FlareGun45

Does Twilight even WANNA be leader?

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Twilight was happy where she was, as the Princess of Friendship, all she had to do was run a school, travel around to help ponies, she was happy! But then Celestia unexpectedly gave her a promotion to run Equestria, something Twilight never asked for. Something she never expected to do! Celestia never even ASKED Twilight if she wanted to run Equestria, she just GAVE it to her! She's just stuffing destinies down Twilight's throat basically! While Spike's the opposite, he has no destiny, Twilight has a ton that she never asked for - she never asked to be a Princess in general! At least being the Princess of Friendship makes sense to her story arc, a valuable asset to Equestria's cause, now she's gonna be LEADER? This whole story arc doesn't really make sense. Cadance was a princess much longer than Twilight, but she's running the Crystal Empire, so who's gonna run friendship duties if Twilight's running the country? What's the use of Twilight's castle and the map now?

However, when ya think about it, perhaps Celestia and Luna never asked to be leaders either, and were just forced to become ones by Starswirl. Celestia had dreams of being a part of play, something she didn't get till much much later in her life. Basically, this is like Snowfall's story in Hearth's Warming Tale - with that Professor Snape pony forcing her to comply to her studies instead of going out and having fun, which made her bitter. Perhaps the princesses were bitter at first, apparently Twilight was in the beginning of the series.

Seems like there's a drawed path laid out for Twilight by Celestia, and the only thing Twilight really asked for was to be part of her school, not all this. Sure Twilight may be alright with being leader now, but it's not like she had a choice in the matter. No wonder she never asks Spike what he wants, she was raised to be like that - nobody asks her! She hasn't said no cause she never speaks up against Celestia, which she shoulda, Celestia probably would understand knowing her.

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Consider this: Twilight never asked to be reassigned to Ponyville, meet the Mane Five, become the Element of Magic, or even become the Princess of Friendship. 

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Just now, TheAnimationFanatic said:

Consider this: Twilight never asked to be reassigned to Ponyville, meet the Mane Five, become the Element of Magic, or even become the Princess of Friendship. 

That is true. So Twilight's life is based on being a puppet then. It may have saved Equestria, she may be ok with it, but apparently the show's teaching us that forcing something is the right thing to do.

Much like what happened in 2, 4, 6 Great

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Looking at the trailer now it seems like she does wanna be a leader. 

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15 minutes ago, FlareGun45 said:

That is true. So Twilight's life is based on being a puppet then. It may have saved Equestria, she may be ok with it, but apparently the show's teaching us that forcing something is the right thing to do.

 

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Much like what happened in 2, 4, 6 Great

 

No, not a puppet at all. In real life, you're rarely faced with making hard choices at your convenience. The point of it is that Twilight, like she's done throughout the course of the series, is being asked to take responsibility and embrace her calling as a leader.

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18 minutes ago, TheAnimationFanatic said:

No, not a puppet at all. In real life, you're rarely faced with making hard choices at your convenience. The point of it is that Twilight, like she's done throughout the course of the series, is being asked to take responsibility and embrace her calling as a leader.

That's still not really giving her choice. It's like, "Be a leader or Equestria is doomed". As if there weren't any OTHER candidates worthy? Tristar pony coulda had a fallback plan if things didn't work out with her. 

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(edited)
32 minutes ago, TheAnimationFanatic said:

No, not a puppet at all. In real life, you're rarely faced with making hard choices at your convenience. The point of it is that Twilight, like she's done throughout the course of the series, is being asked to take responsibility and embrace her calling as a leader.

Exactly.

And @FlareGun45, there's a bit of Fridge Brilliance between when Sunset was Celestia's ambitious student who turned cruel and dishonest for a time and Twilight herself.

In the Equestria Girls Annual 2013 comic, which provided one broad stroke as to the backstory of Sunset, showed Sunset selfishly wanting to be a powerful pony in charge. It was foreshadowed when she first looked upon her reflection in the mirror connecting the EQG world to Equestria and saw her as a powerful Alicorn. She wanted to in control so badly to the point where she ran away to the human world and soon ruled the school through fear and intimidation. Her selfishness proved she was not ready to be a Princess nor a leader

Twilight herself on the other hoof may not have wanted to be a princess at first, but she DID proved she possess the qualities of being a good leader which is what a good high ranking person should have. Episodes like Winter Wrap-Up show that.

Which is why when Twilight's finished Starswirl's spell, which I'm pretty sure was not intended to make the caster an Alicorn and was intended for something else, It was Celestia herself who pulled out some magic from within Twilight's body which wrapped around her and once faded revealed her wings. This means Twilight's Ascension to Alicornhood came from herself

Edited by Will Guide

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6 minutes ago, FlareGun45 said:

That's still not really giving her choice. It's like, "Be a leader or Equestria is doomed". As if there weren't any OTHER candidates worthy? Tristar pony coulda had a fallback plan if things didn't work out with her. 

It IS a choice. She can chose to not accept the call and wait for someone else to take the helm OR she can step up to the challenge herself. 

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Just now, TheAnimationFanatic said:

It IS a choice. She can chose to not accept the call and wait for someone else to take the helm OR she can step up to the challenge herself. 

 

6 minutes ago, Will Guide said:

Exactly.

And @FlareGun45, there's a bit of Fridge Brilliance between when Sunset was Celestia's ambitious student who turned cruel and dishonest for a time and Twilight herself.

In the Equestria Girls Annual 2013 comic, which provided one broad stroke as to the backstory of Sunset, showed Sunset selfishly wanting to be a powerful pony in charge. It was foreshadowed when she first looked upon her reflection in the mirror connecting the EQG world to Equestria and saw her as a powerful Alicorn. She wanted to in control so badly to the point where she ran away to the human world and soon ruled the school through fear and intimidation. Her selfishness proved she was not ready to be a Princess nor a leader

Twilight herself on the other hoof may not have wanted to be a princess at first, but she DID proved she possess the qualities of being a good leader which is what a good high ranking person should have. Episodes like Winter Wrap-Up show that.

Which is why when Twilight's finished Starswirl's spell, which I'm pretty sure was not intended to make the caster an Alicorn and was intended for something else, It was Celestia herself who pulled out some magic from within Twilight's body which wrapped around her and once faded revealed her wings. This means Twilight's Ascension to Alicornhood came from herself

Alright fine, guess I can accept that.

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(edited)

My problem with all that is, Celestia and Luna didn't put Twilight in such position because Twilight was ready or worthy. They did it just because they wanted to retire at that moment. They would have just put Mayor Mare or Cheerilee in that position instead, at least that's the impression I got from how the show portrayed it. That seems utterly irresponsible. Nobody can just quit such a position whenever they want to. I liked seeing more and more of the princesses' down to earth side, but I really hate to see them lose dignity, divinity, prudence, responsibility, maturity and common sense. Twilight not being ready for the position didn't help it either. She seemed more like the next ruler of Equesteia in early seasons than recent episodes. The show cared much more about being relatable, realistic, likable by being flawed, they forgot about making them actually better characters.

Edited by Sepul-Coloratura

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7 minutes ago, Sepul-Coloratura said:

My problem with all that is, Celestia and Luna didn't put Twilight in such position because Twilight was ready or worthy. They did it just because they wanted to retire at that moment. They would have just put Mayor Mare or Cheerilee in that position instead, at least that's the impression I got from how the show portrayed it. That seems utterly irresponsible. Nobody can just quit such a position whenever they want to. I liked seeing more and more of the princesses' down to earth side, but I really hate to see them lose dignity, divinity, prudence, responsibility, maturity and common sense.

That there is true too! Maybe they shoulda told Twilight way ahead of time when she first became princess, "Hey, Twilight, someday we might retire, and if that day ever comes, we're hoping you would be able to take over our position!"

Twilight: "Oh you think I can handle it?" *starts Twilighting*

Celestia: "Don't worry, Twilight! That day won't come for a loooooong time! So you have plenty of time to think about it!"

There, fixed it!

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1 minute ago, FlareGun45 said:

That there is true too! Maybe they shoulda told Twilight way ahead of time when she first became princess, "Hey, Twilight, someday we might retire, and if that day ever comes, we're hoping you would be able to take over our position!"

Twilight: "Oh you think I can handle it?" *starts Twilighting*

Celestia: "Don't worry, Twilight! That day won't come for a loooooong time! So you have plenty of time to think about it!"

There, fixed it!

"BuT cEleStiA, ArEn'T TheRe oNLy oNe SeasOn LeFT?"

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22 minutes ago, Sepul-Coloratura said:

"BuT cEleStiA, ArEn'T TheRe oNLy oNe SeasOn LeFT?"

I can't find a laughing react! XD

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I would have thought Twilight would decline her royal title but keep her alicornhood if that's was the case. Is that a bit selfish for Celestia and Luna to retire and shove everything on Twilight, perhaps.

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Twilight is kind of the leader ever since the first episode. Add to that Winter Wrap Up and the problem is that the cartoon always tried its best to be as apolitical as possible. Even when Twilight became princess and the title was bastardized beyond recognition.

Anything else is headcanon or fansplaining. As far as I'm concerned, Twilight is the leader already and the problem is ruling a nation. Which the cartoon also avoids like the plague. So, it's MLP being MLP and I can't wait to see the reboot already.

This season is a wrap up. Nothing really will make an impact.

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20 minutes ago, Metemponychosis said:

Twilight is kind of the leader ever since the first episode. Add to that Winter Wrap Up and the problem is that the cartoon always tried its best to be as apolitical as possible. Even when Twilight became princess and the title was bastardized beyond recognition.

Anything else is headcanon or fansplaining. As far as I'm concerned, Twilight is the leader already and the problem is ruling a nation. Which the cartoon also avoids like the plague. So, it's MLP being MLP and I can't wait to see the reboot already.

This season is a wrap up. Nothing really will make an impact.

Ehhhh... you dunno, there's still could be some impactful moments! Secrets of Discord, Legion of Doom, Spike turning out to have some kinda hidden power.... there's still time for impactful stuff!

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‘Tis is fate for fate cannot be change.  All for more hasbro to promote Queen Twilight sparkle to their sells. 

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I think Twilight sometimes wishes she could go back in time to avoid becoming a Princess.

 

Then, she could spend her days living in her old treehouse, reading books/spending time with her friends & most importantly,

 

not having to deal with the stress of knowing that she'll be ruling an entire country sooner rather than later. 

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1 hour ago, FlareGun45 said:

Ehhhh... you dunno, there's still could be some impactful moments! Secrets of Discord, Legion of Doom, Spike turning out to have some kinda hidden power.... there's still time for impactful stuff!

We mean different things with 'impact'. I'm sure that several episodes will give us meaningful moments to remember the cartoon by. But this specific thing, that Twilight will replace Celestia just doesn't interest me and the finale will end the only way the cartoon could ever end. Everything is fine because whatever will happen and yaaaay! It's every season finale. Which doesn't mean I'm not intrigued about Chrysalis and the others and looking forward to whatever happens, but in the end it means nothing other than they're likely going to switch sides and learn the magic of friendship...

And then, back to Twilight replacing Celestia... So what? It's the end. The cartoon can't do anything with that. Not only this, but this specific thread is just pointless to me: Celestia has been dead on the water for most of the series and Twilight replacing her is just a gimmick to end the cartoon.

So, I'm looking forward to the stories the cartoon has to tell, but the big 'thing' is just an eye roll.

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I honestly don't feel like Twilight even wanted to be a princess. She could run a friendship school without the royal title, and every time the show focuses on the fact that she's royalty, it seems to make her miserable. And why shouldn't it? She never asked to be a princess. She never gave any indication that it's something she wanted. I'm certain she would be good at ruling Equestria, but it was offered so abruptly, and the show never gives her the option of saying no. 

In "The Beginning of the End," becoming the ruler of Equestria makes her incredibly nervous. In "The Point of No Return," she's constantly talking about how good she thinks the job of a librarian is. I think the difference says it all.

There are many great stories about people who are thrust into a position of power despite having no interest in it, but they take that person's feelings seriously. There are also many great stories about unambitious people who become great leaders despite that. If My Little Pony takes the time to show us when and how Twilight decides she's ready for the role, then fine, I'll begrudgingly accept it. But I have my doubts.

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On 8/8/2019 at 9:50 AM, FlareGun45 said:

That is true. So Twilight's life is based on being a puppet then. It may have saved Equestria, she may be ok with it, but apparently the show's teaching us that forcing something is the right thing to do.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Much like what happened in 2, 4, 6 Great

 

That...isn't the lesson of the show at all. Twilight wasn't forced to do any of these things, she accepts them (aside from becoming an Alicorn, but that was something she had earned.)

She didn't HAVE to go to ponyville, she didn't HAVE to stay there, she accepted them because Celestia was her mentor.

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1 hour ago, RyanMahaffe said:

That...isn't the lesson of the show at all. Twilight wasn't forced to do any of these things, she accepts them (aside from becoming an Alicorn, but that was something she had earned.)

She didn't HAVE to go to ponyville, she didn't HAVE to stay there, she accepted them because Celestia was her mentor.

She looks up to her a bit too much. 

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3 hours ago, FlareGun45 said:

She looks up to her a bit too much. 

As she learns mostly in "Horse Play" and hasn't really fallen back on that development

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Does she want to be leader of Equestria? No. Is she ready to be leader of Equestria? Yes. 

And let's not forget, she's ruling alongside her friends. 

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17 hours ago, Lucky Bolt said:

Does she want to be leader of Equestria? No. Is she ready to be leader of Equestria? Yes. 

And let's not forget, she's ruling alongside her friends. 

That's a bit of question-maker. IS the entire Mane 7 ruling, or they just helping Twilight? The show hasn't specifically answered that.

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