S07:E20 - A Health of Information

[Dark Qiviut 22,379]

Watching it in English. Finished Act 1.

The delivery of the jokes feels a lot more organic here than with the Russian dub. I don't know why, but I think it's because of how flat the dub was at times.

That said, two jokes here don't work.

1. The drum roll representing Zecora's heartbeat. The doctor said that was bad, but the drum roll doesn't show us it's bad. Maybe something downplayed, like a quicke or irregular heartbeat.
2. "I'll leave you two to discuss!" This joke's as badly delivered here as the Russian dub. Swamp fever is considered incurable, and the doctor's line treats it as a stupid joke. Worst joke (and from delivery, line, too) of the episode so far.

The exposition in this act is also rather heavy, particularly in the castle. It downplays the effort Fluttershy's putting to trying to find not only a possible cure for Zecora, but also who that legendary healer was. A determined look by her as TS went to sleep isn't enough to show that. Some kind of visual storytelling to show us her dedication and realization into the morning will help.

Edited September 23, 2017 by Dark Qiviut

[Jeric 46,850]

40 minutes ago, Stardust Balance said:

Okay, if Fluttershy just used her wings, this whole absurd scenario never would've happened.

That said, a pretty meh episode overall. The whole thing just felt contrived. And, as Mesme said, we probably met the worst doctor ever. Yeah, I'd definitely go to that guy for a checkup!

The doctor provided accurate diagnosis so he at least did his job, so I would not in good conscience be able to call him the worst doctor. If not for his final second leaving the room, everything else would be spot on. 

As far as the Egon collection, it's expected that you assume that Zecora's role in collecting the gunk was necessitated by her expertise. I definitely don't see a narrative issue with how they presented it.

In fact, allowing Fluttershy to take a back seat drives home the thematic elements of the story and her guilt. It certainly isn't out of character for either Zecora or Fluttershy. 

[DonMaguz 1,023]

Amazing episode!

With its thrill and pace it had me at the edge of my seat from the beggining. I'll need to watch it a few more times, but this may be my favorite episode of the season.

[Jeric 46,850]

4 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

"I'll leave you two to discuss!" This joke's as badly delivered here as the Russian dub. Swamp fever is considered incurable, and the doctor's line treats it as a stupid joke. Worst joke (and from delivery, line, too) of the episode so far.

Funny thing is that isn't a joke. That's literally verbatim what Physicians say after advising a patient of a poor prognosis with little to no viable Tx options. 

This is how it goes and how they are trained. Showing empathy throughout is crucial. 

> Look patient in the eye. Advise simple description of Dx and outcome likelihood as to not set up false hope. If terminal, do not beat around the bush.

> Scan to ensure all family and friends present understood. 

> Determine if family or friends will be able to offer emotional support to your patient

> Encourage support and offer to have social work staff see the patient

> Open up for any questions maintaining eye contact with patient. 

> State that you understand that it is a lot yo process and that you will leave the room for them to be alone and discuss as a unit. 

> Confirm that you will be available for any questions

> Leave room gracefully

 

They skipped a few steps and messed up the exit, but his dialog was appropriate. I actually didn't take it as a joke, just par for the course and something I've heard more times than I can count. 

[RulesofRarity 489]

Spoiler

Is it possible that the Pony of Shadows has Meadowbrook? 

 

Edited September 23, 2017 by RulesofRarity

[Dark Qiviut 22,379]

22 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

Watching it in English. Finished Act 1.

The delivery of the jokes feels a lot more organic here than with the Russian dub. I don't know why, but I think it's because of how flat the dub was at times.

That said, two jokes here don't work.

1. The drum roll representing Zecora's heartbeat. The doctor said that was bad, but the drum roll doesn't show us it's bad. Maybe something downplayed, like a quicke or irregular heartbeat.
2. "I'll leave you two to discuss!" This joke's as badly delivered here as the Russian dub. Swamp fever is considered incurable, and the doctor's line treats it as a stupid joke. Worst joke (and from delivery, line, too) of the episode so far.

The exposition in this act is also rather heavy, particularly in the castle. It downplays the effort Fluttershy's putting to trying to find not only a possible cure for Zecora, but also who that legendary healer was. A determined look by her as TS went to sleep isn't enough to show that. Some kind of visual storytelling to show us her dedication and realization into the morning will help.

One more thing I forgot.

Twilight and Spike's cooking competition is seen short, but really cute. There are very few bonding moments between the two this series. More of those, please.

7 minutes ago, Jeric said:

Funny thing is that isn't a joke. That's literally verbatim what Physicians say after advising a patient of a poor prognosis with little to no viable Tx options. 

It's not the line itself I have a problem with, but how it's expressed. The tone downplays the seriousness of the situation.

---

Now, onto Act 2!

Edited September 23, 2017 by Dark Qiviut

[Midnight Seashell 206]

Earth pony parkour was cool, l was also a bit surprised to see Twilight not want to read longer since she used to read more than she spent time with her friends and stayed in the castle redecorating the library for 1+ days or so and l have to give Fluttershy credit for the lengths she went to help Zecora, perhaps she should be the element of loyalty.

[StitchandMLPlover 930]

22 minutes ago, Jeric said:

Funny thing is that isn't a joke. That's literally verbatim what Physicians say after advising a patient of a poor prognosis with little to no viable Tx options. 

This is how it goes and how they are trained. Showing empathy throughout is crucial. 

> Look patient in the eye. Advise simple description of Dx and outcome likelihood as to not set up false hope. If terminal, do not beat around the bush.

> Scan to ensure all family and friends present understood. 

> Determine if family or friends will be able to offer emotional support to your patient

> Encourage support and offer to have social work staff see the patient

> Open up for any questions maintaining eye contact with patient. 

> State that you understand that it is a lot yo process and that you will leave the room for them to be alone and discuss as a unit. 

> Confirm that you will be available for any questions

> Leave room gracefully

 

They skipped a few steps and messed up the exit, but his dialog was appropriate. I actually didn't take it as a joke, just par for the course and something I've heard more times than I can count. 

As somebody who has had contact with many doctors I completely agree the doctor ponies reaction was accurate. Yes the pony doctor left the room quickly but he clearly was wanting to give them space and his smiling was obviously a nervous simile. He didn't want to give that news. 

[Dark Qiviut 22,379]

Finished Act 2!

The lack of sleep didn't show an effect on Fluttershy audibly, but it did visually and through some of her actions. En route to the bayou, she was very clumsy, first bumping into Zecora's door and then TS herself. Sleep deprivation also caused her eyes to become a little droopy (and probably catch the contagious disease).

The exposition is nowhere heavy here. The only one there is when FS repeated to Twilight that Cattail is one of her descendants, but FS delivery makes it up.

Twilight makes a really cool reference to her old library. Adds a nice touch to the act and overall story.

Mage Meadowbrook being an Earth Pony is a major continuity screwup. In Part 2 of The Cutie Map, Twilight stated Mage Meadowbrook was a unicorn who possessed eight magical items. It doesn't look big if you don't catch the detail, but we're talking about her being a completely different race than what Twilight read about. DHX'll have to figure out how to solve this mistake.

Quote

FS: "It doesn't say how she did that."

I've already seen the episode in Russian, so I know how it ends. This is a really contrived setup. If Meadowbrook's diary currently had it written down, the episode would've ended by the end of the act.

Nowwwww, onto Act 3! */Digimon Data Squad reference*

Edited September 23, 2017 by Dark Qiviut

[age3rcm 101]

1 hour ago, StitchandMLPlover said:

 Anybody else think the turning into a tree is a way of talking about death without saying the word "death"?

i wonder what other implied death moments the guys will plan out

so far its been hibernation and turning into a tree.
but death has been shown into the show before, on background. a burial scene with coffins

[Truffles 2,033]

43 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

Twilight and Spike's cooking competition is seen short, but really cute. There are very few bonding moments between the two this series. More of those, please.

It was, and yes they should do this more often. This scene was a bit of a revelation to me, however, because everything I'd seen in the past indicated Twilight's cooking was only good enough for passable.

It seems she is every bit as good of a cook as he is if they are indeed having cooking contests with one another. I'd like to think she learned all his techniques while she was sitting around in S5 bored out of her skull and became a great chef.

In fact, he pretty much admitted she won that particular contest since he ate all her muffins but left his cauliflower bites alone. XD

Of course, I'm not really a fan of cauliflower so I'd pick the muffins, too. Sorry Spike. 

[Jeric 46,850]

54 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

It's not the line itself I have a problem with, but how it's expressed. The tone downplays the seriousness of the situation.

 

Yes but you are ignoring the quality that precedes it. His deliver up until that moment was characteristic of the situation and they did a good job from the music to the facial characterizations. Perhaps it is just me, but when I eat something that is delicious yet has an odd aftertaste, I still acknowledge its initial taste was fine for my pallet. It takes someone at a level of atrociousness to wipe away everything else, and the chipper exit by the doctor wasn't that bad. At least not enough to do that. I agree that it was a flubbed moment, but not to the degree of impacting the urgency and gravity of the scene overall. 

[age3rcm 101]

another thing i want to point out is about the flash bees.

the animators have choosen to make insects blink and have brows because it will make easier to the viewers to understand the bees.
as well as that part of the bee liking the meadowbrook mask. they put an action that we understand because we see it as a cat being affective.
another thing to put is about the stethic. the white stripe on the eyes is used as both a light reflection and something we could indentify as something that resembles an eye.

about fluttershy not being able to fly to pick up the moss:
2 points:

• zecora offered help.
• she knew where it grew.

even if fluttershy could pick up some herself, turning down help also makes people sad that they cannot help, and i would think that would be tricky to maintain flight balance while picking up  something that is on water, the moss is floating, so a miscalculed hoof movement would mess up.the catch.
zecora probably went there knowing she would get wet, but she tried to find a way to do it without getting wet and that is why we saw her with her tail on the tree.

i would like to also point out that plague masks works, but i am not sure how efficient.

it blocks the plague victim from breathing in your face and throwing germs on your mouth and eyes.
the eyes are a vulnerable part of the body to catch disease.. i bet that the masks eyes are made of glass.
also the "beak" is a feature that works as a "safe distance" of contact with the infected.

[CypherHoof 26,482]

32 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

Mage Meadowbrook being an Earth Pony is a major continuity screwup. In Part 2 of The Cutie Map, Twilight stated Mage Meadowbrook was a unicorn who possessed eight magical items. It doesn't look big if you don't catch the detail, but we're talking about her being a completely different race than what Twilight read about. DHX'll have to figure out how to solve this mistake.

Maybe. They could just ignore it though - just because Twi once read in a book that MM was a unicorn, that doesn't mean it's true.

[Drunkfrank 1,125]

Twilight said "I haven't studied eastern unicorns as much as I should have"  Meaning Twilight wasn't really all that aware of Meadowbrook, Not really a continuity screw up, very possible shes was simply called a sorceress and Twilight assumed that meant Unicorn 

[Mesme Rize 15,683]

This was such a weird joke in my opinion,

I would expect drums and jazz from Pinkies heart, but not Zecoras.

[Dynamo Pad 11,269]

I found this episode to be really enjoyable. I liked how Fluttershy brought up the animal reserve that we saw earlier this season. The symptoms for swamp fever were surprising and the end results were shocking. I didn't like how the doctor left Fluttershy and Zecora with a smile on his face. I liked how Fluttershy became very determined to help cure Zecora of her illness. I thought the Twilight and Spike baking scene was cute and pretty funny. I also liked how Fluttershy and Twilight went through her books to help find anything on swamp fever. I was surprised how Fluttershy stayed up all night, but liked how she found a way to find the cure. The new location was interesting and I liked how we get another pony of legend. I also liked how we got to see a pony who's related to Mage Meadowbrook. I'm curious to see what happened to Meadowbrook after her mysterious disappearance. I enjoyed the backstory to Meadobrook and I was surprised when Fluttershy caught swamp fever as well. Although, I don't remember Fluttershy coming into contact with the flower. I guess it could be by being near Zecora that the disease was contagious.I also thought the flash bees were pretty pretty interesting creatures. I also liked how we got to see the stare once again after not seeing it for so long. I was surprised when Fluttershy passed out when trying to get the honey, but I guess it makes sense since she was going on without any sleep. It was nice to see Twilight and I was glad when Fluttershy was able to figure out how to get the honey and was able to help cure herself and Zecora. All in all, the moral was well done and I liked the episode a lot. I'm looking forward to seeing what's next in season 7. 

[StitchandMLPlover 930]

1 hour ago, age3rcm said:

i wonder what other implied death moments the guys will plan out

so far its been hibernation and turning into a tree.
but death has been shown into the show before, on background. a burial scene with coffins

What episode showed a funeral???! Can you show me a screenshot of that? 

[Thrond 3,263]

2 hours ago, Dark Qiviut said:

• The drum roll representing Zecora's heartbeat. The doctor said that was bad, but the drum roll doesn't show us it's bad. Maybe something downplayed, like a quicke or irregular heartbeat.

I thought the presence of a drum roll instead of a heartbeat was the joke. We're surprised by there being a drum roll there, but the doctor talks as if he knows exactly what that means. Subverting expectations. 

 

[StitchandMLPlover 930]

24 minutes ago, Dynamo Pad said:

I found this episode to be really enjoyable. I liked how Fluttershy brought up the animal reserve that we saw earlier this season. The symptoms for swamp fever were surprising and the end results were shocking. I didn't like how the doctor left Fluttershy and Zecora with a smile on his face. I liked how Fluttershy became very determined to help cure Zecora of her illness. I thought the Twilight and Spike baking scene was cute and pretty funny. I also liked how Fluttershy and Twilight went through her books to help find anything on swamp fever. I was surprised how Fluttershy stayed up all night, but liked how she found a way to find the cure. The new location was interesting and I liked how we get another pony of legend. I also liked how we got to see a pony who's related to Mage Meadowbrook. I'm curious to see what happened to Meadowbrook after her mysterious disappearance. I enjoyed the backstory to Meadobrook and I was surprised when Fluttershy caught swamp fever as well. Although, I don't remember Fluttershy coming into contact with the flower. I guess it could be by being near Zecora that the disease was contagious.I also thought the flash bees were pretty pretty interesting creatures. I also liked how we got to see the stare once again after not seeing it for so long. I was surprised when Fluttershy passed out when trying to get the honey, but I guess it makes sense since she was going on without any sleep. It was nice to see Twilight and I was glad when Fluttershy was able to figure out how to get the honey and was able to help cure herself and Zecora. All in all, the moral was well done and I liked the episode a lot. I'm looking forward to seeing what's next in season 7. 

I agree. I was surprised Fluttershy passed out too but when somebody I knew who had a few chronic health issues had a dizzy spell in front of me almost exactly like Fluttershy's he said the dizziness and feeling like he was about to faint was partly trigged from exhaustion so I guess its possible. When he first told me that I was like "WHAT?! Being tired made you dizzy?!" and he explained that being tired made his neurologic symptoms(he had a stroke) and other health issues(diabetes,and a list of other things) kick in faster, hence the terrifying dizzy spell. (Either that or he thought the simpler explanation of being tired would be less terrifying to me. It kind of had the opposite effect.) In Fluttershy's case, she was already sleep deprived and ill and the bee venom probably just shut her body down for a bit. So it was the combination of the compounded problems like what this friend of mine who got dizzy irl told me had happened to him.

The disease is said to be catching so I assume that's how Fluttershy and the doc caught it.  

Edited September 23, 2017 by StitchandMLPlover

[Thrond 3,263]

3 hours ago, Cirrus. said:

This episode makes this possibly

SO NOT BEAUTIFUL...

 

There's probably going to be some grim fan art...

Oh wow, that puts a different spin on things. Might also explain why nobody specifically stated the Apple parents were dead. 

 

 

[Jeric 46,850]

1 hour ago, age3rcm said:

also the "beak" is a feature that works as a "safe distance" of contact with the infected.

It was a storage compartment that held herbal medicines, straw, and spices. They had dual purposes of both fighting illness which was thought to be spread through miasma, and also to mask the scent of illness and death. 

They used a cane to measure safe distance and interact with infected patients. 

You are correct that the eyes were glass and one of the better attributes on the mask.  

13 minutes ago, AlexanderThrond said:

Oh wow, that puts a different spin on things. Might also explain why nobody specifically stated the Apple parents were dead. 

 

 

Nah. We saw them plant the tree, Granny didn't know it existed, and Health of Information states specifically that you turn into the tree that spreads the disease, not an Apple or Pear tree. 

36 minutes ago, StitchandMLPlover said:

What episode showed a funeral???! Can you show me a screenshot of that? 

 

[Thrond 3,263]

4 minutes ago, Jeric said:

Nah. We saw them plant the tree, Granny didn't know it existed, and Health of Information states specifically that you turn into the tree that spreads the disease, not an Apple or Pear tree. 

Looking back, the tree in "Perfect Pear" doesn't look much like the tree in "Health of Information" either, so I guess that's one bit of dark silliness debunked. 

[Oleks 1,993]

So, people are saying that this episode has a bit of grimdark feel because of that curse turning ponies into trees (and then furniture and houses are built from them). But Doctor Horse said that exactly the following: “the last stage, the afflicted turn into the very trees that drop the disease-spreading flower”. So, only those specific trees in (I hope) secluded places were once ponies. But anyway, it’s a good callback to Fluttershy wanting to be a tree joke.

As for the episode in general, I liked it. Having to save her friend made Fluttershy quite determined, adventurous even. I like that side of her. And Twilight with the books – all such scenes are precious. It seems strange though that neither Fluttershy nor Zecora knew anything about those flowers, but the doctor did. Also, Celestia has to do something to improve the state of healthcare in Equestria. At least raise awareness of the cursed flowers.
Now that I think of it, who cursed the very first of the swamp fever flowers? It’s some dark magic right there.

Spoiler

When I heard about the pack of oxen, I had to look the word “ox” up in the dictionary to confirm it can mean something else apart from “a castrated bull”. Because a herd of castrated bulls would be weird.

 

[StitchandMLPlover 930]

5 minutes ago, Jeric said:

It was a storage compartment that held herbal medicines, straw, and spices. They had dual purposes of both fighting illness which was thought to be spread through miasma, and also to mask the scent of illness and death. 

They used a cane to measure safe distance and interact with infected patients. 

You are correct that the eyes were glass and one of the better attributes on the mask.  

Nah. We saw them plant the tree, Granny didn't know it existed, and Health of Information states specifically that you turn into the tree that spreads the disease, not an Apple or Pear tree. 

 

WOW! Never realized that scene had a coffin in it! I guess it went so fast I thought it was something else. Surprised they put that in but don't say "die" . I guess ponies are not immortal.