Is the concept of a human in Equestria cringey?

[AveryGamerDude 4,640]

I've thought about this for years now, and I REALLY wanna make a fanfic like this. (Though it isn't gonna be like most in which a Brony visits Equestria, and this story is also gonna be pretty long, and a LOT darker than the show.) It's not really gonna be a slice of life story like most HiE fanfics, but it's gonna be a "hero's journey" story. Something like that. Something else I should point out is that the Equestria in this fanfiction is different than the Equestria in the show (A small example is that some place that are in the show don't exist here, and there are places that exist here that aren't in the show.) A lot of people I've seen who complained about HiE fanfics is that the human character is a "self insert", and that they don't have much, if any, flaws. (Though I'm not 100% sure what character flaws are.) And I've also, seen some people say that it CAN work, but it would have to be a really talented writer and it would need a LOT of creativity. (Which I'm not sure if I am or have those things.) But I've seen a lot of people say that the concept in and of itself is just dumb. But I dunno, is HiE fanfiction just cringey?

[Hazard Time 1,127]

The reason why HiE fics are looked down upon is because most of them are simply excuses for the author to be self-indulgent.  The main character is often times a self-insert with no flaws (Is there something he's not good at?  Does he have any biases?  Prejudices?  Phobias?  Motivations?), is often times superior both physically and mentally because of his humanity, and, most strikingly, is somehow irresistibly attractive to ponies for whom the feeling is mutual.  The fic serves as a monument to the author's ego, a power fantasy where he is the most important person in the entire land and all the mares are attracted to him, including the evil bug horse who wants to steal him away from his waifu.

Can a good HiE fic be made?  I'm sure it's possible, and I'm sure they exist, but few people take HiE fics seriously.  The genre is stale, overdone, and about as toxic to your reputation as an alicorn OC.  I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole, but if you're really enthusiastic about your idea, there's nothing wrong about trying.

[Misty Shadow 7,844]

"I'm always one for encouraging creativity, so please, go ahead and write a fanfic where Flutterguy becomes a bat pony and then another fanfic where Flutterguy becomes an orange tree if that's what you want to do. Don't let anyone else try to bring you down, just do it!"

A quote from what was literally just my last post. Dude, forget what other people think. Just because a genre of fanfiction is generally looked down upon does not mean you can't write a great story under that genre. If anything, you can use that to motivate yourself to be the one to prove to people that there do exist good Human in Equestria fanfics. So like I've already said before, just do it! 

[BornAgainBrony 2,397]

I must say I'm rather surprised if the "flawless insert" is the norm. Guess I must have had a certain instinct about the "Hero's journey" concept of storytelling before it was ever taught to me. First time I did something like that (it wasn't Equestria, it was long before G4 was a thing), the character was displaced at the darkest of times, and as a result, still had a lot of trauma to work through, while also adapting to the strange new surroundings. Eventually the character was transformed by the unprecedented chain of events, but it took a long time before the light of that better world was able to burn off the darkness put there by the former. That makes for a much more interesting story, IMO. There's a lot of interesting angles that could be taken there. I don't read a lot of fanfic, but I'm going to take a wild guess that it's the, "From Earth to R.D.'s bed within 24 hours" style of writing that a lot of people are sticking their noses up at. If anyone is self-inserting and not giving REAL obstacles their OC has to face, and there's a no real feeling that they could actually fail, then these people do NOT know how to tell stories in the first place.

[Twilight Luna 31,340]

When HiE fanfics started coming out, a lot or most of them were just bad self inserts. They got a bad rap because they followed the same formula where the human either gets turned into a pony because of reasons, is able to use magic, got wings, finds a magic sword,  becomes a hero of Equestria, and believes that humans are evil. Another bad sub genre of this, which has thankfully gone away, is the brony in Equestria. Their life is so horrible that they are excited to live in Equestria to be with their favorite pony. Because the writer is writing about themself, their character is a walking Gary Stu with little or no problems. 

Are there any good HiE stories? Yes there are. Just not very many of them. 

[SharpWit 2,614]

I always imagine this sort of thing going one of two ways. Either you break their reality sort of like in the movie Pleasantville, but more likely not in such a positive way, or you adjust to living in their world and find it not at be what you expected. You eventually make a living for yourself, on occasion your life is in peril, but otherwise it's a dull existence.

And a third one are those who feel like they're in a dream land rather than a world full of sentient beings and end up going to jail because they tried to hug everyone or confessed their love on the spot to their pony waifu.

[BornAgainBrony 2,397]

3 hours ago, Twilight Luna said:

When HiE fanfics started coming out, a lot or most of them were just bad self inserts. They got a bad rap because they followed the same formula where the human either gets turned into a pony because of reasons, is able to use magic, got wings, finds a magic sword,  becomes a hero of Equestria, and believes that humans are evil. Another bad sub genre of this, which has thankfully gone away, is the brony in Equestria. Their life is so horrible that they are excited to live in Equestria to be with their favorite pony. Because the writer is writing about themself, their character is a walking Gary Stu with little or no problems. 

Are there any good HiE stories? Yes there are. Just not very many of them. 

I'd be interested in reading a good one if anyone has a recommendation. I'm kind of curious to see a non-obvious take on the idea. "Humans are evil?" Heh... that's almost definitely something I would've done if I wrote such a thing when I was 20 years younger. Now it wouldn't be all black vs. white, but definitely a, "Been there, done that, my T-shirt never arrived in the mail" approach to life on Earth.

Surprisingly, the first mention I stumbled upon early this year of someone talking about writing a "Bronies in Equestria" fanfic was some seasoned psychologists who had originally heard about the Brony phenomenon, took efforts to study it, and became fans themselves.

2 hours ago, SharpWit said:

I always imagine this sort of thing going one of two ways. Either you break their reality sort of like in the movie Pleasantville, but more likely not in such a positive way, or you adjust to living in their world and find it not at be what you expected. You eventually make a living for yourself, on occasion your life is in peril, but otherwise it's a dull existence.

And a third one are those who feel like they're in a dream land rather than a world full of sentient beings and end up going to jail because they tried to hug everyone or confessed their love on the spot to their pony waifu.

Oh, geeze... that movie. First time I saw it, I absolutely hated it. I was too young to realize the whole thing was a metaphor so I just took the plot at face value and was pretty ticked off by the time I got halfway through it. Seriously? Send society into complete chaos so you can get lucky just one time? Same thing happened in "Stardust" ... sort of.

My Bestie and I did an ultimate crossover Kingdom Hearts-ish thing last year and one point, Tony Stark of all people ended up in Equestria during S1-E2, and within minutes he had figured out the Elements and that the Mane 6 were being put through trials. For the duration of the Nightmare Moon arc, some non-indigenous members of the party realized he was right, but also were constantly trying to get him to shut up so he didn't wreck anything.

All things considered, even knowing it wouldn't be nearly as epic as my fantasies, I'd still opt for Equestria. Unlike certain characters in Pleasantville, I know how to obey the Prime Directive.

Really though, I think what you described, would make for a pretty enjoyable story about expectations vs. reality. Might even work as a comedy. The only hole in the idea though, is if you got displaced specifically to Ponyville, the moment there was a buzz about a new mysterious visitor, Pinkie would be there trying to make friends, and probably steering you away from trouble.

 

Edited October 18, 2018 by BornAgainBrony

[Sepul-Coloratura 762]

It's more about how you tell the story than what you make the story about. If it's good, everybody will be convinced whatever your idea is.

[AveryGamerDude 4,640]

10 minutes ago, Sepul-Coloratura said:

It's more about how you tell the story than what you make the story about. If it's good, everybody will be convinced whatever your idea is.

Yeah I agree with that. And I'm sure most ppl will.

[Steve Piranha 29,419]

On 10/18/2018 at 2:12 AM, Hazard Time said:

The reason why HiE fics are looked down upon is because most of them are simply excuses for the author to be self-indulgent.  The main character is often times a self-insert with no flaws (Is there something he's not good at?  Does he have any biases?  Prejudices?  Phobias?  Motivations?), is often times superior both physically and mentally because of his humanity, and, most strikingly, is somehow irresistibly attractive to ponies for whom the feeling is mutual.  The fic serves as a monument to the author's ego, a power fantasy where he is the most important person in the entire land and all the mares are attracted to him, including the evil bug horse who wants to steal him away from his waifu.

Can a good HiE fic be made?  I'm sure it's possible, and I'm sure they exist, but few people take HiE fics seriously.  The genre is stale, overdone, and about as toxic to your reputation as an alicorn OC.  I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole, but if you're really enthusiastic about your idea, there's nothing wrong about trying.

Not to mention the adopt a human thing 

On 10/18/2018 at 12:16 PM, Sepul-Coloratura said:

It's more about how you tell the story than what you make the story about. If it's good, everybody will be convinced whatever your idea is.

Still, that harms the actual good stories of that setting, as due to the amount of cringe, most will ignore the good ones on sight

[RDDash 19,163]

I don't really mind if it's done right, There is no reason that the humans aren't allowed to be in Equestria. I mean humans are not that morally different from ponies.

Edited October 23, 2018 by R.D.Dash

[Monsoon 1,662]

In my personal opinion I don't think HIE fics are cringy however it can be cringy if the author decides to create a Mary or Gary sue type self insert where the main character gets on with every character and somehow overcomes every problem incredibly fast without any development is somewhat cringy.

A good way to counter this is by making your character feel real like have their likes, dislikes, thoughts and overall attitude influence their choices and who they tend to get on with.

For example if your character has a love for racing and is athletic they could get along with AJ or RD or both while if they hate wimpy people or the classy type then they may not get along with Rarity or Fluttershy.

If your character was a mercenary for example consider their motivation, are they likely to turn evil because the antagonist makes them a tempting offer would they take it?.

An easy thing to do would be to make a character profile detailing anything important about the character you're making.

Also a thing I learned in my writing club is that if you're going to have taboo elements or anything gory or sexual make sure it serves the story in some form or another because if it doesn't then it doesn't serve much or adds as much impact to the story, of course you can add it whenever you want but the more it occurs the less impactful it is on the reader.

For example if a character is constantly getting injured in brutal ways which has happened in some fics I read, it losses any form of impact and just makes it look more comedic then shocking

[ManaMinori 4,145]

I grew up with g1 and watching Megan, Molly, and Danny mingle with the ponies every so often, so no, not really.

[Bendy 1,821]

I don't care. I read human x pony (99% of Human In Equestria stories are these) because it... well...  I find pony x pony boring.

I'm also a fan of Anti TCB stories. Because it gives a good excuse for humans to kill ponies. Or ponies to even turn on their own kind and kill other ponies. Because action is cool in stories.

Edited October 25, 2018 by Bendy

[Twilight Luna 31,340]

On 10/24/2018 at 8:34 PM, Crow2 said:

In my personal opinion I don't think HIE fics are cringy however it can be cringy if the author decides to create a Mary or Gary sue type self insert where the main character gets on with every character and somehow overcomes every problem incredibly fast without any development is somewhat cringy.

A good way to counter this is by making your character feel real like have their likes, dislikes, thoughts and overall attitude influence their choices and who they tend to get on with.

For example if your character has a love for racing and is athletic they could get along with AJ or RD or both while if they hate wimpy people or the classy type then they may not get along with Rarity or Fluttershy.

If your character was a mercenary for example consider their motivation, are they likely to turn evil because the antagonist makes them a tempting offer would they take it?.

An easy thing to do would be to make a character profile detailing anything important about the character you're making.

Also a thing I learned in my writing club is that if you're going to have taboo elements or anything gory or sexual make sure it serves the story in some form or another because if it doesn't then it doesn't serve much or adds as much impact to the story, of course you can add it whenever you want but the more it occurs the less impactful it is on the reader.

For example if a character is constantly getting injured in brutal ways which has happened in some fics I read, it losses any form of impact and just makes it look more comedic then shocking

Good HiE stories are very hard to find because of the Gary Stu/Mary Sue characters that some writers create. Most of them a cheap self-inserts which the writer uses to fulfill his/her own fantasies about being with their favorite pony or having a harem.  The worst offenders were the Brony in Equestria stories where the writer became a pony and/or magical powers and gets everything he/she wants. 

I found one writer who took a serious take on this genre and did a very good story called “You Don’t Belong Here” on fimfiction. 

[AveryGamerDude 4,640]

1 hour ago, Twilight Luna said:

I found one writer who took a serious take on this genre and did a very good story called “You Don’t Belong Here” on fimfiction. 

Thanks for the reference.

[Steel Accord 6,660]

On 10/18/2018 at 1:08 AM, AveryGamerDude said:

(Though it isn't gonna be like most in which a Brony visits Equestria, and this story is also gonna be pretty long, and a LOT darker than the show.)

Well for one thing, I can name at least five other fanfics exactly like that, so being not slice of life isn't itself that much to make it stand out.

On 10/18/2018 at 1:08 AM, AveryGamerDude said:

Something else I should point out is that the Equestria in this fanfiction is different than the Equestria in the show

Also not revolutionary.

On 10/18/2018 at 1:08 AM, AveryGamerDude said:

A lot of people I've seen who complained about HiE fanfics is that the human character is a "self insert", and that they don't have much, if any, flaws.

Also not the case with later versions of the idea as the self-insert Gary Stu backlash got bad.

On 10/18/2018 at 1:08 AM, AveryGamerDude said:

(Though I'm not 100% sure what character flaws are.)

Okay, that's a problem. A character, especially the protagonist, needs a flaw. It doesn't have to be anything huge, it doesn't even have to be a personality flaw. But the character needs something to overcome or deal with otherwise the story doesn't have dramatic weight.

Sample flaws:

Twilight: Paranoia.

Applejack: Stubborness.

Rainbow Dash: Egotism.

Rarity: Vanity.

Pinkie Pie: Thin skin and depression.

Fluttershy: Anxiety.

On 10/18/2018 at 1:08 AM, AveryGamerDude said:

And I've also, seen some people say that it CAN work, but it would have to be a really talented writer and it would need a LOT of creativity. (Which I'm not sure if I am or have those things.) But I've seen a lot of people say that the concept in and of itself is just dumb. But I dunno, is HiE fanfiction just cringey?

It's been said you can make a good movie out of anything, and I think there is truth to that. Execution is everything. The above points I made are simply illustrating that your proposal is not exactly high concept. HiE has been done in every variation you can think of. The thing that makes a HiE fic good or bad is character and story. Both the said human or humans, and the show characters they interact with.

[Twilight Luna 31,340]

36 minutes ago, AveryGamerDude said:

Thanks for the reference.

No problem. Another good one is called “My New Life in Equestria”. It has three parts to it. 

[AveryGamerDude 4,640]

19 minutes ago, Twilight Luna said:

No problem. Another good one is called “My New Life in Equestria”. It has three parts to it. 

Once again, thanks for the references!

[Monsoon 1,662]

1 hour ago, Twilight Luna said:

Good HiE stories are very hard to find because of the Gary Stu/Mary Sue characters that some writers create. Most of them a cheap self-inserts which the writer uses to fulfill his/her own fantasies about being with their favorite pony or having a harem.  The worst offenders were the Brony in Equestria stories where the writer became a pony and/or magical powers and gets everything he/she wants. 

I found one writer who took a serious take on this genre and did a very good story called “You Don’t Belong Here” on fimfiction. 

Sounds like an interesting fic is it on fimfiction?

Edited November 15, 2018 by Crow2

[Twilight Luna 31,340]

9 minutes ago, Crow2 said:

Sounds like an interesting fic is it on fimfiction?

Yea it is.

https://www.fimfiction.net/story/23095/you-do-not-belong

[Denim&Venöm 18,712]

Other than the points mentioned, I think the main issue is that the sub-genre is overplayed. Not just in MLP fan fiction, but everywhere. You see character A get sent to magical world B in so much media. The most high profile example is the teenage action hero archetype. Not so much they go to another world, more like the teen hero gets whisked from their normal life and becomes a hero in a high stakes adventure. 

But another big contributor is Anime and the sub-genre of Isekai. Watch these and you may find some similarities.

 

 

[AveryGamerDude 4,640]

1 hour ago, Denim&Venom said:

Other than the points mentioned, I think the main issue is that the sub-genre is overplayed. Not just in MLP fan fiction, but everywhere. You see character A get sent to magical world B in so much media. The most high profile example is the teenage action hero archetype. Not so much they go to another world, more like the teen hero gets whisked from their normal life and becomes a hero in a high stakes adventure. 

But another big contributor is Anime and the sub-genre of Isekai. Watch these and you may find some similarities.

 

 

There's actually gonna be a slight catch to that that I dont wanna spoil

[Midnight Solace 5,132]

Humans bad. Ponies Good.

[Fhaolan 4,483]

In my opinion, rather than worrying about whether some is 'cringy', worry more about whether you have something to say in your story. What is the story's point? 'I want to do a HiE story' is not the best starting point. 'I want to tell a story about a character who learns 'X' about 'Y'' and it just happens that this is best told with a HiE story, then cool.

Also remember that if you write stories because you are seeking approval from others... this also rarely goes well. You're likely not going to get the approval you want, no matter what you write. Don't write for other people, write for yourself. People will always try to beat you down with disapproval. Hell, this is the Internet, there are people out there who actively seek out things to disapprove of just for the giggles. Prepare yourself. Build up that thick skin now, before the barbs start flying.