Alicorn OC's..are they really that bad?

[Stone Cold Applejack 381]

Not all overpowered characters are bad as it's a matter of the writer's skill in crafting a character. I'd rather have an oped but awesome Alicorn Oc that is filled with awesome background and character instead of a weak powered but terrible Earth pony oc that will make me cringe for how poorly written mary sueish he is. Also, mary sue \= overpowered as well as Bella from twilight is a perfect example of what I mean.

I totally agree with every single thing you said. I honestly don't really care if you're OC is an alicorn as long as you are good at making it. So yeah I agree with you.

[THE WILD HUNT 213]

I've noticed the "No Alicorns" rule a lot too and I've always figured it's just because GMs (along with other participants) just assume it will automatically be overpowered, poorly written, and Mary Sue-ish. I can see where they're coming from in some cases since there are indeed a lot of crappy Alicorn OCs with horrendous stories and abilities, and then there's also the issue of being tempted to power play with them or making them more important than others and even the story itself.

 

Still, those are more "maybe" ideas instead of a "this is what will happen with Alicorns" fact. I have an Alicorn OC myself, but I only really made him that way because I thought that the species' design was pretty cool. He's powerful but still has some notable weaknesses and character flaws to hinder him. I also think, and have been told by other people, that he's well written out despite being an Alicorn, so I really think that people should actually take the time to review Alicorns for RPs instead of just immediately writing them off.

 

Extremely powerful characters can still be good, unique, and vulnerable.

[Windseeker 546]

I would also like to point out. magic itself is technically OP, so wouldn't that mean Unicorns are OP too.

Earth ponies can be too, Maud Pie threw a boulder for miles and completely busted a pile of them with her bare hooves.

[XxConfusedUnicornxX 832]

No. No. HUUUUUUUGE no.

 

I understand that a lot of people get upset when rps don't allow alicorns. But they NEED to use their brains! There were only 2 alicorns before Cadence and Twilight. And alicorns are earth ponies, pegasi, and unicorn making them powerful and able to do anything. Alicorns who aren't royal won't be able to control their powers and won't use their magic for royal stuff. "But they can learn to control it!" Yeah, but think about it, if a non-royal alicorn goes out of control with her magic she can cause huge damage.

 

 

 

Also, to all those that think only royals can be Alicorns, I don't recall anywhere that it is specifically stated in words that only Royals can be alicorns. In my opinion there are many ways an Alicorn can be made. Example 1: Pegasus exposed to large amounts of magic. Example 2: A crossbreed between a pegasus and a unicorn (Basically what an Alicorn is) Example 3: Earth pony or pegasus being given magical powers by a unicorn.

 

You're serious right? A pegasus exposed to large amounts of magic. Really? If thats true then why doesn't Rainbow Dash and Fluttershy grow a horn? They're always with Twilight and she used large amounts of magic sometimes. And a crossbreed? Sure, but in the MLP:FiM world I don't think so! Pegasi and unicorns are different species so when they mate they probably won't have a child. But I can't say that what I just said is true because Mr and Ms Cake had a unicorn baby when they are both earth ponies. So there might be a possibility. But I think Celestia used a spell to prevent that from happening. Now your third example.... Giving magic to Earth ponies and pegasi (i dont know if its possible for them to cast spells) wont turn them into alicorns. They're just earth ponies and pegasi with magic. Make sense?

 

I'm not being mean okay? I'm sorry if it came out like that but I'm just annoyed with users complaining about alicorns not allowed. Seriously they are EVERYWHERE! Just use your brain and logic and you will understand.

[Windseeker 546]

You're serious right? A pegasus exposed to large amounts of magic. Really? If thats true then why doesn't Rainbow Dash and Fluttershy grow a horn? They're always with Twilight and she used large amounts of magic sometimes. And a crossbreed? Sure, but in the MLP:FiM world I don't think so! Pegasi and unicorns are different species so when they mate they probably won't have a child.

I'm not trying to sound rude but your head canon that pegasi and unicorns are different species and unable to crossbreed doesn't make it any more right than his.

[XxConfusedUnicornxX 832]

I'm not trying to sound rude but your head canon that pegasi and unicorns are different species and unable to crossbreed doesn't make it any more right than his.

Well its true. Pegasi have wings and Unicorns have horns. Different species from the same family.

[The Mane-iac 1,632]

First off, I'm typing this out on a tablet so forgive any errors. It's 1am and the coolest room in the house right now is not my bedroom, so no PC access.

 

Secondly, I don't want this to come across that I'm bashing on the OP's OC, but it is going to seem that way because of the points I'm going to make. Sorry in advance, no offense meant, feel free to logically counter my points.

 

I'm against alicorn OC's because no matter what excuse you want to toss out, only royalty has been shown as them. We saw how Twilight became one, and it took a very specific thing to be done, and then she still had to be granted alicorn status from the current almighty alicorn princess.

 

Having an alicorn and then claiming something to specifically make them not op usually only makes them worse. They have traits to make them seem like they aren't op by having things like magic they don't know how to use (or their horn is permanently broken so they can't cast), can't use their wings for reasons unknown, and plenty of other excuses.

 

I'm not only against alicorns though. If I ran an rp, each character would get looked at and I can tell you there are plenty of OC's that would not get into my groups because of reasons that just go against lore too much.

 

My lore ocd also makes me cringe when it comes to colors used or designs that look like Discord tossed the pony together in his sleep. I'm also very much against the gun happy, assassin type, emo, loner who is secretly a vampire bat pony that lives beyond the Everfree Forest (to give a mashed up example) because of how out of place that would seem in the show.

 

Now I'm not saying alicorn or the others that bother me should be banded from all RPs, but the creators of the RP needs to state how lore focused the RP is. That should be what determines if alicorns and assassins would be allowed or not. If the RP takes place in the true to the show world, then it makes sense to screen the OCs and ban alicorns flat out. If its Equestria but Skynet is taking over, then set the gun happy ponies and alicorns free to smoosh the machines.

 

Forgot to mention that lore friendly unicorn magic is not op. Their magic is normally the universal stuff like telekinesis, and then only stuff that applies to their special talent. Twilight being the exception since her talent is magic, but even then it wasn't op because she had to try hard and learn to cast things. She was shown struggling instead of going "poof the Ursa minor vanishes" and she even admitted to not being able to do certain spells no matter how hard she tried.

 

ALSO, casting a spell to add wings (temporarily or permanent) does not make a unicorn an alicorn. The show makes it pretty clear that alicorns have their own special magic, they are in a class of their own when it comes to magic. You could chop the wings off an alicorn and they'd still be vastly more powerful than even the highest level unicorn. I doubt unicorn Twilight would ever be able to move a celestial body no matter how much she trained.

Edited August 4, 2014 by The Mane-iac

[Windseeker 546]

Well its true. Pegasi have wings and Unicorns have horns. Different species from the same family.

Indeed they are different races, not so much different species though.

[Comet Tail 808]

Okay, so distance yourself from the situation and try to see this objectively.

 

When in an RP, you're doing events that could conceivably happen in the show. The purpose of a pony RP is to be in Equestria's universe. There is a species that had, at the start and as Faust intended, only two of this super-race that represents all races, and they were close, if not, actual dieties: immortal (?) princesses that rule over the land and literally control the sun and moon.

 

In contrast, there are many gods and demigods in Greek and Roman mythology. Yet, if you were telling a story that tries to fit in the background of ancient Greece or Rome, then, well, having a god or demigood simply wouldn't work because gods and demigods are such a big deal. It doesn't matter if they know/control their power or not, what they are makes them incredibly rare and unique, and of central importance.

 

Now, back to Equestria, Faust only intended two alicorns. We had an extra; a princess of a lost kingdom, and Twilight, who is basically ascended. Every alicorn is of prime and central importance. There is no precedent for one who isn't.

 

I don't know how to articulate this any better or further, but simply put, the canon that's established by MLP says rather clearly, that alicorns are a big deal.

 

It's not quite right to jump into an RP and declare to everyone that you're a big deal, which is what being an alicorn is. It really is just about the same as declaring yourself a king, queen, prince or princess.

 

To say there's an alicorn who isn't a big deal, is kind of breaking canon, and the entire point of doing a pony RP is to be in Equestria's universe, and to abide by its canon.

 

I mean, probably the best way to understand the implications of "alicorn," is to imagine that "alicorn" means your character glows. Alicorns possess a level of magic far above anything else. So they're OP.

 

And if you explicitly make them not OP, then why are they an alicorn? That's like giving your character a glow, angel wings, and a halo, then saying; "They're not an angel!" That only makes it worse because now the glow, wings, and halo, just don't make sense.

 

 

 

Also, pony genetics; crossing pegasi and unicorns produces unicorns and pegasi, not alicorns. Think of eye color. You have parents with blue, green, whatever eye colors, you only get one, not both.

 

 

 

Now, I can think of an exception. Say, your story is set way in the past with a historic figure from obscure history, or in a distant, unknown corner of the world. Or perhaps way in the future. Then you could have an alicorn OC work, because they can be properly respected as a big deal without conflicting canon. Saaaay, an ancient princess in obscure history, or the guardian of the far north:

 

 

 

These work. Alicorns are tall, regal, super magical figures. Canon establishes them as such. To have the horn and wings, but not have the crown, is like having angel wings, a glow, and a halo, but not being an angel. It's just very distracting and pointless, unless it actually has the purpose of saying; "Hey, I'm an angel!"

 

And something else: These alicorns work because they're princesses, and they're a big deal, but because they're a big deal, we expect the story to revolve around them and their mystical, or ancient kingdoms. If you're a random player joining an RP, it's unfair to jump in and imply that the story should revolve around your character, but when you use a supernatural being like an alicorn for your OC, that's precisely what you're implying while also saying your character is a big deal of central importance, moreso than any other pony.

 

That being said, it might be fun to see an alicorn in one of these settings done tastefully and well, getting the proper attention they deserve as such...

 

 

 

But, yeah, that's basically it. Alicorns really aren't "just another kind of pony." They're demigod-esque super-pony royalties. That's what canon makes them out to be. Now I'm just repeating myself, but review is good to help make the point clear: giving your character a horn and wings, is just like giving your character a glow and a halo. If you look like an angel, you should be one. If you look like an angel, though, and aren't one, then it's just distracting, confusing, and conflicting with canon which destroys the experience of being "in" the universe, because such things aren't in the mlp universe.

 

That's also why we frown on zebra stripes, slit eyes, and glaring and/or unusual colorations and physical features. Those things aren't in the show, but we're trying to be in the show, so when you pull them into the RP, you're pulling us out of Equestria and into your setting, where such things do exist, and aren't unusual.

 

And if they are unusual, then that's unfairly trying to make your own character the central star of the show, when you're supposed to share the spotlight with everypony else.

 

Actually, I think that last paragraph also hits on this the most, about.

 

 

 

[Addendum: I mentioned OP earlier, and I want to note that that's not necessarily a bad thing, but when you're sharing the spotlight with everypony else, it is, because it's stealing the spotlight from others. I was about to write a lot more on this, but I just made it too confusing >.< . For our purposes here, talking about RP's, OP is a bad thing unless some rather specific circumstances are met.]

 

 

EDIT: Okay, to sum all this up, I think after typing and thinking about this I'm starting to really get the key issue here...

 

In an RP, you're in Equestria's universe, blending in as Equestrians. We go to RP and be in Equestria, because we want to be in Equestria. We don't want to be in Assassin's Creed, or some dark monster-killing game, we want to enjoy a happy an peaceful land with ponies living daily lives.

 

To give us the sense that we're in Equestria, you need to be able to blend in with the crowd and be pretty normal. "Pretty normal" means no assassins, no creepy glaring red eyes, no wild colorations or physical features, no alicorns, nothing of that sort. The DM didn't start the session to make it revolve around some edgy OC someone brings in, they started the session with the assumption that everypony will be normal ponies that can blend in a crowd, because most RP's are just normal Equestrians living Equestrian life, and most importantly, you're sharing the spotlight with every other player.

 

Giving a character a lot, or even any, unusual traits that make them stand out in a crowd, pulls an unfair amount of spotlight to them. I mean, all the ponies in ponyville were terrified of a Zebra, for ponies' sake. How is it for sharing the spotlight, when your character makes everypony run inside in a terrified panic, or even just scare them, and everyone else in the RP can blend in with the crowd?

Edited August 4, 2014 by Comet Tail

[Sunny Fox 5,935]

My opinion is this. If you want an OC that can do magic, make a unicorn. If you want an OC that can fly, make a pegasus. You want an OC that can both fly and do magic? That's being kind of greedy.

 

And including an enormous flaw does not automatically balance out an OP character. Superman is OP, and his weakness to kryptonite doesn't really balance that out. Of course, a good comic book writer can find ways around Superman's OPness, and still come up with an engaging story.

 

@@Comet Tail, that is a very detailed and logical argument against alicorn OCs. I applaud you! 

[The Mane-iac 1,632]

-snip-

First, that was a pain snipping on a tablet. Lol

 

Mostly though, if I could brohoof a second time after you added to it I would. You better covered everything I tried to touch on but was limited by being on this stupid tablet. I think you pretty much covered everything about how to correctly fit into a pony based RP.

[ManaMinori 4,144]

I think OP is entirely subjective, when it comes to alicorns. Let's take their magic as an example. In shoe canon, it seems that though both are alicorns, Celestia and Cadance excel primarily in defensive magic. Celestia was overcome in a magic battle when trying to defeat Crysalys, and Cadance was seen holding up her shield barrier with magic for days. Celestia's an alicorn, yes, but when it comes to attack type spells, it would seems like she's not OP in that field. She needed the assistance of the EoH to banish her sister; whereas without them, she got her flank kicked by Luna- as seen in Twilight's flashback. Luna on the other hoof, seems to be OP in offensive magic and not defensive, which doesn't necessarily make her entirely Alicorn OP god mode. So even alicorns aren't Op as everyone's making them out to be. Their power can be lacking in specific areas.

[Pripyat Pony 2,608]

I will say that I have started RPs and I have tried allowing alicorn OCs. However, that is immediately a green light to every single roleplayer in all of Equestria to sign up with their overpowered, unrealistic, vomit inducing Mary Sue/Gary Stu. It's very irritating as a GM to have to sift thru all the crap to find the one decent alicorn OC, and equally annoying to try and drum it into people's heads that their bicorned Princess Serentity character, daughter of Princess Luna and able to do everything!1!!!eleventy is overpowered and I don't want her in the RP. It's far less stressful to avoid all that fuss and just disallow alicorns in the first place.

 

And before you leap at my throat, OP, I have two alicorn OCs. One is in my fanfic and stays there; the other is mostly RPed as a unicorn unless the RP asks for it. I have worked hard on making my OCs well rounded characters, with faults and flaws, but not everypony does. There is far too much of a temptation for some people to make an alicorn OC and have them perfect and overpowered.

[Professor Annabella 330]

Because alicorns are unoriginal.

[The Mane-iac 1,632]

I think OP is entirely subjective, when it comes to alicorns. Let's take their magic as an example. In shoe canon, it seems that though both are alicorns, Celestia and Cadance excel primarily in defensive magic. Celestia was overcome in a magic battle when trying to defeat Crysalys, and Cadance was seen holding up her shield barrier with magic for days. Celestia's an alicorn, yes, but when it comes to attack type spells, it would seems like she's not OP in that field. She needed the assistance of the EoH to banish her sister; whereas without them, she got her flank kicked by Luna- as seen in Twilight's flashback. Luna on the other hoof, seems to be OP in offensive magic and not defensive, which doesn't necessarily make her entirely Alicorn OP god mode. So even alicorns aren't Op as everyone's making them out to be. Their power can be lacking in specific areas.

I can counter those points with the fact that Chrysalis herself was surprised she beat Celestia, stating that Shining Armor's love for Cadance was stronger than she expected.

 

When Celestia needed the EoH to banish NMM (not Luna) because she was getting defeated, that was due in part to Celestia not wanting to attack her sister even if she currently wasn't herself. She used the EoH as a last ditch effort. I'd wager 'ol Sunbutt would have surrendered before actually trying to cause harm to Luna. NMM was also clearly powered up beyond Luna's normal power level, if not clear to see in the flashback, it should have been because of the fact she made Celestia vanish when she should have been at the celebration.

[NiceVillains 244]

They probably view it as a type of god-modding I suppose.

Um what constitutes a good alicorn OC anyways?

Edited August 4, 2014 by MostBrainWhyYes

[Lightning Bliss 1,674]

I just think the main reason is that they 'stand out' too much in an RP.

 

I've read up on many RPs I was looking into and the host would say - No Alicorns (It's not that I don't like them, it's because they stand out too much and tend to contradict the roles of this RP).

 

I can understand that. Even my alicorn OC, though she's not OP, has to what others would say 'a decent' backstory, etc etc, she still stands out as a Princess according to canon. (Since I do alot of canon RPs, ya she does unfortunetly stand out).

[The Shadow Stallion 127]

Well at least I am getting some reasons. Most people just outright reject without bringing up any logical points. I thank those of you on both sides of the debate for your input.

 

I do disagree with taking an OP race and making it less OP as being confusing. I will bring up the game Fable as an example which is all about good and evil, and the three main styles of combat. At the beginning, your character usually starts out as a runt that has a hard time killing even a beetle. Even when you get more powerful you generally go under one category out of the 3 fighting styles. You may have skills at the others, but you generally have a primary focus in 1 of the three. I could say the same for Alicorns.  I doubt Celestia and Luna really started out being all powerful and godly, they had centuries to practice their magic and many different events have happened in their pasts. Its not really that confusing to think an OP race can start off less OP.

 

I do admit it is rather show-offy to have an alicorn in a RP. And I will admit the stand outish factor of having an alicorn can be a threat to a RP

 

I disagree that having flight and magic is OP though. Technically by having magic, as I've stated before you can teleport places which really takes away the need for wings. The wings are more a symbol if anything. Besides everypony just trots everywhere anyway lol.

 

My position has been changed a bit on the matter. I still favor Alicorn OCs at least being given a chance though. The main reason I feel this way, as I will relay again, is the sight of poorly made OCs being accepted. Im not master OC crafter, but I put time and effort into every one of my creations. I sometimes plot personalities and stories for days (Often running into blocks which I can't think of anything for a while), but I put a lot of time into my characters. I write paragraphs of story for my characters going into detail of their lives and give people the feel of my character.

 

Then I see others who barely write 7 sentences with their personality and history combined. They get accepted, but I don't just because I have an alicorn. It is very infuriating to go through such an ordeal. Now I never expect any character of mine to be accepted on the first lookover, I'd take it as an insult if they were. But no one tells me good reasons why they were rejected, or how to change the character to where it could be acceptable. I have had great GMs that have worked with me on many many characters to change and improve them.

 

I really thank you all who have provided some great opposing points. No sarcasm, I really mean it : )

 

I still wish I could RP my Alicorn OC though. Le sigh, It must not be meant to be. I think I said that right. I think Im going to stay out of this debate for a while and see if anyone else makes even more points either For Alicorn OCs or Opposed Alicorn OCs.

[Hive King 1,998]

Alicorns are, by nature, ponies of incredible importance who have excelled in a certain field. In the novels, Cadence became an alicorn from a pegasus after coming into contact with an artifact that amplified her love and taking down a villain who stole love from ponies. Twilight became one after helping out her friends. 

 

Alicorns as per canon are not born, they are made. Also, the fact that Celestia points out "Alicorn Magic" as a specific type of magic that Tirek could steal means that alicorns are just naturally more powerful. 

 

In the end, you can't make an alicorn OC without having part of their backstory be a huge accomplishment. However, with the advent of Tirek and Celestia's claim that there are no other alicorns, you can't do that either. 

[Troblems 5,609]

I still wish I could RP my Alicorn OC though.

 

 

Hmm. Okay so, I believe this is partially aimed at me. If not, you can tell me to get my head out of my ass. However, there does seem to be a bit of confusion if I'm not mistaken.

 

So on mlpforums there are two RP sections. One, Equestrian Empire (EQE), tries to stay within the confines of what has been or potentially be seen in My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic. The other, what is colloquially named the "normal" RP section has no such limits. They each have their own database. The screenie below shows where both databases can be found.

 

You can see here that there are two separate databases. The top one is the normal RP section, the bottom is EQE. Your character was placed in the EQE database. Your character wasn't rejected on the grounds of being bad, overpowered, etc., it was rejected because there are currently four canon Alicorns, and that's what EQE goes by.

 

What this does not mean is that your character cannot be played. All it means is that your character doesn't fit within canon, and would not be eligible for EQE. However, you can absolutely use it in the normal RP section.

 

Getting back to the topic at hand, there are a lot of bad Alicorn OCs. There's also a lot of bad pegasi, earth pony and unicorn OCs as well. The difference is, as has been pointed out, Alicorns inherently stick out more. The choice is up to the creator of the RP if they want to accept Alicorns or not, because when it comes down to it (borrowing from my past MMO life), the DM is creating the instance you are playing in. If they decide not to have Alicorn OCs in their RP, it's not something you should take personally. However, if you really want to argue your case for using an Alicorn in a specific RP, you can (respectfully) take it to PMs and give your reasons why they won't allow it. If they still say no, then move on. One thing that is fantastic about roleplayers here on the forums is that they tend to be (overall) a rational and mostly drama-free bunch. If you present a level-headed case, you will probably get in most of the time.

 

And now I'm going back to bed. This is why I should never check the forums on my cell phone at night.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Troblems
Bad spelling!

[Dashietheterrific 0]

Most alicorn OC's are not original because most of the time they are related to the mane 6 or royalty they need to be SPECIAL they need their own special characteristics and a personal design NOT a picture of a princess pony coloured over

[Moonbacon 384]

I do have an alicorn oc http://mlpforums.com/page/roleplay-characters/_/moonlight-starshine-r5175

 

Feel free to critiq but keep in mind she's a WIP.

 

 

Yes i use her for rp's she's  bascially a bat pony with a horn she doesn't have any special abilities yet and she isn't overpowered at all.

And i barely use her now.

 

However she is a mary sue in a roleplay http://mlpforums.com/topic/106416-a-city-of-nightmare-action-adventure-horror-inquisition/

 

The villains have to be powerful it's part of the rp plot i can list the abilities she has in the rp if you guys want to know.

[Lightning Bliss 1,674]

@@Moonbacon,

 

(WIP)

 

That's good to know because there's alot there that needs to be explained in your OC lol.

 

I also will say if you want to join cannon RPs with her...well good luck, because she's not exactly fitting the criteria. In the show, so far, all alicorns are considered royals, so whether you like it or not she's supposed to be royal if you're going for canon. That means NO mutations, and NO I was born that way stuff. She needs to have a reason for 'ascending' into an alicorn.

 

Coolies to her design and having batwings but she needs more reason for why she's an alicorn.

[Moonbacon 384]

@@Moonbacon,

 

(WIP)

 

That's good to know because there's alot there that needs to be explained in your OC lol.

 

I also will say if you want to join cannon RPs with her...well good luck, because she's not exactly fitting the criteria. In the show, so far, all alicorns are considered royals, so whether you like it or not she's supposed to be royal if you're going for canon. That means NO mutations, and NO I was born that way stuff. She needs to have a reason for 'ascending' into an alicorn.

 

Coolies to her design and having batwings but she needs more reason for why she's an alicorn.

 

 

I never join cannon rps and i don't plan making her backstory fit in the cannon mlp universe. Unless i suddenly gained the mental capacity to make a roleplay for Moonlight's backstory like what you did with your oc Lighting Bliss.

[Dashietheterrific 0]

I am making an alicorn OC(btw I didn't mean to offend anyone in the last thing I said) just for fun I already got it planned out:3 also I know someone with a personal OC so some alicorn OC's aren't really that bad well except for some of the coloured over pictures of princess Celestia and Luna