme faces. So at least in my case the faces weren't what carried it for me.

For me I really liked the students themselves and a lot of the interactions between the Mane cast and the various rulers of Equestria's allies. I found the Student 6 to be a gang of ultimately really genuinely sweet kids (definitely great to have our first example of a Yak who isn't an abrasive dick). In fact it was the little moments which I found sincere that carried me more often than the plot itself.

1 hour ago, Roughshod said:

Yes, the premise of the school and its structure contradicted the stated goal hence the thematic conflict. I saw the episode too. But the point of trying to 'educate' friendship in a formal or at least semi-formal setting as if manufacturing a product and then establishing said friendship in spite of the plot device of the school just reeks of hypocrisy on the part of the writing.

I definitely didn't get the feeling that friendship was treated as a "product". Maybe this is because I'm working with knowledge of Marks for Effort which reinforced my own read of the school from School Daze, but I feel like the school is more about behavioural lessons on generally being a good person than it is teaching you the specific way to "game" the process of friendship. If that makes any sense. There's a lot of team building exercises (one of AJ's lessons is to just play Buckball and observe how team dynamics can look like friendship), encouraging people to become aware of the feelings of others . That kind of stuff. That's why Twilight eventually came down on the side of not standardizing everything, because you CAN'T do that with friendship. The students eventually becoming friends regardless of everything is more ammo for her side. She points out that every friendship is unique, and her school needs to be equipped to accomodate for as many types as possible. So her friends need to teach in a looser style.

 

1 hour ago, Roughshod said:

So the school didn't work. But it kinda worked. So maybe we can work to make it work, if we work it a different way? It misses the point entirely just so it can use some tired cliches of culture clashes between some out of touch elders and a big meanie racist. Lame.

The school was shown to be working a lot better at the beginning before Twilight's strict adherance to the EEA started to creep it's way in. So the solution wasn't so much "Maybe we can make it work if we work it a different way.", it was "Let's go back to what was originally working." Which I think is a bit more coherent.

Edited July 19, 2018 by gingerninja666

[Roughshod 720]

4 hours ago, gingerninja666 said:

On this specific point, I like the episode quite a bit, while acknowleding the plot holes, and I don't particularly care for 90% of meme faces. So at least in my case the faces weren't what carried it for me.

So what exactly do you like about this point? That it's hyperbolic? Utterly contrived? Quickly resolved? Or that it ultimately goes nowhere while supporting Chancellor Neighsay's misgivings about the other races? Nothing about this made any sense in the context of MLP or was credible in the slightest. It was a stupid and cheap attempt at raising tension that no one with an IQ above room temperature would believe for a second. Season 8 of My Little Pony would not be centered around a world war. Hasbro would not go for that(as cool as it might be in theory). There have been shown alternate timelines which involved war in the season 5 finale but that's not really comparable as those were worst case scenarios that never actually came to pass in the proper canon(depending on your conception of space-time).

4 hours ago, gingerninja666 said:

For me I really liked the students themselves and a lot of the interactions between the Mane cast and the various rulers of Equestria's allies. I found the Student 6 to be a gang of ultimately really genuinely sweet kids (definitely great to have our first example of a Yak who isn't an abrasive dick). In fact it was the little moments which I found sincere that carried me more often than the plot itself.

The 'Young Six' as some have called them aren't my main point of contention. While I believe there are older characters who are more deserving of further exploration and development I don't really have anything against these new ones. They don't really stand out to me apart from their novelty. Granted they haven't exactly had much screen time to do so. 

Your statement about their interactions being more pertinent than the plot is just how FiM works. The characters have always taken precedence over storylines and because they're largely and consistently well written it typically works in the show's favor. But after seven seasons you can't just drop a new batch of faces and expect the same amount of investment as with other established characters. I'm not saying you in particular are doing this, just that my judgment is undetermined at this point.

4 hours ago, gingerninja666 said:

I definitely didn't get the feeling that friendship was treated as a "product".

Well, technically it's more of a slogan or a trademark. But the intended result is the same.

4 hours ago, gingerninja666 said:

Maybe this is because I'm working with knowledge of Marks for Effort which reinforced my own read of the school from School Daze, but I feel like the school is more about behavioural lessons on generally being a good person than it is teaching you the specific way to "game" the process of friendship. If that makes any sense. There's a lot of team building exercises (one of AJ's lessons is to just play Buckball and observe how team dynamics can look like friendship), encouraging people to become aware of the feelings of others . That kind of stuff. That's why Twilight eventually came down on the side of not standardizing everything, because you CAN'T do that with friendship. The students eventually becoming friends regardless of everything is more ammo for her side. She points out that every friendship is unique, and her school needs to be equipped to accomodate for as many types as possible. So her friends need to teach in a looser style.

Once again I repeat that the entire premise of the school is asinine and insulting to the audience's intelligence. Why does there need to be a school for friendship and "generally being a good person"? The Mane Six didn't need this and they were already adults when they started learning about the magic of friendship. Even Twilight, without knowledge about true friendship, still managed to become Celestia's star student. The idea that so few others in Equestria let alone the known world have an appreciation of what friendship means is just stupid and lazy writing. It misses the point completely of the original premise of the show which was to show the importance of friendship as experienced between friends. Friendship is not some ideology or movement, it's a fundamental aspect of social relations in society. It's just absurd the lengths this show has to go in order to write around product marketing. 

I don't really care how Twilight or the others teach at the school because they shouldn't be doing so in the first place. Arguing these specifics misses the point entirely. Twilight taking on a student in the form of Starlight makes some sense. But her building an entire facility and then having her friends(who all have full time jobs by the way) fill in as teachers is just... Moving on.

4 hours ago, gingerninja666 said:

The school was shown to be working a lot better at the beginning before Twilight's strict adherance to the EEA started to creep it's way in. So the solution wasn't so much "Maybe we can make it work if we work it a different way.", it was "Let's go back to what was originally working." Which I think is a bit more coherent.

No, it's myopic and redundant to the core of my criticism. I dont think you get the metatextual point of my argument: That's not how friendship works!

It doesn't matter what the curriculum is when the idea of the course is still just as stupid.  Look, just because you can and should make friends in school, doesn't mean you need to build an actual school dedicated to a abstraction like that. Are we honestly expected to believe that friendship was such an alien concept in the world of My Little Pony that an entire educational system was needed to assist everyone that they could form that kind of social bond with others? It completely flies in the face of common sense.

But I guess you do believe it or are willing to suspend your disbelief and lower your expectations in order to avoid the discomfort of questioning the very legitimacy of what's being presented to you. And that's fine; enjoy it to your heart's content or don't. But I'm not interested in a discussion that ignores the bigger picture and getting bogged down in irrelevant details with no substance.

Edited July 19, 2018 by Roughshod

[gingerninja666 487]

3 hours ago, Roughshod said:

So what exactly do you like about this point? That it's hyperbolic? Utterly contrived? Quickly resolved? Or that it ultimately goes nowhere while supporting Chancellor Neighsay's misgivings about the other races? Nothing about this made any sense in the context of MLP or was credible in the slightest. It was a stupid and cheap attempt at raising tension that no one with an IQ above room temperature would believe for a second. Season 8 of My Little Pony would not be centered around a world war. Hasbro would not go for that(as cool as it might be in theory). There have been shown alternate timelines which involved war in the season 5 finale but that's not really comparable as those were worst case scenarios that never actually came to pass in the proper canon(depending on your conception of space-time).

Taken like that there'd never be tension. They were never going to make season 1 about Nightmare Moon successfully creating eternal night. Or season 3 about Sombra successfully re-enslaving the crystal empire. The best you'd get would be the villain escaping like Starlight did to fight another day.

About what I liked exactly though.I thought their reactions were exaggerated but kinda fitting for a lot of them. Ember is a hothead. Rutherford almost started a war over a percieved cultural slight partially caused by a cake (and here he lost a child that he entrusted to Equestria). Grandpa Gruff is a surly jerk. The only one that really didn't fit was Thorax, and he wasn't calling for war, he was worried about the political blowback of the changelings potentially being blamed for it, which I thought was an awesome detail that would definitely be in the mind of a ruler from a race as fresh from redemption as the changelings. He's aware that his people are on thin ice and is self conscious about how the rest of the world percieves them.

And I liked how quickly it was resolved. Mainly because I thought it was about time the cast actually handled something swiftly. They're major heroes of Equestria but throughout the series they've consistantly won through a lot of luck and barely pulling through at the last minute. Here they identify the problem quickly, rush in, and solve it easily. They actually looked like competent heroes for once especially through the eyes of the students. You certainly don't want to do this during every finale and opener, but as an outlier I thought it was a much appreciated moment for the cast especially after they'd been fumbling in their teacher roles during part 1.

 

3 hours ago, Roughshod said:

It doesn't matter what the curriculum is when the idea of the course is still just as stupid.  Look, just because you can and should make friends in school, doesn't mean you need to build an actual school dedicated to a abstraction like that. Are we honestly expected to believe that friendship was such an alien concept in the world of My Little Pony that an entire educational system was needed to assist everyone that they could form that kind of social bond with others? It completely flies in the face of common sense.

 

Well, we've seen that the friendship school isn't strictly "needed" for other races to create bonds. Gilda and Greta. Spike and Ember. Pinkie and Rutherford. The Changelings. I just didn't read the school in quite the way you did, I guess. I didn't see it being pushed as the only way these races could ever form social bonds. The only races that sent delegates in the first place were those that were already on "friendly" terms with Equestria anyway. No, I saw this as a diplomatic symbol that existed for the purpose Twilight explained to Neighsay. It's about "Respecting differences and communicating." It's a place where all the races can come together, regardless of the systemic prejudices back home, and learn things tutored by the actual elements of harmony, which can then be taken back to their home countries and used at their discretion. It's like an extention to what Gilda is doing in Griffonstone. After Gallus is done with the school, he'll return with whatever he's learned and can use it however he pleases. IT might help him look at people a different way. Solve problems a different way. See things he might've missed before. We learned in Triple Threat that dragons in the dragon lands aren't good at opening up about their feelings, so if dragons, endorsed by the Dragon Lord, keep coming back from the school with more of an ability to open up, they could help make that more of an acceptable practice to the rest of the dragons.

Above everything though, the school hasn't been treated as mandatory for anyone. You go there if you want to go there, if you want to learn under the mane 6. If Ember or Rutherford didn't want Smolder or Yona going, they're under no obligation to stay.

Edited July 19, 2018 by gingerninja666

[PacificGreen 1,163]

Kinda a minor thing that bugged me, but was anyone else wondering how the heck the school got built so fast? I mean I would have preferred to see maybe a small construction montage but we didn't even get a time skip. Kinda makes me think Twilight just magically poofed it into existence.

[MangoFoalix 25,047]

3 minutes ago, PacificGreen said:

Kinda a minor thing that bugged me, but was anyone else wondering how the heck the school got built so fast? I mean I would have preferred to see maybe a small construction montage but we didn't even get a time skip. Kinda makes me think Twilight just magically poofed it into existence.

To be fair, it wouldn't be too far fetched.

I like to think that the school was built over the season hiatus from Season 7 to Season 8.

[PacificGreen 1,163]

1 minute ago, TheTaZe said:

To be fair, it wouldn't be too far fetched.

I like to think that the school was built over the season hiatus from Season 7 to Season 8.

I'd think that would work, but there's just one problem: Twilight comes up with the idea of the friendship school right at the beginning moments of season 8, which we know takes place after the movie.

While I don't know if it's absolutely canonically true, I've heard that the movie takes place between seasons 7 and 8. I don't know, maybe it's wrong (considering we don't see any of the pillars or other important characters from Season 7 like the changelings) and the movie actually takes place slightly before the season 7 finale.

My best theory is that there really was a time skip between Twilight approaching the EEA and the school officially opening, but it wasn't very clearly marked as such in the show.

[MangoFoalix 25,047]

2 minutes ago, PacificGreen said:

I'd think that would work, but there's just one problem: Twilight comes up with the idea of the friendship school right at the beginning moments of season 8, which we know takes place after the movie.

While I don't know if it's absolutely canonically true, I've heard that the movie takes place between seasons 7 and 8. I don't know, maybe it's wrong (considering we don't see any of the pillars or other important characters from Season 7 like the changelings) and the movie actually takes place slightly before the season 7 finale.

My best theory is that there really was a time skip between Twilight approaching the EEA and the school officially opening, but it wasn't very clearly marked as such in the show.

You might be completely right on that. I don't exactly remember how the first few episodes went of the Season due to it being months since I've seen it but I like your theory.

[bigbertha 416]

This episode is really bad. In part 1, Celestia says that even a princess can't do whatever they want when running a school, but the 2 parter ends with Twilight saying she can do whatever she wants because she's a princess. This might've worked better if Celestia didn't say she was bound by the EEA so the ending would've at least made more sense.

Speaking of the EEA, I hate how they're handled. They're shown as this evil organization that ruins everything for the school, but that's not true. The EEA doesn't do anything particularly cruel aside from closing down the school when things go wrong, which really isn't unjustified, Neighsay may exaggerate it, because he's a stereotypical racist, but the school really wasn't going well. The EEA aren't really the problem. The problem is that the mane six aren't good teachers. They look like they're bored, not even trying to make the class fun until they're allowed to do whatever they want. Celestia's school seemed fun in the clips of it we've seen and she says she's also under the EEA, but no. Twilight does whatever she wants because the EEA are evil.

Just the basic concept of the School of Friendship annoys me. Twilight's motivation of wanting to educate those who don't understand friendship comes off as very White Man's Burden-esque, and of course the episode never addresses this implication. That makes the entire episode come off as very uncomfortable with everyone being fine with this. And the school is so vague in how it works. It has normal classes like "rare creature studies" and "history" along with really abstract concepts like "honesty" and "fun". I found myself wondering what the Mane Six were teaching the students and why those were subjects that the students needed to learn. Like, even with the dumb "friendship" stuff, what does learning about fashion have to do with that? How does learning about rare creatures teach the students about friendship? 

And the Student Six don't help the episode. They're so bland and come off as rip offs of the Mane Six. Gallus is just Rainbow Dash. Silverstream is just Pinkie. Ocellus is just Fluttershy. The show seems to think that if it recreates the characters from season 1, it'll be just as charming and enjoyable. But that's not how it works. Season 1 had a different style of animation, a different tone, and different writers. All the Student Six make me want to do is rewatch season 1.

Despite all of this, there are a couple things I like. The song in part 1 sounds really good, bringing back a show-tune style that was sorely missed, despite the weak lyrics and there are a couple decent jokes, even if there aren't too many.

Score: 2/10

Edited March 24, 2019 by bigbertha

[Thrond 3,265]

4 hours ago, bigbertha said:

It implies that all other creatures are inferior to ponies and need to be educated.

I'm not saying that the implication isn't there, but on the other hand, there are pony students at this school as well. Now, if only there were non-pony faculty...

[Singe 2,111]

The episode does make Twilight seem mostly heartless since she's more preoccupied with other things than the ponies that were endangered.

Edited August 2, 2018 by Singe

[PacificGreen 1,163]

You know, one other thing that bugged me about this episode; everyone keeps talking about how harmful the EEA is, especially with regards to the school and international relations, almost as if they're a league of supervillains. But is the EEA not actually a legitimately good institution, even though they have someone like Neighsay as their head? I mean, Celestia herself says every school is held to their standards, so they've got to at least have something good going for them, right?

Heck, Celestia even says at the beginning "Not even a princess can do whatever she likes when it comes to shaping the minds of young ponies". But then the episode is all like "Screw it, the EEA's bad, we're doing it Twilight's way!" Seems a bit contradictory there and needlessly painting the EEA as a villainous strawman, er, organization.

(Sorry, I just have a LOT of things that bug me about this episode, and the season in general. I know I probably have the unpopular opinion here, but that just shows you how seriously I take this show :P)

On 8/1/2018 at 8:52 AM, bigbertha said:

This episode isn't very good. In part 1, Celestia says that even a princess can't do whatever they want when running a school, but the 2 parter ends with Twilight saying she can do whatever she wants because she's a princess. This might've worked better if Celestia didn't say she was bound by the EEA so the ending would've at least made more sense.

The concept of the School of Friendship is not a good one. It implies that all other creatures are inferior to ponies and need to be educated. Also, the EEA guidelines aren't the problem. The problem is that the mane six aren't good teachers. They look like they're bored, not even trying to make the class fun until they're allowed to do whatever they want.

What keeps this episode from being really bad are the student six. The scenes with them are the most charming this show has been since "Made in Manehattan". They're simple, but it's also just nice to see them have fun together. Their friendship is more charming than the mane six's has been since season 3.

There are also other little things I like. The song in part 1 is really good, bringing back a showtune style that was missing from this show for a while, and there are quite a few good jokes.

Score: 5/10

Pretty much this.

I mean, now that I think about it deeper, as we've gone through the season, aside from the book they follow, it seems that not much has really changed with regards to how the school is run. I mean, they have chalkboard lessons, tests, and homework, both during EEA-school and now-school, so...how exactly is EEA at fault here? I think the episode was just really vague here.

[Singe 2,111]

On 8/15/2018 at 1:36 AM, PacificGreen said:

You know, one other thing that bugged me about this episode; everyone keeps talking about how harmful the EEA is, especially with regards to the school and international relations, almost as if they're a league of supervillains. But is the EEA not actually a legitimately good institution, even though they have someone like Neighsay as their head? I mean, Celestia herself says every school is held to their standards, so they've got to at least have something good going for them, right?

Heck, Celestia even says at the beginning "Not even a princess can do whatever she likes when it comes to shaping the minds of young ponies". But then the episode is all like "Screw it, the EEA's bad, we're doing it Twilight's way!" Seems a bit contradictory there and needlessly painting the EEA as a villainous strawman, er, organization.

(Sorry, I just have a LOT of things that bug me about this episode, and the season in general. I know I probably have the unpopular opinion here, but that just shows you how seriously I take this show :P)

Pretty much this.

I mean, now that I think about it deeper, as we've gone through the season, aside from the book they follow, it seems that not much has really changed with regards to how the school is run. I mean, they have chalkboard lessons, tests, and homework, both during EEA-school and now-school, so...how exactly is EEA at fault here? I think the episode was just really vague here.

The EEA is just strict rules to run a tight ship.

Compared to Twilight's way, flimsy where it just falls apart so easily. Couple of lies, students skipping, and surprise inspection; ponies put in danger and her school is closed down. A few angry words at non-ponies, it's almost a war situation. It was that easy for Neighsay to incite them. Twilight has a long way to go.

Point being that EEA is just a scapegoat for Twilight's mistakes and shortcomings here.

Edited August 18, 2018 by Singe

[Varrack 1,080]

Wow this was great! It seemed pretty predictable at first -- that doing things "by the book" was going to be the problem of the episode, and that Twilight would realize that the teachers should just teach their way, but despite that, it ended up being pretty entertaining. I'm really glad we got to see a lot more creatures, especially the ones we just saw in the movie. I didn't expect this to be such an abrupt drop-off from the movie, but it all seemed to work out smoothly. The 2nd song was rather good, although I do wish we had seen more of the teachers teaching "their way". There probably wasn't enough time for that though. anyways, I'd say this is a good start for the season -- I'm excited to watch the rest.

[Singe 2,111]

Actually instead of Neighsay shutting down Twilight's school so quick to the incident. He gives her an ultimatum on the spot. Expel the new six or he shuts her school down. That would have been a good scene.

Edited September 21, 2018 by Singe

[Larrydog 321]

well, since the season is over I think now would be a good time to express my opinions I liked this episode for what it was and find the school as an interesting change. and I found myself liking Neighsay even though he is nothing like me and even before what he does in the finale I just have a thing for bad guys I guess lol. 

[qwerE 96]

I hate this episode. Maybe I can spare part 2, but part 1 was certainly the worst episode I've ever seen. Of course, this is just my opinion, and I think it's great if you liked it- everyone has different tastes.

First, I didn't like that MLP: the movie is canon. I'm not saying that this ruined the episode, it's just that I find it weird that things in MLP: the movie actually happened in FiM. I liked the movie for what it was, but the plot really didn't feel like that of FiM's. Does this mean all the subcharacters like the pirates, tempest, and the fox guy may appear in the show in the future? I really hope not.

Another thing that keeps annoying me is that Twilight is always the one making wrong decisions, while Starlight always makes right choices and fixes things. Why is this always the case? Can't Twilight be the right one for once? I know that the writers made Fluttershy be more assertive after people complained she was not learning her lessons. I think the same thing is happening with Twilight right now. She has now experienced in various occasions that her by-the-book attitute can do more harm than good. It's about time she changed. Twilight is one of my favourite characters in the show, and it makes me sad that she hasn't been doing much, except for ruining things, compared to Starlight. Twilight is one of the smartest and kindest ponies in Equestria. She was the one crowned the princess of friendship by Celestia. I think she needs to get more episodes where she's the hero. This also goes for the rest of the mane 6 - they haven't been the spotlight of an important episode for quite a while. I like Starlight, but I want to see the mane 6 be the heroes again. In almost every episode featuring the mane 6, they all do almost identical things, while Starlight gets to do something special. In School Daze for example, they all become professors, fail to teach, tries to cheer up Twilight but fails, and save the kids. No one does anything memorable. On the other hand, Starlight gets to be special- and things she does are much more memorable because they are unique. Maybe letting one of the mane 7 take turns being the 'special one' would solve the problem. Starlight could've been the professor this episode, she's pretty much one of the mane 6 now. I would love to see Starlight fully become a member of the mane 7, instead of the awkward protagonist-like status she has right now.

Finally, part 1 was too long and painful to watch. I get that they are messed up, and it's not funny. It feels horrible to see the mane 6 having a terrible time. I also didn't want to see Twilight be the stubborn, boring headmaster. I was infuriated by the head of EEA - for making Twilight become the irritating pony she was in the episode, and for his awful, arrogant behaviour. He was also so racist(or speciest?) and ruined everything. I've never really hated anypony in the show before him, but seeing his actions made me actually furious. I really hoped Celestia would fire him, or scold him at least, after he openly insulted the creatures Celestia invited to the school. Why isn't Celestia doing anything about him? He almost started a world war with his racist(or speciest) remarks.

I didn't like the songs that much either. The new students were cool though. Pretty much the only thing that made the episode bearable at least. Please don't let the rest of season 8 be about the school, though... I've had enough. But who's going to teach if the mane 6 all quit? Hmmm...

Edited December 6, 2018 by qwerE

[Senko 459]

It's something I've noticed in the show as they introduce new characters to be the "hero" they tend to sideline existing ones. Celestia as the ruler for a thousand years never really gets a chance to show how she kept the country safe and prosperous as she keeps getting beaten or taken out of the picture in favour of the mane 6, then when Starlight gets introcuded the mane 6 start getting beaten or taken out of the picture while she saves the day and in the latest seasons with the student 6 Starlight joins the others in being beaten or taken out of the picture so they could save the day.

[SunburstRainbow2019 3]

Woo, a school for every-creature! Also, the start of the School's mane-six! Also, I thought Smolder & Spike were gonna ship, but eh maybe they will. I dunno.