Jump to content
Banner by ~ Zero

So talk me out of (or into) buying a motorcycle


SolidTwilight
 Share

Recommended Posts

So I always wanted to motorcycle for most of my life. I have always avoided it because crashing one is not something I ever want to be a part of. I have been giving it some real thought the last few weeks. my thinking is going something like this. I am almost 30 (not a speed crazed teen anymore as much) have almost 14 years of driving experience and I have hundred of hours of road biking in traffic. anyway I was thinking of getting something simple like a used kawasaki klr (the funny part is that it would not be the most expensive bike I own. what are your thought and or experience on the subject? my biggest fear is getting hurt and not being able to ride my bicycle anymore (one of my favorite things in the world to do). also do you think that driving a motorcycle a lot would make ride a bicycle less fun?

  • Brohoof 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites


My dad had this cousin who owned a motorcycle. One day his cousin hit a dip in the road or something, lost control of the bike and ran head first into a tree. He spent the rest of his life a vegetable. 

 

Motorcycles seem pretty cool, but its always been that story that has made me not want one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


It's nicknamed a "murdercycle" by some people. You don't have a car around you to cushion any unwanted forces you may experience when driving, so you have little resistance against accidents. The more mass you have when driving, the better.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


One of my best friends used to have one. It saves a toooooooooooooooon on gas. He bought awesome looking spine armor and wore an intense looking helmet. Safe and stylish. As long as you know what you're doing, you'll be okay. Go out on back roads where you can get good practice (just make sure it's not where the crazy drivers like to go). Once you get everything down and mastered, you should be good. Just be aware of the drivers around you. My friend never got into an accident.

 

Also, riding a bike and a motorcycle are different. If you ride both without a helmet, one gives you a good sight of the world around you. The other gets you bugs splattered in your face with no time to enjoy your surroundings or the fresh air. It shouldn't dampen your biking experience.

Edited by HopeFul
Link to comment
Share on other sites


They look cool and all, but honestly they aren't very safe at all. I can barely feel safe in a normal car. Motorcycles just don't have any protection. You could be the best driver and the safest driver in the world, but all it takes is one jerk to mess up and crash into you somehow causing you injury or worse.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Bah, if you want one, just do it. I have a number of friends with motorcycles.

I myself intend to have one before 2016.

It's a lot easier to die on a bike than in a car, true, but as long as you do everything you can to be safe, there's nothing else to be done.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


As a fellow adult, if you can still pay your mortgage and feed the family then get it.  I spend my money on better computer parts.  Got a friend who customizes his sports car. As long as the family is taken care of first then go for it.  If you're not married then even more reason to get a toy for yourself.

 

As for the "murdercycle" thing, all forms of transit have risks so I'm not as swayed against ownership based on potential accidents.  Just like riding a bicycle in traffic, you need to assume that no one can see you, and ride accordingly.  And bikes are more affected by the weather conditions so don't push 100mph+ in a rainstorm and you'll be fine.

  • Brohoof 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


I've lost family members in car accidents. Accidents can happen anywhere at any time. I've known someone who got hit by a car walking, and someone who died on a bicycle. My Nana had a friend back in her day who died on a motorcycle, but she also talked about people who walked away from accidents unharmed (one of those also being someone who drove a motorcycle). If you're afraid, I say that's a reason to not do it, but if you have faith and confidence in yourself, go ahead and get the motorcycle.

 

I don't drive anything because I'm afraid of other drivers. lol We have REALLY bad drivers around here, especially with the younger kids driving. This town is bad on teaching respect, manners, and common sense. I swear this is why Arkansas has such a bad rep for being full of idiots.

  • Brohoof 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites


I've ridden for most of my adult life-and I agree with many of the other posters who state that it's often the other idiots on the road that cause the accidents-texting or yakking on their cell phones instead of concentrating.

 

If you're going to get one, my advice is to take a training course. You'll learn techniques that may save your life-and you'll get a road test waiver. The other thing is, don't buy more bike than you can handle. Do some research on which bikes are the best for beginners and work up to a bigger one.

  • Brohoof 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Badges

Motorcycling is what you make of it. People will drone on and on with horror stories about riding them but in reality your safety rests with you. If its something you've always wanted to do go for it. The worst thing that can happen is you wait and wait and before you know it your too old to ride one.

 

Get into an approved motorcycle riding class. In most states you don't have to go to a riding school but you should. The biggest problem with people that ride bikes is that after a year or two they suddenly become experts. You just getting your first bike should not be afraid to ask questions and admit your a noob. When people don't acknowledge their skill level is when they start getting hurt.

 

As a new Rider you have no business on a motorcycle bigger than 250cc. Don't buy any 600 or 650cc bike yet. If you give a 16 year old kid who just learned how to drive a brand new Ferrari what do you think is going to happen? He is more than likely going to wreck its just a matter of time.

 

Take it slow. Gain Experience. Wear Your Helmet and Gear. Have Fun. 

  • Brohoof 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites


They look cool and all, but honestly they aren't very safe at all. I can barely feel safe in a normal car. Motorcycles just don't have any protection. You could be the best driver and the safest driver in the world, but all it takes is one jerk to mess up and crash into you somehow causing you injury or worse.

 

Motorcycling is what you make of it. People will drone on and on with horror stories about riding them but in reality your safety rests with you. If its something you've always wanted to do go for it. The worst thing that can happen is you wait and wait and before you know it your too old to ride one.

 

Get into an approved motorcycle riding class. In most states you don't have to go to a riding school but you should. The biggest problem with people that ride bikes is that after a year or two they suddenly become experts. You just getting your first bike should not be afraid to ask questions and admit your a noob. When people don't acknowledge their skill level is when they start getting hurt.

 

As a new Rider you have no business on a motorcycle bigger than 250cc. Don't buy any 600 or 650cc bike yet. If you give a 16 year old kid who just learned how to drive a brand new Ferrari what do you think is going to happen? He is more than likely going to wreck its just a matter of time.

 

Take it slow. Gain Experience. Wear Your Helmet and Gear. Have Fun. 

 

 

I agree with both above.

 

I've ridden a motorcycle for a little over 4 years now, this includes 50cc, 125cc and 600s.

 

I have a Yamaha XJ6 right now after i crashed my last bike, a 125.

 

 

 

They are a good load of fun, but if you do get into a crash, i can tell you from first hand experience that it does hurt, but wearing the right gear will minimize the damage you sustain, no matter where you are going, you may think about not bothering with your gear if you're only heading down to the shop but you really should, the day you dont bother with your gear is the crash you dont want to have. Have a smaller bike for a while before going to something bigger, my 125 could get around 80mph, ive gotten my 600 to 100 with ease, but a 125 is fine for staying the speed limit.

  • Brohoof 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


its not your driving id be worried about--its a lack of respect for bikers on the road.  A friend of mine had to lay down her bike when someone pulled out in front of her.  tore up her legs pretty bad even through jeans, and thankfully she had a leather jacket that absorbed most of the asphalt.  The person drove off, and a guy sitting at the red light was honking the horn and laughing at her.  few weeks later shes at another red light, and the goon behind her inched forward and tapped her tire.....she put the kickstand down, got off the bike and beat on the womans window til she rolled it down.  the womans defense was "i didnt hit your bike, i only bumped your tire"  which would have thrown and killed my friend had they been moving.

i watch out for them and truckers on the interstate, but you be careful out there.  people suck.

get a full face helmet, itll protect you from a broken jaw, and splurge for the jackets that have an inflatable neck brace.  its got a line/key thing that hooks to your bike. god forbid, but if you come off, it puffs up and could save your life,  

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I don't see anything wrong with the motorcycle actually, it's just a matter of preference though it can depend if you'd like to transport others where a car would come in handy.. But It's not like you'll need to taxi someone urgently or anything.

Honestly I'd prefer it to the car, but it can be more dangerous as some say.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


If you can afford it, go for it. As someone who's been into motorcycles since i was 5 years old and ride one myself, they're tons of fun. Of course, they're dangerous as some have already pointed out, but if you're careful, don't buy a too powerful of a bike right off the bat and most importantly, WEAR ALL THE GEAR, ALL THE TIME, NOT JUST A HELMET, you're golden. Also, don't be too cheap with the protective gear, it's a pretty expensive investment but if you buy yourself good gear, they're gonna serve you for a long time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


My mom was a huge biker...I remember her in leather chaps and those fringed leather coats all the time. She had a blue Suzuki motorcycle.

Now, don't get me wrong, owning a motorcycle is 'dead' wish of mine. I would absolutely love to have and ride one, but they are more dangerous than a bicycle (i am an avid biker in that regard, and for those who say its easier to die on bicycle, you are wrong. Statistically speaking, there are more motorcycle deaths per year in the USA than Bicycle deaths). The most common cause of death regarding both of these is speed, and which one is faster? However, in densely populated areas, the most common cause of death for both of these is negligence by other vehicle operators (no matter how safe you are being, you cannot control the actions of others). Also statistically speaking, you are more likely to die on a motorcycle than any other form of transportation. With a bicycle, you actually have a higher change of dying on an ATV than on a bicycle, and fewer people own ATV's.... The likelihood of you surviving a "typical" motorcycle accident are slim. Anything over 25mph is near 100% chance of death.....

http://www.msgroup.org/Tip.aspx?Num=170  This site not only has statistics, but has helpful tips on keeping you safe (I actually look to a lot of motorcycle sites for bicycle safety).

This is one of MANY websites out there that talk motorcycle statistics, and believe me, none of them are pretty..

 

Now when I was a kid, I rode a lot with my mom. I remember having to wear a really heavy black helmet (I hated the feeling of its weight). One time, my mom was almost ran into by another vehicle while she was turning a corner (It was a right turn and the other vehicle went through the stop sign going to hit us from the side). My mom made the turn sharper and aimed us for the ditch to avoid a collision). I went flying and landed a ways away from the motorcycle and my mom. I was perfectly fine, just stunned from impact and scared. My mom however, had the motorcycle land on half of her, and she ended up with a broken leg. I remember police and everything, and I believe the other driver had to pay for her medical bills. The motorcycle was okay, but I went away from that learning to never sharp turn on my bicycle, and if it looks like I may get hit, throw myself to the ditch. I still rode with her, but I became more vigilant. Now on a bicycle, I'm pretty smart and stay vigilant, but I know accidents can happen. I take that risk every time I get on it, and sadly, I know others are more of a danger to me than myself and I've many close calls because of people being inattentive or ignorant of bicyclists. I had a friend back in high school lose her left arm because a guy did not know bike hand signals. Now that I know most people don't know hand signals, I ride against traffic (which is illegal but I'd rather explain to a cop than have potential danger come up from behind and not know until it is too late)  Because I cannot control others, I do not want to get a motorcycle.

 

I would love to talk you into one. I see them as the ultimate freedom in regards to transportation. The best gas mileage you can get, the easiness of travel (you can bring all you could ever need on a bike without hauling a house!). I think it's the best way to experience life on the open road. Plus Sturgis!!! I know that's clique, but on my honeymoon, we accidentally went through the rally (we got married August 8th, and because motorcycles are the last thing on my mind, we didn't even think about checking on it, even though we knew we'd being going through Sturgis). I can't tell how much I wanted to get bike then and there, to my husband's confusion and dismay (he had no idea of my latent desire that was rekindled). I was at least able to convince him to let me get a razorback souvenir....and I desperately want to go to the 75th anniversary next year! I may not have a motorcycle, but I love what they are and are capable of. I just know that risks outweigh the potential joys (I love my husband more than anything, and dying on motorcycle isn't worth losing him). But again, you cannot control the actions of others, and that is your biggest danger on the road.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


It's not so much the safety aspect that turns me off (considering we share the road with semi-trucks filled to the brim with coal and no car or truck can do much against those big things if something goes wrong) it's the freaking cost to own one at times. Keep in mind things like loan payments, insurance (those can REALLY be a bitch), and gas; not to mention things like repairs or whatnot, then you could be running a pretty penny.

 

Really, it's your business and all, but the cost turns me off.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


If you get a motorcycle - ALWAYS PAY ATTENTION! Sometimes other people aren't paying attention, and thus you paying attention could save your life. This works not just with motorcycles but all vehicles. They're fun, and I want one, but a lot of people on the road are distracted. And it might not even be other drives, a bump in the road, a sharp turn at night. Go for it man, but be safe.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Despite what a lot of people on here are saying, there is nothing wrong with getting a motorcycle, yes they are dangerous, and yes you should always be very aware of whats going on around you, but as long as you do those things and always wear a helmet then that's all you can really do. Another good point of that you should consider when buying a motorcycle is to consider staying off of extremely busy highways and interstates and stick to the smaller roads as well, just because of the simple fact that the less traffic their is the less likely you are to have someone hit you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I don't have a motorcycle, but if you treat your machine right, and are a generally observant person you could definitely enjoy the open road and feeling of freedom one grants. My older brother owns one as opposed to my preference for a car, he always brags about how life should have a little bit of danger in em'.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Badges

So I always wanted to motorcycle for most of my life. I have always avoided it because crashing one is not something I ever want to be a part of. I have been giving it some real thought the last few weeks. my thinking is going something like this. I am almost 30 (not a speed crazed teen anymore as much) have almost 14 years of driving experience and I have hundred of hours of road biking in traffic. anyway I was thinking of getting something simple like a used kawasaki klr (the funny part is that it would not be the most expensive bike I own. what are your thought and or experience on the subject? my biggest fear is getting hurt and not being able to ride my bicycle anymore (one of my favorite things in the world to do). also do you think that driving a motorcycle a lot would make ride a bicycle less fun?

 

It really depends on where you are. The quiter and the better the roads the better. Don't get one if you liove in the city - it's not worth the dangers. You need open, high quality roads to fully enjoy them!

Link to comment
Share on other sites


 

Also statistically speaking, you are more likely to die on a motorcycle than any other form of transportation. With a bicycle, you actually have a higher change of dying on an ATV than on a bicycle, and fewer people own ATV's.... The likelihood of you surviving a "typical" motorcycle accident are slim. Anything over 25mph is near 100% chance of death.....

http://www.msgroup.org/Tip.aspx?Num=170  This site not only has statistics, but has helpful tips on keeping you safe (I actually look to a lot of motorcycle sites for bicycle safety).

This is one of MANY websites out there that talk motorcycle statistics, and believe me, none of them are pretty..

 

Hehe, I was going to bring up my own experience even before I read your post...

 

Some time or another I know I have already posted this story... it'd be easier if I could find that and quote myself, but... alas, I cannot find it.

 

Anyway:

When I was 18, my parents bought me a motorcycle for my high school graduation present.  I was totally, utterly at a loss for words.  Absolutely speechless.  I had no idea whatsoever that they were getting me one.  

 

Ever since I was little I've been riding ATV's and dirtbikes.  My first four-wheeler I got when I was 4 years old.  It was an off-brand that my parents bought at a Kawasaki Dealership; it had a 50cc engine.  My second four-wheeler I got when I was like, maybe 7 or 8 (I can't quite remember, I may have been a bit older idk).  It was a Yamaha Raptor 80cc.  Then, when I was about 10 or 11, I changed it up and got a dirtbike.  It was a whole new experience.  Of course, I've been riding a bicycle since I was like 3, so the balance issue wasn't hard, but, getting used to the power was different than my past ATV's.  It was a Yamaha TTR 90cc.  That thing ripped for being such a small thing, I swear you'd think it had a bigger engine!  Then, in my early teen years, I got tired of the dirtbike.  Why?  I just outgrew it really, but also, I had more recreational fun on a quad (ATV).  So, I asked if I could sell the dirtbike and get a bigger quad.  Parents said "sure."  So I did.  And we bought me a Yamaha Raptor 350cc.  Still have it.  I'll never outgrow it.  It's plenty powerful enough for me, I'm only 175 pounds.  

 

So, as you can tell, I'd had experience before getting on an actual motorcycle.  However, even still, I wanted to be as safe and knowledgeable as I could be.  So, instead of just going to the DMV and taking the driving test to get my license, I decided it best to take the rider's course from a local college.  It was only 20 bucks, and it was well worth it.  Lasted 3 days; a Friday night, all day Saturday, and most of Sunday.  There was a written test about the rules of the road (which was the main reason I wanted to take the course), and then there was the actual riding test.  I aced the written test.  Out of 50 questions or more, I only missed 3.  Now, there were 11 people in the course.  When the time came to do the riding test, it was my time to shine.  They had different sizes and kinds of bikes for different ages and weight groups of people.  They put me on a Yamaha (Yee-Haw!) Enduro (an on/off road bike that is still street legal).  It was perfect for me.  The tests were plentiful; things such as cone weaves, the "friction zone test" - which means you had to ride the clutch while still moving forward, going as slow as you can while keeping balance, then there was the figure 8, some U-turns, brake test, acceleration (to a safe speed, of course) test, and then, my favorite - the Oval Track test.  On the Oval Track test, the key parts were the corners.  You had to slow down slightly before you hit the corner, then just before you turned, slightly pull the throttle (as if you were using "cruise control" in a car), then as you go around the corner, you have to aim your head at the corner's exit ("where you want to go")... Then the most important aspect that they stressed is keeping on the throttle as you start straightening back up.  They said you can choose to either keep "cruising" or you can slightly "get on" the throttle as to speed up a little.  

 

I loved it.  I am SO glad I did that.  There is no better thing for new motorcycle riders than to take that course.  And guess what?  The way the riding test was scored was not by positive points, but rather by subtracting points for errors, such as putting your foot down, or putting the bike down, etc.  Well... hahaha.... out of those 11 people in the course, only myself and one other guy scored perfectly in the riding tests.  A week or two later, in the mail came my certificate, and all I had to do was give that to the people at the DMV, and they printed my new licence.  Now, instead of just "D" for regular cars and trucks, it says "DM" - the "M" for motorcycle.  

 

Finally, I could ride on the roads.  It was exhilarating.  And my motorcycle, gosh... I mean, just look at this beauty:

 

bceeeaa2e2.jpg

 

 

 

I rode around town for a while.  Did that for a few weeks, just to get used to my bike before taking her on the highway.

Then, a local Nazarene Church had it's yearly ride, in which my father and I participated in.

 

 

 

35c3a3a801.jpg

 

 

 

We road from our hometown (we live in Fulton County, IL) to... I believe it was Burlington, Iowa.  Then of course, back home, lol.

It was an experience that I am so thankful to have had.  Plus, riding in a pack is much safer.  I'm glad my dad and I stuck together.  He was always either right in front of me or right behind me.  Overall, it was probably around or just over 160 miles round trip.  I gained skill and endurance on that trip, and I think it was a good player in advancing my instincts as a rider.

 

A couple weeks after that trip was when I had the wreck.  Yeah... *sigh*

 

I was just riding on some backroad highway between my town and a neighboring town.  Not a busy road.  Usually it's calm.  
I had already gone to the nearby town and was heading back home.  I was about halfway home when it happened...

 

I was riding on a straight-a-way just coming up near a long curve.  Speed limit on the straight was 55, but I was only going like 45 or 50 (mph).  As I neared the corner, I looked around the bend (like the rider's course had taught me to do) to check for traffic, and to "see where I wanted to go."  Well, there was a car coming.  And it was going way too fast.  Probably like 65 or 70 mph.  And... it was on my side of the road.  

 

*Instincts took control*

 

I knew I couldn't ditch it (go in the ditch) because the ditch was 6 foot deep or more.  So I had 2 options: Hope the car moved out of my way in time, or drop the bike and slide to the side of the road.  I didn't have to think about it, it just happened, I chose option 2.

 

From about 45 or 50 mph, I slammed both front and back brakes, tilted/leaned right, and then the bike just dropped itself.  I was wearing my helmet, like I always do - I would have never, and still will never, ride without it on.  As the bike dropped, I instinctively jumped/pushed away from the bike before it landed on me, then I tucked my arms up against my chest.  My adrenaline was running full bore, wide open throttle, flowing through my veins, my brain was on bypass and everything was just a blur because, again, everything happened via instinct.  I hit the ground moving about 30 mph, I skidded across the pavement... the car came within a few feet of me, but missed me.  But the car kept going, didn't stop!  As I came to a stop on the side of the road, the blur cleared and I re-focused (though my adrenaline stayed for a good half hour longer).  I checked myself out as I lied there on the ground.  I was okay.  I didn't have any broken bones.  Thank God... He was watching over me that day (*and cue the watery eyes as I type*)... I had bloodied up arms.  My skin was pretty nasty, had pebbles and tar, etc.  But I wasn't bleeding all too badly.  I didn't feel any pain yet, of course, I didn't until like half an hour later.  So, from there, after I knew I was fine, I got up.  I looked over at my bike.  It was slowly spilling gas onto the road.  I ran over to it and picked it up.  Now lemme tell you something: I'm not a body builder by any means, but nor am I weak.  At the time I had a few years of summer work experience - working for my city, shoveling asphalt patch out the back of a ton truck, digging ditches, throwing sand, making sidewalks, picking up fallen limbs after storms.  I have the same work ethic as Applejack, honestly... but... gosh damn, that bike is heavy.  I mean, it may only be a 650cc (it's a Yamaha V-Star 650) bike, but it's a cruiser, not a sport bike.  It was all I could do to get that thing off the ground, even with my adrenaline rush.  But I did.  Then I walked it to the side of road.

 

I called home... to no avail, as nobody answered.  So, I just kinda rested for a bit.  Slowly the pain started coming in as my adrenaline left.  Sooner than later, a car came by (not the same one of course).  It was an elderly man.  He said he used to be a cop, so when I told him what had happened, he said he totally believed it, as the skid marks tell the story itself.  He asked if I wanted a ride, or if I thought the bike was still able to be driven.  I checked - it started.  The handle bars were pretty f-ed up, but the throttle still worked.  So I asked him if he'd follow me home.  "Of course I will! Do you want some water, I've got a bottle of water you can have." - "Thanks, but I'm fine.  I just want to go home."  So, I rode like 25 mph all the way home with an ex-cop as my escort, following me.  God bless that man.  

 

Got back into town, down at the city garage on the side of town (which is where I went to work every morning working for the city).  I told him thanks, that I could call someone to come get me.  So, there I called my parents again, finally someone answered... Dad came and picked me up.

 

Because the car was going so fast, I couldn't make out what it was.  I only knew it was a 4 door sedan, and dark red... I'd say the driver got lucky, heh.  Because for one - had he actually stopped after nearly running me over, I'd have probably put him in the hospital and landed myself behind bars.  For two - had I been able to make out more details, and thus had we figured out who it was even though he kept going, my dad would have been in prison because I know darn good and well about my father's temper.  He was raging mad that night.  Scared me, actually.  He wasn't mad at me, though, but I seriously thought that if he found out who the driver was, it'd have been the end of him.

 

So... that's my story.

 

Time passed, and it was time to decide whether or not to fix the bike - if I wanted to get back on.  Well, ironically, my father told me "It's up to you; you don't have to get back on.  I don't think I myself would be able to get back on after something like that."  And, he's been riding for decades.  Yeah... But then, my mother, who doesn't ride a motorcycle, but rather has been a horseback rider ever since she was a little girl says to me "Take your time.  But get back on.  You'll never get over it if you don't face your fears.  I've been bucked off horses countless times, and most of the time I got right back on."  WOW.  Holy crap, my mom is a badass.  Hahaha.

 

So, I did.  My dad fixed my bike, and I got back on.  Rode around town to get used to it again, then I got on the highway again.  I'm thrice as alert and aware now after having that experience behind me.  I'm always checking my surroundings, looking forward, side to side, and in my mirrors to see behind me.

 


 

So, @@SolidTwilight...  Take my story into consideration.  If you decide you still want a motorcycle, I highly recommend you try to find a college or something that offers a Rider's Course for new riders.  It is well worth it.  

 

Also - do NOT get with a group of riders who are cocky.  If you want to ride in a group, make sure you find some people who are safe riders, who follow the laws, and who keep watch of each other.  

 

~ Miles

 

  • Brohoof 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites


Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...