The argument of Unicorns (or more specifically Starlight) should not use magic to solve their problems

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

It's an argument that i have seen quite a few times around this fandom and even till this day, i have never understood why that is even a problem to begin with, since nobody gave a damn about it before season 6 when Starlight showed.

What is the thought process of people, who say that unicorns are not allowed to use magic to solve their problems, considering they live in a magical fantasy world, where magic is an all day accurance in this world? As we have seen in the show since the beginning of the show, Unicorn use Magic not just for everyday things, but they also use for their everyday jobs. It would be horrible to let them not use magic. How is a barbar supposed to work without his scissors? Or a Plumber without his pliers, a Doctor without his Stethoscope, a lumberjack without his saw, you get the point.

People say that Magic can be dangerous. Well, so can be certain jobs that i just listed. There are certain everyday things that people do all the time in this world, that some would consider dangerous, like climbing a high ladder, or working with a saw. Nobody is complaining about though.

Do you think people go a bit over the top about this?

[cmarston1 5,959]

The problem with Starlight using magic to solve problems is that she is/was using powerful magic on ponies without their consent stripping them of their free will after being supposedly reformed.

And she continually did so, such as forcing Big Mac to speak uncontrollably in No Second Prances, even admitting that maybe it wasn't such a good idea to use magic to force other ponies to do what she wants to them to, but apparently learning nothing and by Every Little Thing She Does thought it was a good idea to mind rape the remane 5 and turn them into her slaves.

 

[Lambdadelta 1,462]

41 minutes ago, Mesme Rize said:

since nobody gave a damn about it before season 6 when Starlight showed.

Damn right!

 

42 minutes ago, Mesme Rize said:

who say that unicorns are not allowed to use magic to solve their problems

Tell a unicorn not to use his/her magics is like cutting his/her horns. This is fantasy world, i want some crazy magics. 

[Will Guide 21,362]

@Mesme Rize

Exactly! I know some, like a forums member whose initials are NM, who just can't accept the fact that not every world of fantasy needs the rules of OUR reality! If all other realms of fantasy follow the way our world works, it'd be boring and pointless to want to watch and to get to know the world and its inhabitants.

As for Magic being Dangerous, well, it's like how our world uses fire for warmth,  power fuel, and light; it's a tool that can be dangerous if used irresponsibly, but very beneficial when used correctly. Same thing applies to the Equestria Girls World. The reason Magic always caused trouble is because someone used it for selfish reasons, like Bully Sunset, the Dazzelings, Principal Cinch, and a desperate Gloriosa! But those who used Magic responsibly like the HuMane 6 have always used Magic to undo the damage caused by the villains!

Plus, it was established in the beginning of the spinoff series that while the Equestria Girls world resembles our world, it is still a fantastical world for one simple reason: The "humans" are just as Technicolor as the Equestria Ponies, coming in colors that our world's people don't!

In short, as long as Magic is used responsibly, it shouldn't be prevented from being used!

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

35 minutes ago, cmarston1 said:

The problem with Starlight using magic to solve problems is that she is/was using powerful magic on ponies without their consent stripping them of their free will after being supposedly reformed.

And she continually did so, such as forcing Big Mac to speak uncontrollably in No Second Prances, even admitting that maybe it wasn't such a good idea to use magic to force other ponies to do what she wants to them to, but apparently learning nothing and by Every Little Thing She Does thought it was a good idea to mind rape the remane 5 and turn them into her slaves.

 

Then why do people still consider Lesson Zero one of the best episodes in the shows history, considering Twilight kinda did the same thing in the end?

Not to undermine the opinions of others, but sometimes i think people bring things like these up because of their own agenda and not because they actually mean things like these.

[Will Guide 21,362]

2 minutes ago, Mesme Rize said:

Then why do people still consider Lesson Zero one of the best episodes in the shows history, considering Twilight kinda did the same thing in the end?

Not to undermine the opinions of others, but sometimes i think people bring things like these up because of their own agenda and not because they actually mean things like these.

Firstly, I think it's because of Twilight panicking reactions that make the episode fun to watch! Granted, she did regret her actions when she came to her senses.

But as the trolls from Frozen sang, "people make bad choices when they're mad or scared or stressed, but throw a little love their way, you'll bring out their best!"

[RulesofRarity 493]

5 minutes ago, Mesme Rize said:

Then why do people still consider Lesson Zero one of the best episodes in the shows history, considering Twilight kinda did the same thing in the end?

Not to undermine the opinions of others, but sometimes i think people bring things like these up because of their own agenda and not because they actually mean things like these.

You mean when Twilight was acting erratic? Has she done anything like that towards her friends when she was sane?

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

Just now, WiiGuy2014 said:

Firstly, I think it's because of Twilight panicking reactions that make the episode fun to watch! Granted, she did regret her actions when she came to her senses.

But as the trolls from Frozen sang, "people make bad choices when they're mad or scared or stressed, but throw a little love their way, you'll bring out their best!"

I wasn't really calling twilight out on this and more the fans of that episode but at the same time are not okay with Starlight using her magic.

[Will Guide 21,362]

@Mesme Rize

Here's a thought: We still don't know how long Starlight has been using magic selfishly to run her "Village of Equality". I bet using magic irresponsibly became her biggest flaw because that's all she's been doing since Sunburst left her as foals but before meeting the Mane 6. And you know what they say: "Old habits die hard!" 

Starlight just needs to learn to use her magic responsibly.

Edited June 2, 2017 by WiiGuy2014

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

2 minutes ago, RulesofRarity said:

You mean when Twilight was acting erratic? Has she done anything like that towards her friends when she was sane?

If you implying that Starlight was thinking when she did all of these things, i must disagree. Starlight and Twilight both have significant flaws, in that Twilight overthinks too much and Starlight is not thinking enough.

Twilight thinks too much of the consequences, by just causing more trouble, while Starlight is just trusting her gut, barely thinking about the consequences.

Both of Twilights and Starlights flaws can be positive and negative. Sometimes you have to overthink the situation if you want to achieve your goals, but sometimes you have to act quick to avoid and international accident. (like royal problems)

[Castle Bleck 19,379]

Might as well change the title to just "My Little Pony: Friendship Is," then.

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

1 minute ago, WiiGuy2014 said:

@Mesme Rize

Here's a thought: We still don't know how long Starlight has been using magic selfishly to run her "Village of Equality". I bet using magic irresponsibly became her biggest flaw because that's all she's been doing since Sunburst left her as foals but before meeting the Mane 6. And you know what they say: "Old habits die hard!" 

Starlight just needs to learn to use her magic responsibly.

That's why i think she is an interesting character, because she has this flaw. People need to have a character to cheer for that overcomes it's problems or gets it's goals.

Turning Starlight into a bland none flawed character that has no problems whatsoever is the worst the writers could do to her.

[GrimGrimoire 4,973]

It has nothing to do with not using magic to solve their problems. It is some people just dislike Starlight a lot, and pretty much feel anything she does is bad.

I will easily grant them that she has used her magic the wrong way in several situations... duh, that was the whole point in many cases. But not every situation was as malicious as many try to make it out to be. I am not saying it was right, but it also does not fall under the evil umbrella either. I have seen people say things that simply are not true to appease their hatred... mainly because they can't admit they just don't like her, they have to build up a wall of insurmountable atrocities to justify that hatred. She has done plenty of bad things and used her magic improperly at times... that is the whole point of her growth as a character. If the rest of the mane 6 could do powerful magic, this would all be old hat by now, since the lot of them would have done just as many bad things if not possibly worse.

Also, I really dislike so many of these things being compared to Lesson Zero. Twi cast a spell on a doll in a moment of desperation not realizing how powerful the spell would really be nor how out of control it would become. She had a much simpler plan in mind not nearly as complex as some stuff we have seen from Starlight.

So yeah, it is not about unicorns casting magic, it is about Starlight casting magic. You don't have to look farther than people calling her OP for flying a kite to see that.

[cmarston1 5,959]

13 minutes ago, Mesme Rize said:

Then why do people still consider Lesson Zero one of the best episodes in the shows history, considering Twilight kinda did the same thing in the end?

Not to undermine the opinions of others, but sometimes i think people bring things like these up because of their own agenda and not because they actually mean things like these.

Because Twilight didn't have an established criminal record at the point in time and didn't use her magic in a way like she did in Lesson Zero beforehand.

But Starlight already had the whole stripping ponies of their cutie marks and removing them of their true selves in the season 5 premiere, and her magically forcing Big Mac to speak in Non Second Prances, so when Every Little Thing She Does came around people were less likely to give her the benefit of the doubt at this point.

It's easier to forgive a character for a mistake when it happens only once, but not when it happens again, and again, and again.

Characters making the same mistakes over and over again is realistic, but when it comes to a character using magic on ponies without their consent multiple times, even after being reformed, doesn't make for a sympathetic character.

That's why season 7 and even the season 6 finale did a much better job at making me like Starlight, because they addressed the anxiety part of her character, but not the whole mind rape ponies in order to get what she wants part of her character, that I hope is dead and buried.

[RulesofRarity 493]

8 minutes ago, Mesme Rize said:

 

Twilight thinks too much of the consequences, by just causing more trouble, while Starlight is just trusting her gut, barely thinking about the consequences.

Both of Twilights and Starlights flaws can be positive and negative. Sometimes you have to overthink the situation if you want to achieve your goals, but sometimes you have to act quick to avoid and international accident. (like royal problems)

Your right that sometimes Starlight trusting her gut can work out for the better. Other times though it can come off as pretty awful, mind controlling the Mane 5 when there were easier ways of sorting out that situation just baffled me. Starlight is an intelligent character who knows several spells. She should have never needed to resort to mind control to sort a "friendship problem".

[SugarCoatxMarblePie 701]

19 minutes ago, RulesofRarity said:

Your right that sometimes Starlight trusting her gut can work out for the better. Other times though it can come off as pretty awful, mind controlling the Mane 5 when there were easier ways of sorting out that situation just baffled me. Starlight is an intelligent character who knows several spells. She should have never needed to resort to mind control to sort a "friendship problem".

Her problem was focusing on efficiency. She was impatient, and viewed people as objects (Hasbro you sly devil lol, Buy Our Toys TM) considering how she was use dto manipulating a whole village, and was not specifically told to not manipulate, she saw it through her lense of experience. Like what would she have done in her village if she had the same 'task'. Or I assume that's how it went down, don't see too much of her thoughts, she prolly does think outloud some that episode tho, but then ppl forget to account for her past. She was doing this stuff for yearsssss. Its like, imagine what Chrysalis would do if she suddenly joined the mane 6 but didn't love still and they had to slowly teach her to love. She would be feeding off of ponies habitually, and then berated lol.

Heck Chrysalis would prolly seduce ponies having the misconception that lovin is love lol. Then she would get food for it (and its not against their will), so she would think she is doing good, despite not learning to love them back, and it ends up breaking like literally all of Ponyville's heart then they all get mad at her lol.

Edited June 2, 2017 by CuriUndersXeno

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

Just now, RulesofRarity said:

Your right that sometimes Starlight trusting her gut can work out for the better. Other times though it can come off as pretty awful, mind controlling the Mane 5 when there were easier ways of sorting out that situation just baffled me. Starlight is an intelligent character who knows several spells. She should have never needed to resort to mind control to sort a "friendship problem".

I give you this. I also didn't liked this episode and that Starlights actions weren't morally right. But i think People react a bit too hateful about it, saying that "she never changed." Starlight in Season 6 was still suffering from her past and she paniced quite hardly.

So yeah, i agree she went overboard. But it wasn't because of malicious reasons.

(Besides, i punished her already afterwards behind the scenes :P)

Spoiler

 

[RulesofRarity 493]

17 minutes ago, CuriUndersXeno said:

 

Heck Chrysalis would prolly seduce ponies having the misconception that lovin is love lol. Then she would get food for it (and its not against their will), so she would think she is doing good, despite not learning to love them back, and it ends up breaking like literally all of Ponyville's heart then they all get mad at her lol.

They'd actually punish Chrysalis though. 

[BastementSparkle 20,328]

5 minutes ago, RulesofRarity said:

They'd actually punish Chrysalis though. 

They might not, depends. Lot's of Ponies in this show don't get punished for things. Twilight didn't really get punished for Lesson Zero, Rainbow Dash didn't get punished for Tanks for the Memories, Discord has never really gotten punished for any of the stuff he's done since he was reformed, Trixie wasn't even punished for the events of Magic Duel, etc.

People make such a fuss about Starlight not getting punished, but she's not the only one.

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

25 minutes ago, RulesofRarity said:

They'd actually punish Chrysalis though. 

You think so? Because i wouldn't be surprised if they don't punish her

Equestria is a pretty idealistic world, where everyone believes that everyone has a soft spot deep in down in their heart, that's why i think that chrysalis will be fine too.

[RulesofRarity 493]

3 hours ago, RareBase said:

They might not, depends. Lot's of Ponies in this show don't get punished for things. Twilight didn't really get punished for Lesson Zero, Rainbow Dash didn't get punished for Tanks for the Memories, Discord has never really gotten punished for any of the stuff he's done since he was reformed, Trixie wasn't even punished for the events of Magic Duel, etc.

People make such a fuss about Starlight not getting punished, but she's not the only one.

People get fussed about Starlight because she's never been punished for anything. 

Enslaves all of a town? They just leave her instead of pursuing her. 

Nearly dooms all of Equestria? The Mane 6 make her their friend and the ponies she enslaved forgave her easily. In comparison, Luna was sent to the moon for 1000 years as punishment for being a threat to Equestria and Discord was turned to stone for 1000 years too. I'm not saying that Starlight should be banished for 1000 years but some sort of punishment was warranted. 

None of the people you listed nearly doomed Equestria simply on the basis they were pissed. 

EDIT: I don't think they could "punish" Discord even if they've wanted to since Fluttershy vowed not to use her element power on him. 

3 hours ago, Mesme Rize said:

You think so? Because i wouldn't be surprised if they don't punish her

Equestria is a pretty idealistic world, where everyone believes that everyone has a soft spot deep in down in their heart, that's why i think that chrysalis will be fine too.

I mean Chrysalis did hurt Princess Celestia, kidnap and impersonate Cadence. As well as invade Canterlot. Nvm forgiveness is magic.

Edited June 2, 2017 by RulesofRarity

[Mesme Rize 15,686]

41 minutes ago, RulesofRarity said:

I mean Chrysalis did hurt Princess Celestia, kidnap and impersonate Cadence. As well as invade Canterlot. Nvm forgiveness is magic.

Well, the show is called friendship is magic and being a friend also means that you need to forgive. Friendship seems like the driving force of that universe.

[BastementSparkle 20,328]

52 minutes ago, RulesofRarity said:

Enslaves all of a town? They just leave her instead of pursuing her. 

Nearly dooms all of Equestria? The Mane 6 make her their friend and the ponies she enslaved forgave her easily. In comparison, Luna was sent to the moon for 1000 years as punishment for being a threat to Equestria and Discord was turned to stone for 1000 years too. I'm not saying that   Starlight should be banished for 1000 years but some sort of punishment was warranted. 

For the first one, she ran into the caves, where Party Favor said "They would never find her!".

 Luna was banished for 1000 years out of necessity, as was Discord being turned to stone. Luna immediately tried to take over again upon return and wasn't punished for that. Starlight's "Punishment" was to become Twilight's student and learn about friendship, Twilight likely hoping doing so would teach her how to be a better pony and keep her from returning to her old ways, which it has for the most part, though she's struggled a bit. If she's learning her lesson as-is and making up for her mistakes I don't see the need for anything else.

I agree her apology to the enslaved village was dealt with too fast though. Should have been an episode on it's own.

[Goat-kun 2,528]

To use Starlight as a sole lightning rod for powerful magic in current seasons is to lock it into a certain premise. We are to have magic and heroism with Starlight, or we do not get them at all. I don't think many haters care about FIM's shitty magic. But they do care about seeing their own favorite gals in the best spotlight possible. There. I rest my case. Now all you Starfoals can go back to beating that straw man.

[BlinkZ 1,151]

They can use magic to solve an issue BUT!
Seen in show Season 1: Twilight tried multiple times to solve an issue with magic and it backfired (paraspirtes went from eating food to everything else), Tried to use a come to life spell and it was out of her control, Skip a few seasons to Bats, and same thing..it turned Fluttershy into a odd hybrid. 

So somehow Starlight doing the exact same thing Twilight has done is frowned upon instead of being character growth when it backfires? give me break people.