mega thread Feminist Club!

[King 5,625]

@Miles, , keep it on topic guys. I can see trouble brewing and Id rather not have to lock this thread. Be respectful to each other and keep things on topic.

[Miles 2,512]

@Miles, , keep it on topic guys. I can see trouble brewing and Id rather not have to lock this thread. Be respectful to each other and keep things on topic.

 

My apologies.  And thank you for the pre-warning.

[Zygen 6,066]

You can give all the background and/or evidence that you want to... but what you're forgetting is that there are not only hard-coded definitions, but in fact, there are unwritten rules and standards, and thus, calling Rarity a *B* is uncalled for.  You can have your opinion, don't get me wrong.  But don't be disrespectful to others by throwing negativity in a positive thread, please, and thank you...

 

 

I've never been to one of these before, but... I feel that there'd ought to be a higher amount of police officers/security guards at these things.  Especially now since there's even more reason for there to be.  

 

One thing that I've always been taught, whether it have been from school, Boy Scouts, Tae-Kwon-Do, or my parents... is that there is always more safety in numbers - as in, one is safer with a friend or in a group of friends, basically no matter where one is going.  Thus, it would be my advice to any and all that may plan on attending one of these events to always have a buddy (or buddies) - friends that can be there to help protect each other from harm.  Seriously, the biggest thing I remember from Scouts that can be applied anywhere in life is the Buddy System.

Like I said I haven't been to one either, but if there isn't a decent sized amount of officers or police at these things, I can see how it could get out of hand. Without security, what's stopping someone from being a jerk and doing whatever they want?

 

It depends on the size and all I suppose, and it's hard to say how many as I'm certainly no expert on it, but there should be a decent amount of security at these things, if there isn't.

 

And while I didn't go through with boyscouts until I aged out, I do remember the safety in numbers buddy system stuff, and in reality that is probably a good idea, regardless of what your doing, it's always better to have someone around in case something happens, whether it be you passing out, breaking a leg, being assaulted, or simply just walking through somewhere dangerous feeling, to give you someone to talk to for comfort.

 

Having a friend or buddy or whatever is really just a good idea in many many cases in life, i'd say going to cons is no exception, so having a buddy at a con might keep people from being harassed as easily. Or being assaulted. Or at the very least give you another pair of hands to help out in case things go wrong.

 

As far as the Rarity thing goes, let's try to keep it positive guys. I agree with Miles - it's totally fine if you aren't in love with Rarity, but let's try to not come off as insulting. I think, in general, it's good to stay away from name-calling, especially when it comes to gendered insults. I don't want the thread to become argumentative.

 

But anyway, I like what you said about the "buddy system." It sucks that people have to worry about harassment and assault, and I think feminists (and just decent human beings in general) should always try to stand up for people who are being targeted by creeps. I bet having more security would help - just having a presence there would really prevent some of the crap that happens, I bet.

I agree, I think it's fine to dislike a character, but it shouldn't come off in an insulting manner.

 

I think people should stand up for others in any case involving harassment, whether it be that kind of thing, bullying, or whatever, somebody should be willing to step in before things go sour. 

 

Like I said to miles, the buddy system I think is pretty important in many aspects of life and when doing many things. Whether it be going to cons, camping, walking down the street even, your going to have a better chance if something bad happens if you have a friend. Will it entirely prevent anything from happening? Maybe not always, but it certainly reduces the chances of anything happening.

 

So yeah, basically I am just saying in a really long winded way that I agree with what both you and Miles and saying more or less ;p.

[Shawn Parks 1,798]

Talk to them. That usually works. Though that should really apply to anyone that's feeling bad

 

 

I wasn't thinking of people who are feeling bad, in general.  I meant victims of domestic abuse, and things like that.  I wonder about how I could help people like that, without having any money or power.

[Jennabun 1,579]

I wasn't thinking of people who are feeling bad, in general.  I meant victims of domestic abuse, and things like that.  I wonder about how I could help people like that, without having any money or power.

 

I can think of a couple things I think...

 

I know one of my friends volunteered at a non profit once. She occasionally did shifts for the domestic abuse hotline. Basically during certain hours of the day, she would live her life as she normally would but she carried around a phone with her. People would sometimes call the hotline if they needed help getting out of an abusive relationship. She would counsel them and point them in the direction of the right resources (they gave her training on how to do this properly). You could do something like that - every place has different local non profits that need help. It doesn't have to be something that time consuming or hard.

 

This next advice is just more general: during your every day life, always keep your eyes and ears open. If you see questionable behavior between a couple and you think it could be abusive, it's always better to be safe than sorry - call the cops. Or just asking the person who you suspect is the victim if they are ok is good if you don't want to call the cops. The bottom line is intervene if you can. I think people have this "stay out of other people's business" mentality when they see two people having issues in public, but seriously, helping people out is vital. For example, I heard a couple screaming at each other in my apartment building once, and then I heard a woman crying. It would be easy to write this off as just a couple fighting, but I called the police to be safe. I think that's the best practice.

 

And also, calling people out when they joke about domestic abuse is beneficial. I hear jokes about abuse all the time, unfortunately. People like to belittle the issue that way. Saying something like, "Dude, that's not funny; abuse isn't a joke" makes people think about their actions. It makes more of a difference than people think.

 

There's probably others, but I'm blanking out... basically: Never think you're powerless. You can do so much.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Jennabun

[Hive King 2,001]

 

 

And also, calling people out when they joke about domestic abuse is beneficial. I hear jokes about abuse all the time, unfortunately. People like to belittle the issue that way. Saying something like, "Dude, that's not funny; abuse isn't a joke" makes people think about their actions. It makes more of a difference than people think.

Yeah, okay, have to disagree with you there. Murder is worse than rape or abuse(you can't recover from it) yet everyone makes jokes about it. People make jokes about the Holocaust. Humor is done because it's funny, there isn't some grand scheme to belittle victims. And I can tell you that if someone told me that, they come off as someone who thinks they alone understand morals and are annoying 

[Jennabun 1,579]

 

 

Yeah, okay, have to disagree with you there. Murder is worse than rape or abuse(you can't recover from it) yet everyone makes jokes about it. People make jokes about the Holocaust. Humor is done because it's funny, there isn't some grand scheme to belittle victims. And I can tell you that if someone told me that, they come off as someone who thinks they alone understand morals and are annoying

 

I would never joke about murder either... I think all types of jokes like that are insulting. I don't think they ought to be encouraged.

 

And actually, I do think jokes do play into a larger societal theme of people not taking abuse seriously. That's why I hate all jokes that make light of serious issues or jokes based on prejudiced stereotypes. I hate abuse jokes, rape jokes, race jokes, gender jokes, gay jokes.... it's lazy humor at best and severely harmful to people at worst. I don't mind if people think that me speaking up about that is annoying. I imagine someone telling a joke about domestic abuse to an actual abuse victim, making fun of the torture they went through, and I feel myself getting twisted up inside.

 

I guess I'm just one of those sticks-in-the-mud who don't enjoy offensive humor.

[Hive King 2,001]

@@Jennabun,

You are aware that if you are going to police things like that, then dogs should be outlawed because dogs have killed more people than sharks and as such, someone might be phobic of them. People aren't psychic and they shouldn't be expected to just censor themselves because someone might be a victim near them. Even then, not all victims have a problem with that. Plenty of people have joked about their own issues.  

[FoxyCryptid 4,330]

So the term fag is not offensive? Bitch is just as bad as word. Bitch is very much a gender specific term- even if you don't use it that way. But again, this thread is not a place to argue. I'm just telling you that I think it's offensive and should not be used in this thread.

 

Okay, I have to interject here.

 

Please, go tell a gay male that a extremely dehumanizing insult that's born from society views them as less that human, deviants, molesters, and monsters the same level of offensive as the word bitch and see his reaction, I'll wait.

 

I say that because it's been DECADES since it's been socially acceptable to mistreat women in the US, yet LGBT people are JUST NOW gaining acceptance and being treated as human in the last few years and some states still don't allow gay marriage. That's like comparing being called a retard to being called a dick. 

 

 

On topic, my other posts still stands that I support women's rights but not 90% of what feminism has become. 

Edited August 6, 2014 by Shoboni

[Jennabun 1,579]

 

 

You are aware that if you are going to police things like that, then dogs should be outlawed because dogs have killed more people than sharks and as such, someone might be phobic of them. People aren't psychic and they shouldn't be expected to just censor themselves because someone might be a victim near them. Even then, not all victims have a problem with that. Plenty of people have joked about their own issues.

 

........What? .....Dogs?

 

I'm not advocating making anything illegal. We have free speech, and that's a good thing. But that doesn't mean we don't have a right to be critical of what comes out of people's mouths, however. I merely think that positive, respectful humor that doesn't make fun of serious, widespread violence ought to be encouraged. That's how we set high expectations of our society - by speaking up when things are negative and/or harmful and making people think about how their words affect society at large.

 

I always think it's interesting, how people are always so quick to defend offensive comedy. I wish people would defend abuse victims that vigilantly.

[Hive King 2,001]

 

 

........What? .....Dogs?

It's actually pretty shocking, lol. Dogs kill a lot of people

 

 

I'm not advocating making anything illegal. We have free speech, and that's a good thing. But that doesn't mean we don't have a right to be critical of what comes out of people's mouths, however. I merely think that positive, respectful humor that doesn't make fun of serious, widespread violence ought to be encouraged. That's how we set high expectations of our society - by speaking up when things are negative and/or harmful and making people think about how their words affect society at large.

You're making it illegal more so in the way that everyone will hate it. What you propose is to make it societally illegal

 

 

I always think it's interesting, how people are always so quick to defend offensive comedy. I wish people would defend abuse victims that vigilantly.

Okay, this is incredibly passive agressive. This heavily implicates that I don't care about abuse victims and that I care more about jokes than them. 

[FoxyCryptid 4,330]

......

I always think it's interesting, how people are always so quick to defend offensive comedy. I wish people would defend abuse victims that vigilantly.

 

There are abuse victims that use humor to cope and will defend that kind of comedy. 

[ShadowFoxz 342]

It's actually pretty shocking, lol. Dogs kill a lot of people

 

 

You're making it illegal more so in the way that everyone will hate it. What you propose is to make it societally illegal

 

 

Okay, this is incredibly passive agressive. This heavily implicates that I don't care about abuse victims and that I care more about jokes than them. 

1: They dont

2: what the heck are you trying to say?

3:who cares if what she said is passive aggressive or not, she has the right of free speech

[Jennabun 1,579]

It's actually pretty shocking, lol. Dogs kill a lot of people

 

Yeah, I already knew that. I just thought the comparison to what I said about avoiding abuse jokes was misplaced.

 

 

 

You're making it illegal more so in the way that everyone will hate it. What you propose is to make it societally illegal

 

That's not a thing...

 

 

 

Okay, this is incredibly passive agressive. This heavily implicates that I don't care about abuse victims and that I care more about jokes than them.

 

I'm sorry, but that's how it came off. I'm sure you care about abuse victims, but the way you immediately came to defense of the jokes instead of supporting anything else I said about abuse prevention, you know?

 

 

There are abuse victims that use humor to cope and will defend that kind of comedy. 

 

Then they can use it for themselves; fine. But I'm sick of seeing abuse jokes as a widespread cultural trend. It's seen as boundary-pushing, edgy, and cool to joke about abuse/rape/etc.in the media, and that's where I see a problem. The vast majority of people who go around casually using that humor are not abuse victims. I don't think that's ok.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Jennabun

[Hive King 2,001]

 

 

1: They dont

You want me to bring up statistics

 

 

3:who cares if what she said is passive aggressive or not, she has the right of free speech

Of course she does, but she seems to be doing it in a way that is done specifically to insult me

 

 

 

That's not a thing...

It kind of is. For example, in many places, a women can go around topless if she chooses without repercussion from the law. This is looked down upon however

 

 

I'm sorry, but that's how it came off. I'm sure you care about abuse victims, but the way you immediately came to defense of the jokes instead of supporting anything else I said about abuse prevention, you know?  

I thought you had it covered. There's no need to just do nothing in this thread but go

"Wow, we are all so awesome"

I know that you are right about the abuse, those are great tips. However, the discussion leads nowhere if I just do nothing but metaphorically jerk off your post 

[FoxyCryptid 4,330]

Ye

 

 

Then they can use it for themselves; fine. But I'm sick of seeing abuse jokes as a widespread cultural trend. It's seen as boundary-pushing, edgy, and cool to joke about abuse/rape/etc.in the media, and that's where I see a problem. The vast majority of people who go around casually using that humor are not abuse victims. I don't think that's ok.

 

The fact of the matter is that humor is subjective and no one as any right to tell other people what they should find funny.

 

We can give our opinions as passionately as we please and believe whatever we want and be convinced of being right but that doesn't mean we can tell other people what tot feel or censor their humor.  

Yo

 

I know that you are right about the abuse, those are great tips. However, the discussion leads nowhere if I just do nothing but metaphorically jerk off your post 

 

This, echo chambers lead to nothing productive(just look at Tumblr)

[Jennabun 1,579]

The fact of the matter is that humor is subjective and no one as any right to tell other people what they should find funny.

 

We can give our opinions as passionately as we please and believe whatever we want and be convinced of being right but that doesn't mean we can tell other people what tot feel or censor their humor.

 

 

This, echo chambers lead to nothing productive(just look at Tumblr)

Understood. Voicing opinions isn't akin to censorship though. Free speech exists so that we can create a dialogue about things. If I, or anyone else, hears a joke that rubs then the wrong way and starts a discussion about the joke's implications, that's not censorship. That's healthy free speech at work.

[FoxyCryptid 4,330]

Understood. Voicing opinions isn't akin to censorship though. Free speech exists so that we can create a dialogue about things. If I, or anyone else, hears a joke that rubs then the wrong way and starts a discussion about the joke's implications, that's not censorship. That's healthy free speech at work.

 

I didn't say it was, but telling people to NOT ever tell the joke is trying to censor them.

[ShadowFoxz 342]

You want me to bring up statistics

No as I don't intend on taking this discussion any farther.

 

 

Of course she does, but she seems to be doing it in a way that is done specifically to insult me

How? she doesn't mention your name or direct it you.

Edited August 6, 2014 by @Vinyl Scratch

[IceeBrony 251]

 

 

I guess I'm just one of those sticks-in-the-mud who don't enjoy offensive humor.

 

That's down to taste. Some people need to be able to laugh at things they probably shouldn't. Humor is a bit of a defense mechanism.

Dogs kill lots of people? 32 (in USA in 2013) isn't very many

Next you'll be saying that pit bulls should be outlawed...

 

 

[Miles 2,512]

This, echo chambers lead to nothing productive(just look at Tumblr)

 

A chain is only as strong as its weakest link.  Promoting more positive outlooks as well as educating others about the truths of the evils of society can strengthen us, the chain-links, as to thus possibly enable ourselves to do the right thing and act accordingly, should an incident ever occur in earshot of us.  Just knowing that this stuff happens, and that we can do something about, isn't leading to passiveness, but rather activeness, in that we might be able to save someone from harm's way.  

 

... Lead not into temptation, but deliver us from evil...

 

We have the ability to reach out and help.  Let us do so, if it is ever needed.  Someday you might need the help, and I just hope that the help will be there, will be effective, and will allow a successful escape from harm.

[mars 4,862]

Friendly reminder that this topic is meant to talk about feminism as a pro. Even if it's a "circle jerk", it's been to be a safe haven for feminists. If you want to debate, please do so in another thread in the debate pit, thank you.

[ShadowFoxz 342]

Friendly reminder that this topic is meant to talk about feminism as a pro. Even if it's a "circle jerk", it's been to be a safe haven for feminists. If you want to debate, please do so in another thread in the debate pit, thank you.

was about to say that  ~Brohoofs~

Edited August 6, 2014 by @Vinyl Scratch

[Jennabun 1,579]

I didn't say it was, but telling people to NOT ever tell the joke is trying to censor them.

 

It is impossible for an individual to censor another individual. That's not what censorship is. Me telling you I don't like a certain joke isn't censorship. It doesn't limit what you can say - you can continue to tell that joke over and over if you want. My criticism would function merely as a comment for your consideration. If my criticism is heard and other people also start to reject the same type of joke, then that was their decision. It wasn't me who forced that decision for anybody - I voiced my opinion, and others decided that they agreed and changed their behavior on their own accord. That's how free speech works - there's a marketplace of ideas out in the open for people to absorb, and people choose to absorb the ideas that they agree with and reject the ones they disagree with. I voice my criticism of abuse jokes simply because I hope that people out there somewhere will absorb my idea and think it's good. Believe me, I truly understand that people disagree with me, no one is saying that everyone absolutely has to agree with me. But I do hope that someone might agree with me, simply because I think it would be a positive change.

 

Can we get back to happy topics? I feel like I'm in that debate pit thread...

Edited August 6, 2014 by Jennabun

[FoxyCryptid 4,330]

Friendly reminder that this topic is meant to talk about feminism as a pro. Even if it's a "circle jerk", it's been to be a safe haven for feminists. If you want to debate, please do so in another thread in the debate pit, thank you.

 

If the mods wouldn't lock nearly every thread that's critical of it while leaving only this open....

 

A chain is only as strong as its weakest link.  Promoting more positive outlooks as well as educating others about the truths of the evils of society can strengthen us, the chain-links, as to thus possibly enable ourselves to do the right thing and act accordingly, should an incident ever occur in earshot of us.  Just knowing that this stuff happens, and that we can do something about, isn't leading to passiveness, but rather activeness, in that we might be able to save someone from harm's way.  

 

... Lead not into temptation, but deliver us from evil...

 

We have the ability to reach out and help.  Let us do so, if it is ever needed.  Someday you might need the help, and I just hope that the help will be there, will be effective, and will allow a successful escape from harm.

 

That really has nothing to do with this, at all.

 

A echo-chamber in fact discourages that because people won't voice their concerns and criticisms.