Do You Support Twilicorn?

[Zoraxe 546]

first off, consider how, as I've stated before, very (and I mean VERY) little about Twilight's life has actually changed, Twilight has no reason to reject because nothing about the change (if you can even call it that) has actually affected her daily life, the dev team went out of their way to make us aware of that fact. And you're failing to take that into account.

 

The way Twilight's princesshood is actually brought upon her is so paltry that being upset over it is like being upset that someone suddenly gave you a new car and offers to pay all the expenses (like fuel, insurance, tabs, etc) for you.

 

Besides, the reason behind Twilight being made a Princess wasn't meant to be looked upon as some form of enslavement like you're acting like it is, the point behind it was to be Twilight's award and payoff for everything she's learned during the past 3 seasons, are you enslaved when you're given a diploma for doing extremely well at school? No! so Twilight isn't at all enslaved just for getting what is little more than a reward for all she's done.

 

The show didn't look at Twilight's coronation with such a mean-spirited angle, none of the canon characters, nor any of the cast and crew behind the show, nor even the writers and artists of the IDW comics, so I again fail to see why one should be upset over Twilicorn when show and everyone behind it are still working tirelessly in hammering it in our heads that we literally have nothing to fear about it.

 

 

 

Now you are down-playing the princess aspect? Forget that, the issue is that Celestia used her influence with Twilight to turn her into a complete puppet.

[Hypn0ticD 1,213]

Now that Season 4's out and we see that Twilight hasn't changed, I'm okay with it. I want her change to into "full blown Princess" to be gradual -- preferably over the span of several seasons, but it's still early yet!

[Misterian 118]

Now you are down-playing the princess aspect? Forget that, the issue is that Celestia used her influence with Twilight to turn her into a complete puppet.

That's not true, there's no proper evidence neither explicit nor implied in any canon sources to suggest this.

 

Besides, do you really think Twilight would've likely given Celestia a straight answer if she directly asked Twilight about being a princess?

 

Almost everyone in Equestria (especially Twilight) has placed Celestia so high on the pedestal that alot of them seem to think giving her the slightest bit of informality is an offense on her almost as bad as treason.

 

If Celestia straight up asked her about her thoughts about being a princess, at best Twilight might try to dodge the question, or at worst might straight-up lie to Celestia about it just to avoid the slightest possible chance of offending her. And if Celestia tried having somepony else ask her that question, Twilight might not even take it seriously.

 

And now that Twilight already is a princess, giving her the exact same level of power and authority as Celestia, Twilight logically could've easily quit the position if she wanted to (maybe even beforehand pass some laws beforehand to keep anypony from stopping her if she'd have to ), but she hasn't. So either she's fine with everything that's happened, or she's still too new to the position to have formed an opinion on it yet. And the former is more likely, since, as I've said before, very little has actually changed about Twilight's daily life.

 

besides, how can you turn someone into a complete puppet by giving them the exact amount of power and authority you've got? that makes no logically sense, isn't that like saying you have absolute control over a senator when you're one yourself?

 

Another thing you're failing to take into account is that aside from helping Twilight move to Ponyville in the second episode (which she knew Twilight wanted anyway), Celestia never actually did anything to intervene with Twilight's personal life even after the coronation, so there's no point in considering Twilight a puppet when the so-called puppeteer won't, and likely even can't pull the strings.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Misterian

[TailsIsNotAlone 3,695]

Almost everyone in Equestria (especially Twilight) has placed Celestia so high on the pedestal that alot of them seem to think giving her the slightest bit of informality is an offense on her almost as bad as treason.

 

If Celestia straight up asked her about her thoughts about being a princess, at best Twilight might try to dodge the question, or at worst might straight-up lie to Celestia about it just to avoid the slightest possible chance of offending her. And if Celestia tried having somepony else ask her that question, Twilight might not even take it seriously.

 

And now that Twilight already is a princess, giving her the exact same level of power and authority as Celestia, Twilight logically could've easily quit the position if she wanted to (maybe even beforehand pass some laws beforehand to keep anypony from stopping her if she'd have to ), but she hasn't. So either she's fine with everything that's happened, or she's still too new to the position to have formed an opinion on it yet. And the former is more likely, since, as I've said before, very little has actually changed about Twilight's daily life.

You're contradicting yourself here. Twilight wouldn't dream of quitting the position, even though it doesn't fit her and even if she disliked it, for the same reason you say she would lie if asked about it: she's terrified of letting down Princess Celestia. And Celestia has to be blind and deaf not to know that. Twilight doesn't believe she has a choice--that's the troubling thing about this. Regardless of how much power Twilight's actually been given, she will never see herself as being equal to Celestia in any way. And I'm sure Celestia knows that, too. She knows how loyal and easily manipulated Twilight is. What monarch wouldn't take advantage of an asset like that? Twilight will fall over herself to please her and won't go against her wishes, at least not intentionally. In 'Lesson Zero' she practically drove herself crazy trying to come up with a damn status report, to the point where she caused chaos in Ponyville (and the Princess scolded her for it in a stunningly insensitive manner). 

 

Celestia couldn't have picked a better protege. Unfortunately, Twilight could have picked a better mentor. -_-  But she didn't have a choice in that, any more than she could choose whether she was going to become an alicorn that day. And the fact that nothing much has changed in her daily life begs the question of why she was made an alicorn princess in the first place, particularly if she was already an extremely powerful and respected pony who had a working relationship with Celestia, Luna, and Cadence. Beyond the nagging problems with Celestia's character, which are well documented, this was a big problem with MMC: it didn't give us a good reason for why all of this was happening.

[Confetti Nova 58]

Change is good, it keeps a show flowing. I support it because Twilight deserves to be a princess with all the hard work she's been doing in her life.

[Gone Airbourne 21,977]

I mean she is the same lovable twiley we know and love. She just has a pair of wings nothing different about her. So yeah Twilicorn does not bother me one slight bit.

[)O( Scarlet )O( 1,259]

I neither hare nor support Twilicorn.

I mean to me, it was pretty much obvious that she would become a princess/alicorn sometime soon, I can't exactly imagine any other rewards of being Celestia's student...

[Riddle 102]

I don't mind her in truth

just due to they are keeping

the core points of her cannon

and such even with the wings.

 

I did like how some of friends at

first did changed their view point

a bit and make for a good touch

of  drama which i hope does happen

a bit in the coming eps.

[long gone 8,929]

I mean she is the same lovable twiley we know and love. She just has a pair of wings nothing different about her. So yeah Twilicorn does not bother me one slight bit.

Exactly. She's still an adorkable little nerd. This is what I've been telling people would happen for months, that she'd still be an adorkable nerd. And now that S4 is out, it's become clear that her personality (or would that be ponyality?) ain't changing due to her new wings and title.

[EquestrianIdiot 1]

I am vehemently apathetic. I don't think it matters whether or not she is an Alicorn, sure she can fly and increase her magical aptitude but it makes no difference as long as the writers keep up the same degree of character development and conflict. My friends concern was that they would make Twilight way to wiser, like to a degree of the intelligence of the other princesses, but I feel as though that comes with age, not race. I personally feel that it would work because now twilly can screw up even bigger and, hey, maybe even give us a three parter, who knows? But she could also grow awkwardly tall and get way to OP so, yea there is that.

Overall I can say with passion that I don't care  

[Zoraxe 546]

besides, how can you turn someone into a complete puppet by giving them the exact amount of power and authority you've got? that makes no logically sense, isn't that like saying you have absolute control over a senator when you're one yourself?

 

Another thing you're failing to take into account is that aside from helping Twilight move to Ponyville in the second episode (which she knew Twilight wanted anyway), Celestia never actually did anything to intervene with Twilight's personal life even after the coronation, so there's no point in considering Twilight a puppet when the so-called puppeteer won't, and likely even can't pull the strings.

 

The name of the game is 'soft power', and yes, it happens all the time in real life. Celestia has so much soft power over Twilight its undeniable that Twilight is a minion.

 

Just this latest episode, Rarity used her soft power over her friends to get them to do something and Applejack out rite called her 'rotten' over it. Yet Celestia did something far more manipulative and nopony says anything about it.

 

Of coarse, if you just admit that 'Magical Mystery Cure' is a poorly written episode, than its no longer a matter of Celestia being rotten, but merely a matter of Celestia and Twilight being mistreated by the writers. And considering its the 'My little Pony' Universe, I'm inclined to think that its the latter rather than the former. So when fans like you try to defend Celestia's actions in 'MMC', I think that its pretty silly of them.

Edited January 5, 2014 by Zoraxe

[Misterian 118]

The name of the game is 'soft power', and yes, it happens all the time in real life. Celestia has so much soft power over Twilight its undeniable that Twilight is a minion.

 

Just this latest episode, Rarity used her soft power over her friends to get them to do something and Applejack out rite called her 'rotten' over it. Yet Celestia did something far more manipulative and nopony says anything about it.

 

Of coarse, if you just admit that 'Magical Mystery Cure' is a poorly written episode, than its no longer a matter of Celestia being rotten, but merely a matter of Celestia and Twilight being mistreated by the writers. And considering its the 'My little Pony' Universe, I'm inclined to think that its the latter rather than the former. So when fans like you try to defend Celestia's actions in 'MMC', I think that its pretty silly of them.

It can be equally silly to let a single mishap ruin a character for you or give reason to suggest demonizing said character in my humble opinion.

 

I know that's not what you're getting at, but it's telling when you go from accusing Celestia of making Twilight her minion to mildly dismissing it as just a moment of bad writing.

 

Maybe you're right and it was just a moment of bad writing, maybe I'm right in my theory that there may be some in-character justification for why Celestia did what she did.

 

But either way, I don't let that bother me partially because I personally think 'MMC' is still a decent episode regardless of that moment, and partially, because Celestia, in every other episode where she utilized her Trickster Mentor methods, there's been actual reason for her doing so.

 

But what became the main reasons were to the two things I've stated earlier which you never even tried to make a counter argument against or even took into account throughout our entire debate;

 

1) The intended point behind Twilight's coronation into a princess was to be her reward for successfully utilizing everything she's learned about friendship throughout the show, much like how a high school graduate earns a diploma by utilizing everything he or she has learned to make the high school's standards.

 

2) The coronation changes almost NOTHING about Twilight's life in Ponyville, granted some fans here consider that a cop out (or whatever the phrase is) because it begs the question of what need is there for Twilight to be a princess in the first place. But I'm fine with it because it helps keep her from overshadowing her friends too much and I personally make the argument that the Season 4 premiere already explained that by saying Twilight is needed in case Celestia and Luna are out of commission for any reason.

 

I find it astounding that for all your calling out Celestia for her suddenly dropping the whole princess thing on Twilight, you didn't take the results into account even once.

Edited January 5, 2014 by Misterian

[Static Electricity 729]

Okay, I realize I might get a lot flames for this...

 

Here's, basically, why I am dissatisfied with the Twilicorn:

 

The writers took a huge risk and made a huge change toTwilight, supposedly to allow for more character development.

 

How's that working out again?

 

Pretty much NOTHING has changed! Aside from the season premiere, Twilgiht has not changed as a character, everything she has done could've been done by Unicorn Twilight.

 

Here's an example of what I mean:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r134EZXI6c&feature=youtu.be&t=5m07s

Edited January 21, 2014 by Static Electricity

[SomariFeyWright 776]

I respect your opinion fully, and I even agree. For bringing out Twilicorn as they did, they sure aren't doing much to take advantage of it. This probably has to do with the fact that Twilicorn was meant to be a series finale event, rather than a simple season finale.

 

To say that they have done nothing with it, though, I'd be inclined to disagree. Princess Twilight Sparkle was mostly about showing how the Twilight we know and love would be able to cope with the responsibilities of a princess. From her usual panicking and OCD-esque nature to finally having to put her hooves on the ground and take responsibility in the Princess' absences, it built up to that while Twilight wasn't comfortable in her new position, she was able to handle it, even if she needed some time to adjust.

 

... The LATER episodes, I can't defend on these grounds, though...

[FNGRpony 658]

Well, actually they didn't make a big risk because nothing happened.  Its like they pulled the pin out of a hand grenade, and ever so gently pushed it back in.

there was no boom, there was no impact.

 

And i'm kinda expecting the same thing with the rainbow powers.

 

Okay bear with me.  The main six get new magical powers.

Why?  In the real world you only ever do something like that after the worst thing has happened.  There's no reason for the main six at this point to get rainbow powers.

Kinda like there was no reason for twilight to become alicorn.-

[FNGRpony 658]

I respect your opinion fully, and I even agree. For bringing out Twilicorn as they did, they sure aren't doing much to take advantage of it. This probably has to do with the fact that Twilicorn was meant to be a series finale event, rather than a simple season finale.

 

To say that they have done nothing with it, though, I'd be inclined to disagree. Princess Twilight Sparkle was mostly about showing how the Twilight we know and love would be able to cope with the responsibilities of a princess. From her usual panicking and OCD-esque nature to finally having to put her hooves on the ground and take responsibility in the Princess' absences, it built up to that while Twilight wasn't comfortable in her new position, she was able to handle it, even if she needed some time to adjust.

 

... The LATER episodes, I can't defend on these grounds, though...

 

Okay, besides a few flying jokes,

 

how has twilight's problems been any different now that she's a princess?

Those guards in the season premiere might still have turned to twilight for advice,

Being that she was celestial student.

[Princess Periwinkle 3,775]

@@Static Electricity,

 

Just a heads up, I've merged your thread with a much larger one for opinions on Twilicorn. In the future, please refer to the search function before creating new threads. Thanks~

[packmule1123 55]

So far I have nothing against Twilicorn. I don't really see anything wrong with it.

[Scootalove 10,689]

I respect your opinion as well, I'd have to agree and disagree with you.

 

The writers when they first introduced Twilicorn, didn't take full advantage of something that they introduced to see if Twilight could handle the responsibilities of being an alicorn.

 

I'd have to say that Twilight has some parts handled when it comes to being a princess, while she has other parts of her responsibilities to adjust to once we see what her responsibilities are as a princess. If you ask me, it is hard for me to tell whether the writers know what they are doing or not.

[Static Electricity 729]

Okay, besides a few flying jokes,

 

how has twilight's problems been any different now that she's a princess?

Those guards in the season premiere might still have turned to twilight for advice,

Being that she was celestial student.

THAT'S EXACTLY THE PROBLEM!

 

If you're gonna make a gigantic change to a character, MAKE IT WORTHWHILE.

 

Why the hell did they bother changing Twilight, if the only time being a princess has affected her was in the season premiere?

If you ask me, it is hard for me to tell whether the writers know what they are doing or not.

I don't think they do. If they did, we wouldn't have this thing:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r134EZXI6c&feature=youtu.be&t=5m07s

[Scootalove 10,689]

I don't think they do. If they did, we wouldn't have this thing:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r134EZXI6c&feature=youtu.be&t=5m07s

Well if you think so, I won't try to change your opinion.

[FNGRpony 658]

THAT'S EXACTLY THE PROBLEM!

 

If you're gonna make a gigantic change to a character, MAKE IT WORTHWHILE.

 

Why the hell did they bother changing Twilight, if the only time being a princess has affected her was in the season premiere?

I don't think they do. If they did, we wouldn't have this thing:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r134EZXI6c&feature=youtu.be&t=5m07s

 

Look, early on 3 episodes in your looking at the guy who said "she's not very princessie is she?"

To which people said "give it time."

 

Now i  feel twilight is best pony,

I think she's  great student,

a great mage,

a great friend,

 

that all being said I'm not convinced it's with in her character to be a great princess.  I'm from the show me state ^^.

 

a adventurer?

a knight?

Hell, even a champion.

 

think about it this way.  hasbro got their alicorn toy,

we have our twilight.

 

Put a check in the win column ^^

[Misterian 118]

THAT'S EXACTLY THE PROBLEM!

 

If you're gonna make a gigantic change to a character, MAKE IT WORTHWHILE.

 

Why the hell did they bother changing Twilight, if the only time being a princess has affected her was in the season premiere?

The way I see it, they're already making it worthwhile.

 

First of all, based on what I saw in 'Magical Mystery Cure', Twilight's princess status was meant to be the payoff and her reward for everything she's learned about friendship since the first two episodes, Similar to how you get a degree when you finish college.

 

Second of all, the Season 4 premiere already showed Twilight taking charge when Celestia and Luna went missing, making it clear that part of the point behind giving Twilight her princesshood was to take charge whenever the two other princesses are out of commission for any reason (which makes sense, considering it does happen quite often in some way or another).

 

Finally, the writers already stated long before Season 4 came out that part of the point behind making Twilight a princess is to present to her new challenges, something we've already seen, to an extent, in the aforementioned Season 4 premiere and something that we'll likely see in future episodes.

[Deesinn 393]

I don't like it, but I like it at the same time.  My views on Alicorns in general, to me, where ruined by Cadance, I thought they were somewhat mystical, rare beings that lived for thousands of years, so I came to acceptance after all that jazz.  Still, it's really weird seeing Twilight with wings.   

 

EDIT

 

It also raises all of these questions, like how does one become an alicorn?  Can other alicors turn other ponies into alicorns?  Is it a spell?  Can any alicorn learn the spell and use it?  Could Twilight be all like, "Rainbow Dash, you need some flair girl" *zap* When you're an alicorn, are you immortal? 

 

What a cluster fuck they caused!

Edited January 22, 2014 by Deesinn

[Barbaloot 198]

I support whatever is done right. I don't care if they suddenly decide "This show is now about cobras", if they do it great, I'm totally on board.

 

And really so far we still don't have much of an indication as to what Twilicorn is going to end up like. But I do suppose that is a little bit of an issue; they introduce this supposedly big important change, then do nothing with it. What's the point of that? Why not either get something new to happen or not have it at all?

 

Whatever, since they still haven't really DONE anything with it yet, I still can't really decide if it's good or not.