Why do so many people dislike Rarity so much and like Rainbow Dash so much?

[Sunny Fox 5,950]

except that's wrong. Rarity just wanted Fluttershy to take the opportunity and mistakenly thought she enjoyed it.

You're wrong, accept that your disdain for Rarity is based on your irrational and erroneous projection of standards onto her.

 

You're, quite literally, 200% wrong. the exact opposite of what you say happened actually happened. Rarity never tried to live through Fluttershy, there's nothings that suggest she did and tons of things that suggest the opposite: she did not truly want Fluttershy being a model, she never took an active part/interest in her modelling and was glad when Fluttershy told her the truth.

 

Also, thank you SolarFox for doing what I should have and editing that last post.

 

 

All you are doing is proving to me that you are an overzealous fanboy who can't accept other people's opinions. Respect other people's opinions. It's a show, you aren't the writer of the show, you don't know what was really meant to be portrayed. Like I said, TV shows can mean different things to different people. Just accept it and we can move on.

 

 

Alright, you at least presented a valid reason. Like I said, it's been a while since I've seen it. You gave quotes from the show, Whatevs just expected me to take his word for it, without giving me any specific examples. Give me a break.

 

 

>overzealous fanboy

who is arguing using direct or near-direct evidence from the show against your groundless accusations that you were bold enough to enter into a discussion but apparently too cowardly to stand behind.

This "it's just my opinion" stance is nothing more than a subversion.

 

 

Maybe I should post direct quotes from the transcript but I can't be asked for something so simple. And again, thank you for editing my post. I'm a noob with these things.

Okay, but let's all refrain from personally attacking the person holding an opposing view, please. Remember, always attack the argument, not the person.

Edited December 31, 2013 by SolarFox

[Whatevs 377]

Alright, you at least presented a valid reason. Like I said, it's been a while since I've seen it. You gave quotes from the show, Whatevs just expected me to take his word for it, without giving me any specific examples. Give me a break.

Oh of course. I have to provide specific quotes for your assertion that what you say is true, for which you provide no evidence. Typical denialist strategy. Give me a break. 

I don't have to prove you are wrong, you have to prove your assertion to be correct.

Fine.

 

Several times in the episode Rarity expresses her dissatisfaction with Fluttershy being a model to Twilight. She refuses to say anything to Fluttershy because it would hurt Shy's feelings.

 

Rarity also expresses dissatisfaction in one of these scenes with how Fluttershy and her no longer spend time with one another. So how can she live vicariously through fluttershy if she gets no reward or contact with Fluttershy's career?

 

And at the end, after Rarity SAVES Fluttershy's career she says something to the effect of: I wanted you to fail but when it came down to it I couldn't stand to see you fail at something you love.

Upon which fluttershy tells her the truth and Rarity is surprised to hear that Fluttershy does not enjoy modelling and Rarity happily expresses her approval of Fluttershy stopping modelling.

 

So we have Rarity not liking Fluttershy being a model, gaining no vicarious pleasure from it and explicitly stating her motivation was altruistic.

 

You can watch the episode or read the transcript and find this stuff. You will find nothing that supports your assertion.

[Sunny Fox 5,950]

Whatevs, I'm trying to make some peace here. Drop it, please.

[Whatevs 377]

Okay, but let's all refrain from personally attacking the person holding an opposing view, please. Remember, always attack the argument, not the person.

I never attacked him, I said his claims were erroneous and silly.

And he's simply raising the bar of acceptable evidence with a pseudointellectual justification while providing NOTHING to support his claim (that, again, he was bold enough to enter into this discussion)

Whatevs, I'm trying to make some peace here. Drop it, please.

Why, he's wrong and refuses to defend his assertion with evidence while dumping the burden of proof on me.

 

I'll be less abrasive but he actually has to construct an argument and not simply say: You have to directly quote the episode in order for your claim to be factual without rewatching the episode or providing evidence for his claim (which is the contested claim here)

[Suitaloo 743]

Excuse me if I misunderstood, but I was under the impression that this thread was for the discussion of Rarity and why certain people disliked her. I presented my opinions as someone who doesn't find Rarity to be the best pony (that title belongs to scootaloo). This is a thread open for discussion to anyone. This isn't a thread for Rarity fans to circlejerk about how great and underappreciated she is. I presented a point, someone presented a counterpoint, I presented a rebuttal, someone did the same, we came to an agreement, and we settled it. I wasn't being "bold" by entering this discussion. I felt like I could contribute why I thought some people didn't appreciate Rarity and why I myself don't exactly like her the best. If you want to create a circlejerk thread, go to /r/mylittlecirclejerk.

[Sunny Fox 5,950]

>Rarity was living the life of a model vicariously, through Fluttershy.

But that's wrong! I guess you really don't watch the show.

 

Rarity was not living vicariously through Fluttershy, she did not enjoy Shy being a model AND felt bad for not spending time with Shy. Living vicariously requires one to take an active role in the life of the other.

Rarity explicitly says she thought Fluttershy enjoyed it and did not want her to stop out of concern for her own feelings.

So yea, generous. Just s typical sitcom misunderstanding.

 

Now you'll probably shuffle the goals posts back and say "well Rarity should have known Fluttershy wouldn't enjoy it."

And you would be right...if these kinds of innocent misunderstandings were not the bread and butter of show.

 

. You people who don't like Rarity can't even get the sequence of events, character motivations remotely right. Rarity didn't even want to be a model.

Just wow.

I'm talking about things like this. It may not be as bad as directly calling someone a rude name, but it's still getting pretty personal. That's all I meant.

[Whatevs 377]

I'm talking about things like this. It may not be as bad as directly calling someone a rude name, but it's still getting pretty personal. That's all I meant.

Fair enough. In that case I apologize. He still has provided no evidence for his claim and simply raises the bar on me referencing what is actually said and made clear by the episode.

And people who criticize Rarity do this a lot. They think the fans of Rarity have to prove THEIR CLAIMS wrong without evidencing it themselves.

Proving a negative is a tad hard, I can't prove you're not a superintelligent frog for example.

[VenomTrixie 57]

Only problem I really ever had with Rarity was when in ''Putting your hoof down'' she encouraged Fluttershy to use her charm to manipulate men to get what she wants. Other then that I have no problem with her.

[Whatevs 377]

Excuse me if I misunderstood, but I was under the impression that this thread was for the discussion of Rarity and why certain people disliked her. I presented my opinions as someone who doesn't find Rarity to be the best pony (that title belongs to scootaloo). This is a thread open for discussion to anyone. This isn't a thread for Rarity fans to circlejerk about how great and underappreciated she is. I presented a point, someone presented a counterpoint, I presented a rebuttal, someone did the same, we came to an agreement, and we settled it. I wasn't being "bold" by entering this discussion. I felt like I could contribute why I thought some people didn't appreciate Rarity and why I myself don't exactly like her the best. If you want to create a circlejerk thread, go to /r/mylittlecirclejerk.

Provide evidence for your sophistry, then you can accuse me of circlejerking and being a fanboy.

Besides, I've noticed that Rarifans don't stand their ground despite being in the right. Supplicating people like you is a part of that.

And besides. I was responding to your claim that "not hurting Shy's feelings" was not generous because it is "expected" despite Twilight telling Rarity she should do so and Rarity not doing so in order to avoid hurting Shy's feelings.

 

The point was is that rarity would rather be silently miserable than say something hurtful to someone she cares about.

[Suitaloo 743]

I already said that the reason I don't like rarity is because she reminds me too much of old school MLP where it was all about tea parties and fashion and shit. Plus I simply prefer all the other ponies over her. She's not my favorite, but I by no means hate her.

 

And the reason I consider that courtesy rather than generosity is because I consider generosity as going out of your way to do something you don't have to do, farther than you would with courtesy, because courtesy is still going out of your way, but in order to do something to conform to a societal norm.

Edited December 31, 2013 by Suitaloo

[Whatevs 377]

Only problem I really ever had with Rarity was when in ''Putting your hoof down'' she encouraged Fluttershy to use her charm to manipulate men to get what she wants. Other then that I have no problem with her.

I personally had no issue with that since it seemed to me that Rarity only wanted her to do it to avoid getting taken advantage of rather than simply always get what you want.

[Sunny Fox 5,950]

Only problem I really ever had with Rarity was when in ''Putting your hoof down'' she encouraged Fluttershy to use her charm to manipulate men to get what she wants. Other then that I have no problem with her.

I posted this earlier in the thread

 

She's acting to help Fluttershy. She doesn't do it for herself, and she even pays the stallion back the coin he spent, when she clearly didn't need to. So right there, there's some generosity she shows even while she is being manipulative.

 

Coin for asparagus...

 

How is this worse than Pinkie Pie showing Fluttershy how to con hard-working business mares out of a coin that they are perfectly entitled to?

Edited December 31, 2013 by SolarFox

[Whatevs 377]

I already said that the reason I don't like rarity is because she reminds me too much of old school MLP where it was all about tea parties and fashion and shit. Plus I simply prefer all the other ponies over her. She's not my favorite, but I by no means hate her.

Provide. Evidence. For. Your. Claims.

Otherwise you contribute nothing at best and are a distraction at worst. 

Saying you simply don't like her is fine, but you went further.

 

And, it's a little funny that people say that about Rarity despite having more varied episodes and faceted characterization than the other 5.

Edited December 31, 2013 by Whatevs

[VenomTrixie 57]

I personally had no issue with that since it seemed to me that Rarity only wanted her to do it to avoid getting taken advantage of rather than simply always get what you want.

But instead of helping her not get taken advantage of it looked like she was teaching her how to take advantage of others herself.

Edited December 31, 2013 by VenomTrixie

[Suitaloo 743]

I'm stating an opinion. Opinion doesn't need evidence behind it. I specifically stated that these were my opinions.

[Whatevs 377]

 

I posted this earlier in the thread

 

She's acting to help Fluttershy. She doesn't do it for herself, and she even pays the stallion back the coin he spent, when she clearly didn't need to. So right there, there's some generosity she shows even while she is being manipulative.

 

Coin for asparagus...

 

How is this worse than Pinkie Pie showing Fluttershy how to con hard-working business mares out of a coin that they are perfectly entitled to?

 

I actually put that in my list of generous deeds, or something like that.

But instead of helping her not get taken advantage of it looked like she was teaching her how to take advantage of others herself.

Fluttershy had been cut in line (unknowingly) by that guy, and using her looks would have helped correct the injustice.

And Rarity did not really take advantage of that guy since she paid him back.

 

You can argue it is not the best lesson certainly, but it's hardly bad in of itself.

I'm stating an opinion. Opinion doesn't need evidence behind it. I specifically stated that these were my opinions.

So let me get this straight...you can simply say something without evidence and guard it under the pretense of it simply being your opinion.

But I have to not only prove it wrong with evidence, I have to go out of my way and directly quote a transcript.

 

No wonder Rarifans can't make much ground in these debates. The rules are stacked against them. All you guys have to do is criticize and argue with evidence without having to stand for anything yourselves.

[Suitaloo 743]

  No. You are twisting my words. All I'm saying is that I am stating my opinion. I'm stating my definitions of generosity and courtesy.  They are similar, but different in source. And let me be perfectly clear:

 

 

I DO NOT HATE RARITY!

 

 

 

Just accept that different people have different opinions and move along. You aren't going to change my mind. All you are doing is making yourself look like a self-righteous asshat who can't accept no for an answer.

[Convergence 83]

The reason why I dislike Rarity is that she simply conflicts with my personality. I am not arguing that her personality is flawed or bad, it is simply that I cannot relate to her at all. I am messy, love camping and working with my hands. I do not care at all about what I look like. I absolutely hate fashion (sorry) to be honest. I would much rather be a nudist if they were socially accepted than keep up to date on clothing and fashion. When I am presented with a character like rarity, I simply cannot relate to her the sheer majority of the time leading to me disliking her character.

 

Rainbow Dash has a cool design and an in your face attitude. I think a lot of people wants to be a little like her because of her attitude. Dash is not my favourite pony by far, but it is easy to admire her confidence and courage to act the way she does. Besides, anything with Dash is 20% cooler so any argument is invalid.

[Whatevs 377]

  No. You are twisting my words. All I'm saying is that I am stating my opinion. I'm stating my definitions of generosity and courtesy.  They are similar, but different in source. And let me be perfectly clear:

 

 

I DO NOT HATE RARITY!

 

 

 

Just accept that different people have different opinions and move along. You aren't going to change my mind. All you are doing is making yourself look like a self-righteous asshat who can't accept no for an answer.

You need to stop acting like I'm stepping on you for 'not liking rarity.' I said simply stating that is perfectly fine. I'm arguing with the way you impune her character's motives in Green Isn't Your Color.

The reason why I dislike Rarity is that she simply conflicts with my personality. I am not arguing that her personality is flawed or bad, it is simply that I cannot relate to her at all. I am messy, love camping and working with my hands. I do not care at all about what I look like. I absolutely hate fashion (sorry) to be honest. I would much rather be a nudist if they were socially accepted than keep up to date on clothing and fashion. When I am presented with a character like rarity, I simply cannot relate to her the sheer majority of the time leading to me disliking her character.

 

Rainbow Dash has a cool design and an in your face attitude. I think a lot of people wants to be a little like her because of her attitude. Dash is not my favourite pony by far, but it is easy to admire her confidence and courage to act the way she does. Besides, anything with Dash is 20% cooler so any argument is invalid.

>in your face attitude

I'm not arguing with you specifically, but I find people using this as a selling point with Dash often.

 

How is this a selling point? Maybe it's because I'm used to women who think their sporty and action oriented having an "in your face attitude" and all of those things being massive character flaws.

[Singe 2,111]

Fashion in FIM is nothing more than a luxury. So Rarity is an artist selling her arts.

[hawkflame 3,310]

The reason why I dislike Rarity is that she simply conflicts with my personality. I am not arguing that her personality is flawed or bad, it is simply that I cannot relate to her at all. I am messy, love camping and working with my hands. I do not care at all about what I look like. I absolutely hate fashion (sorry) to be honest. I would much rather be a nudist if they were socially accepted than keep up to date on clothing and fashion. When I am presented with a character like rarity, I simply cannot relate to her the sheer majority of the time leading to me disliking her character.

 

Rainbow Dash has a cool design and an in your face attitude. I think a lot of people wants to be a little like her because of her attitude. Dash is not my favourite pony by far, but it is easy to admire her confidence and courage to act the way she does. Besides, anything with Dash is 20% cooler so any argument is invalid.

 

Am I the only one who finds relatability to be a little overrated at times? 

 

I am literally the opposite of Rarity in almost every way possible.  She's outgoing and overdramatic, I'm a pretty reseved person .  She's a fashionista, I wear whatever is clean in my drawer. 

 

To me, relatability, when it comes to personality, is boring.  Why would I want to watch a fictional version of myself?  Relatability is only interesting when it comes to being able to deal with the issues of daily life.  That's why my favorite Dash episode is Sonic Rainboom, because it dealt with her issues with her confidence and stage fright.  Relatability is interesting IMO only when it's about a character's moral dilemmas and less about personality quirks.

 

That's also why I like Green Isn't Your Color, as Rarity has a relateable moral dilemma- she feels jealous of Fluttershy's success, but at the same time she feels horrible about her jealousy and makes her best effort to still be a good friend. 

 

But overall, from a *personality* standpoint, I don't find Rarity to be a character I identify with one bit.  And yet she's my favorite, because she's the most *interesting* and *well written* of the six, IMO.  To me, the outer trappings of a character like their interests and hobbies are just cosmetic.  It's what the writers do with the character themselves that's most important. 

 

In the long run, a super relatable character, taken to the nth degree, is really just a version of *you*.  Frankly I don't think I'm super interesting and wouldn't want to read a fictional version of myself.  But a character who is interesting and well written with a lot of layers, will always be *exactly* that. 

[ghostfacekiller39 23,860]

I posted this earlier in the thread

 

She's acting to help Fluttershy. She doesn't do it for herself, and she even pays the stallion back the coin he spent, when she clearly didn't need to. So right there, there's some generosity she shows even while she is being manipulative.

 

Coin for asparagus...

 

How is this worse than Pinkie Pie showing Fluttershy how to con hard-working business mares out of a coin that they are perfectly entitled to?

I'm still waiting for you to see that this topic has evolved past any reasonable discussion and that the same, spammy tune is being played No progress can come from this topic anymore, only anger and fighting

 

So Yeahh...

 

OT: Rarity haterz r just jealous of her fabulousness we r master race u feel me dawg

Edited December 31, 2013 by ghostfacekiller39

[Whatevs 377]

I'm still waiting for you to see that this topic has evolved past any reasonable discussion and that the same, spammy tune is being played No progress can come from this topic anymore, only anger and fighting

 

So Yeahh...

 

OT: Rarity haterz r just jealous of her fabulousness we r master race u feel me dawg

I still await the day when people who don't like Rarity can construct a cogent argument

[Singe 2,111]

It's not simple jealously when it came to Fluttershy's success. Rarity was the one who got Fluttershy in because she saw something in Fluttershy for modeling. Fluttershy's success is put into the control of a more recognized fashion designer and Rarity gets left behind.

 

Kinda like the Family Guy episode "Ready, Willing, and Disabled."

[Gone Airbourne 21,977]

If there is one character I can't stand it is rainbow dash... 

 

She is way too prideful and thinks way too much about herself. It annoys me everytime I see her try and "show off" all the time... it ticks me off. I think Rarity is a great character though if there is one character I cannot stand it is rainbow dash.