Issues I had with the Season Finale

[Ezynell 2,036]

1. I didn't find the final battle rushed at all. You seem to think that the "final battle" only encompasses Shining Armor's spell, but in my opinion it starts the first time Celestia confronts Chrysalis. The spell wasn't the whole battle, it was a last resort.

 

I didn't mean it in the way of the "Final Battle", but it seemed like a cop out way of dealing with the solution. The one spell not only defeated Chrysalis, but also wiped out all the minions and fixed all the problems going on. It was also more powerful then Celestia herself.

[Yellow Diamond 7,564]

I more or less agree with points one and two. In my own review of the finale, I mentioned that the denouement was wrapped up rather quickly. We were treated to a terrific build up and climax, yet the resolution had to work itself out in a matter of a few minutes. That is, unfortunately, the problem with having only 45 minutes to dedicate to the finale; in many ways, this was building up more like a feature-length film rather than a two-part episode. More could definitely have been done with Queen Chrysalis, the Changeling invasion, and Twilight and Cadence's escape from caves beneath Canterlot. I don't blame the writers so much as the time constraints. If they were given more time, I'm sure they would have provided a far more satisfying resolution than the instant love bomb.

 

A few others have disagreed with this assessment, but I still hold the love spell as a deus ex machina. It resolved what was otherwise unresolvable given the situation, and it instantly made everything better again.

 

Other than that, a pitch-perfect episode. I don't mind the writers gearing more jokes toward Bronies; in fact, I welcome it. I don't think they'll ever be in a position to break away from the essential formula of the show, i.e., friendship and magic. I do not fear MLP: FIM becoming some sort of raunchy adult cartoon, or suffering from an overabundance of fan references. Studio B learned over the course of season two how far they could push things. I'm sure they'll apply many of those lessons in the third season.

 

The ease of the Sonic Rainbow doesn't faze me in the least. If you want a potential canonical explanation for how Dash could pull off the maneuver without difficulty, my explanation would be that the entire event was filled with positive emotions and, therefore, the extra push to do the Sonic Rainboom wasn't very hard to find

 

Personally, I thought Luna showing up late was pretty funny. I hope she gets more attention in the third season, but I like to imagine she was handling a number of conflicts off-screen.

Edited April 22, 2012 by Thereisnospoon303

[Pony Joe 582]

I didn't mean it in the way of the "Final Battle", but it seemed like a cop out way of dealing with the solution. The one spell not only defeated Chrysalis, but also wiped out all the minions and fixed all the problems going on. It was also more powerful then Celestia herself.

 

I suppose it could be considered a cop-out, but really, when all else has failed, is there any more logical way to try to get rid of a changeling invasion than... I don't know... a supercharged version of an anti-changeling spell that's never failed them yet?

 

And I'm pretty sure it makes sense for the captain of the royal guard to be better at defensive spells than Celestia, especially when he's directly receiving additional magical power from Cadence. Celestia's not supposed to be some god-like figure of unlimited power.

 

I guess I can see where your coming from, though. I myself complained a bit about the one-spell-fixes-all ending of Friendship is Magic and The Return of Harmony, but I suppose by now I've kinda gotten used to it.

[Guest]

I do have to agree with many of your points (still a great finale, but everything has its flaws). I think had they been able to give it more time (make a bucking movie already STUDIO B ) , then it probably would have allowed for more explanation. They still have to gear it towards the target audience as well, and I doubt younger viewers want to listen to explanations. They would rather see the villain defeated and the couple reunited (we want to see this too, but we also want the explanations, wheras they just want right to the end).

 

Also, they would be foolish not to slightly begin catering to the Brony community, the trick is that they need to be able to keep the balancing act going. If they can succeed at this then the show will only be improved!

 

Luna has alwasy been second potatoe in episodes it seems, so it didn't really suprise me that she wasn't around much. *shrugs*

 

Also, I alwasy thought RD could sonic rainboom on command so I guess that didn't bother me at all. *secondary shrug*

 

All in all, I think had they had more time (only two episodes really doesn't do it justice) I think many of these problems could have been smoothed over.

Edited April 22, 2012 by Guest

[Key Gear 6,662]

Ezynell, I don't outright disagree with your points, but I would like to share an alternative way of looking at just a few things.

 

All done. It seemed like a cop out to me, and the only other time I was upset about the ending such an episode was when they teleported out of the woods at the end of "Dragon Quest".

 

I don't really think that you can compare the ending of Dragon Quest to the ending of the finale. As Pony Joe writes above me, the ending of the finale includes more than just the restoration of Shining Armor's spell.

 

With that said, the very last leg of that segment did seem to go by a little fast. It would have been fun and cool to have something more like this for instance (exlcuding the 80s music... unless you're into that sort of thing):

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think that the 44 minute limit was probably responsible for denying us a more awesome conclusion to the battle.

 

The way they introduced the new creatures was a little over speed too.

 

I agree that the new creatures were introduced somewhat quickly. However, as you say, they have done this many times before, and I do not think that it should have been expected for them to do anything different this time.

 

Cockatrices, manticores, griffons, minotaurs, multi-headed hounds, and more - the writer's have made a habit of throwing new creatures at us without much more than a sentence or two of explanation (if any). Changelings are a pretty well established mythological creature, so the writer's probably figured that they could get away with no explanation again.

 

The reason that this speedy introduction probably disturbed you is that the changelings on the show really were not the same as the other creatures that the show had introduced. They seemed to have actual backstory attached to them - they held kind of grudge against the ponies. Some explanation of this backstory - even just a few lines - would have been helpful.

 

I bet that the writer's originally wrote this in but it had to be cut to make the story fit within 44 minutes.

 

The show producers seem to be gearing allot of their show toward the Brony audience now, such as the bachelor party joke, and the overall dark atmosphere of the episode

 

Appletini? Spiked punch? All You've Ever Wanted to Know About Slumber Parties? (Oh my....)

 

The writer's seem to have a habit of slipping in jokes that can be perceived as a bit risqué if you know the background. I don't see the bachelor party joke as a deviation from the norms. (By the way, not all bachelor parties are wild, crazy events. Though... Many are.......)

 

As for the darker atmosphere of the episode, I am not entirely certain that this is a new thing either. The season opener for season 2 was quite dark as well. The discording of the mane 6 was not a light-hearted event. Besides, as Pony Joe said, I don't really think that there was any other way to do this story right.

 

Whenever I usually see the Sonic Rainboom performed on the show, it always channels a decent amount of emotion through my body, but the "on demand" aspect and lack of buildup killed the mood for me, especially how Rainbow Dash did it while ascending, not even descending, and the animation on it seemed more poor then on the other times it happened.

 

The only other episodes with RD performing a sonic rainboom were Sonic Rainboom and The Cutie Mark Chronicles. Both of those episodes are back in season 1. I am not particularly sure about the chronology of the episodes, but I am willing to go out on a limb here and say that, most likely, RD has gained in skill since that time.

 

I also think that RD's Sonic Rainboom's have something to do with her emotional state at the time. She was only able to pull one off in The Cutie Mark Chronicles because of the thrill of competition. In Sonic Rainboom, she was only able to do one to save Rarity. Each incident relied on some kind of intense feeling, like an adrenalin rush of some kind.

 

I would guess that after all of the amazing events prior to the wedding and the wedding itself, RD was probably "pumped" enough to pull off a Sonic Rainboom. As for the poorer animation, an alternative explanation might be that they didn't really focus on RD very much as she pulled off the rainboom.

 

While this isn't really related to the show, I found Tori Spelling's (the one who queued the commercials every break) acting to be more then bad.

 

Yes! All of my yes! I couldn't stand Spelling's segments. I thought they were completely unnecessary. Her "acting" was horrifying to me.

 

Hasbro should have saved their money and given me some show accurate plushies instead!

 

Luna didn't seem to give a buck. Throughout the entire episode, all the other bronies watching with me were saying "where's luna" and similar stuff

 

When Luna first arrives to take over from Celestia for the night watch, she actually enters Canterlot from outside of the field. If we assume that this means Luna does not reside in Canterlot, then we could also assume that she returns to her home when Celestia begins the day watch.

[HomuraBL 851]

I know that everybody absolutely adored the episode, and I personally also thought it was amazing, but a few things struck me as not up to par with the episode. I watched it with three other Brony friends and they seemed to agree with me so I thought I'd share it here and see what response I get.

 

First of all, I'd like to state that I did love it. The songs were amazing, as well as the humor and the fight scene. Pinkie was hilarous and really kept the jokes rolling in.

 

Back on topic to the negative side, I thought the ending went way faster then it should have.

• The entire episode was building up and building up to that one single moment where she had complete control, then all the sudden, the elements were out of reach, Celestia had been cornered, Canterlot was in rune, and the Mane 6 were helpless, the entire thing was just fixed in a few seconds. All done. It seemed like a cop out to me, and the only other time I was upset about the ending such an episode was when they teleported out of the woods at the end of "Dragon Quest".
• The way they introduced the new creatures was a little over speed too. All the ponies seemed to know what they were, but they were introduced to have unbelievable power and introduced in a snap. I know all the other monsters in the past have been introduced like this (timberwolves, manticore, ice-spirit-things, etc.) but this is the first time it's disturbed me.
• The show producers seem to be gearing allot of their show toward the Brony audience now, such as the bachelor party joke, and the overall dark atmosphere of the episode. This is what caused many of the fans to fangasm, but could be a bad thing in the long run. The ironic target audience of the show is one of the mane things that have caused the fans to develop in such a loving and tolerant way and if the show began to be geared toward the older viewers, it really wouldn't be the same show anymore.
• Also the Sonic Rainboom was really upsetting to me. Whenever I usually see the Sonic Rainboom performed on the show, it always channels a decent amount of emotion through my body, but the "on demand" aspect and lack of buildup killed the mood for me, especially how Rainbow Dash did it while ascending, not even descending, and the animation on it seemed more poor then on the other times it happened.
• While this isn't really related to the show, I found Tori Spelling's (the one who queued the commercials every break) acting to be more then bad. Especially the Rarity scene, if anypony can find a link to that.
• As something final to say, Luna didn't seem to give a buck. Throughout the entire episode, all the other bronies watching with me were saying "where's luna" and similar stuff to the point where I honestly thought she was going to be the one to come and save the day.

That aside, when Vinyl Scratch showed up, every Brony in the room literally stood up and began to cheer.

 

 

 

I have to disagree with you on some points.

 

The first, and major one is how you think the show is gearing towards the brony audience.

 

You are wrong. In countless interviews, the people who worked on studio B always said that they make the show to where they have fun making it. If that means putting an adult joke in then ok. The only brony things they do is fan service and thats it. As for the dark atmosphere, again, if they want it that way, its not because of the Bronies.

 

The final battle...Look, I love shipping, so seeing the power of love defeat them was amazing. Though, I think the reason that the defeat of the queen was bad was because, They used love and defeated her. Look at all the other villain's defeat. There was a lot more of a struggle when they were being defeated. But the queen was just blasted away...She is still best villain though.

 

Vinyl scratch has a confirmed eye color now...Though I have no idea what it was from that distance. That a big plus.

 

Overall, these were pretty amazing, almost perfect episodes.

[Shteev 11]

Cadence is basically the magical incarnation of love. Love and friendship are kind of a HUGE part of the My Little Pony world, and if Alicorns represent a very key part of life (Day, Night, Love), then it's no real surprise that the sheer power of Cadences's love gun could almost/even rival Celestia's... Day... Powers...

 

Plus, Twilight Sparkle can cast bubbles around her friends, and a tree library... Shining Armour can cast a shield around an entire freaking city! I mean, with the combined powers of the love of an alicorn, and sheer defensive force of the magical Captain of the Guard, it's not /too/ much of a stretch to imagine they could do away with Queen Chrysalis.

 

Also, thinking of it, Chrysalis said she was being powered by the love of Shining Armour... and with that amount of love (and whatever pre-existing strength a Queen Changling would have) she defeated Celestia. Her strength didn't draw from Cadence or seemingly anything else, it just seems like Shining Armour REALLY loved Cadence aha. If Cadence were to have taken Chrysalis on horn-to-horn, they would've tied, but with couple together... yeah... I think I'm caring too much about this particular point. :I

[Kazuki Fuse 534]

Loved this episode almost more than any other season 2 episode for a few reasons:

 

1. Big Brother Best Friend Forever seriously hit me like a blow from a sledgehammer. Doubt I've mentioned it to anyone here but my older bro Derek died 3 years back and he was a great guy, so when I say that it made me tear up, it actually made tears fall from my eyes.

 

2. I liked the whole Changling enemy thing, even if it felt a bit harried.

 

3. Vinyl's red eyes are canon. Fuck yes.

 

4. Sweetie Belle in flowergirl outfit? HNNNNGGGG. Seeing her dance with Spike? The HNNGS have been quadrupled. My body is ready for shipfics.

 

And that is why this is one of the best MLP:FIM episodes ever!

[RippedOffMattress 314]

Eh, I didn't mind the rushed ending. We had the clone fighting scenes. That itself, sugar-coated the rushed ending!

 

Although the rainboom was pretty dissapointing. THAT was the rushed part. http://mlpforums.com/public/style_emoticons/default/dry.png But after seeing Vinyl and her eyes, that made up for everything, giving me the greatest season finaly EVER!

[Key Gear 6,662]

Just a quick note for those that may not be familiar with the concept. Back during ancient times, the deus ex machina was an actor portraying a Greek or Roman god. They would be lowered onto the stage during a play using a crane. The god would then proceed to use their power to decide the conclusion.

 

Nowadays, the phrase "deus ex machina" is used to describe anything that seems to just drop in and decide an outcome. The "deus ex machina" is a copout for writers because it allows them to have a nice easy solution, regardless of how bad the problem was.

 

A few others have disagreed with this assessment, but I still hold the love spell as a deus ex machina. It resolved what was otherwise unresolvable given the situation, and it instantly made everything better again.

 

Yeah, at the very moment that Twilight freed Cadance, I actually said, "ah, here we go, the deus ex machina". I was sharply elbowed in the ribs for making this observation aloud. But, I was right. Boom! The bad guys were swept away, harmony was restored, and it was time to parrrrtaaaayy - Pinkie Pie style!

 

However, after some repeated viewings, I began to question my original conclusion. Based on this, I sort of walked through a process of determining whether or not I was wrong or right. I am not sure of how to organize this, so I will just type things in the order that I thought them. I hope that it is not too much of a complete mess.

 

According to WordNet, the definition of "deus ex machina" is this:

 

any active agent who appears unexpectedly to solve an insoluble difficulty

The Merriam-Webster seems to support this definition:

 

a person or thing (as in fiction or drama) that appears or is introduced suddenly and unexpectedly and provides a contrived solution to an apparently insoluble difficulty

Based on these definitions, it seems that there are two primary criteria necessary for something to be a deus ex machina. The solution must appear unexpectedly, and the problem must appear completely unsolvable. So, did the event solve an unsolvable problem?

 

The "power of love" ending definitely seemed to solve an unsolvable problem. Celestia was down, the mane 6 were captured, the elements of harmony were not present, and the guards were all neutralized. (Game. Set. Match.) The writer's seemed to have totally and completely backed themselves into a corner with this. So, the second half of the definition matches perfectly.

 

The first half of the definition seems, at first glance, to match as well. As you say, the love spell appears suddenly and solves all of the problems. Case closed. Or not. You see, I reached the same conclusion that you did, but then something continued to bother me. While the love spell did appear suddenly, was it entirely unexpected.

 

As I thought about this, suddenly it hit me. The love spell did not appear unexpectedly at all. As a matter of fact, it had been subtly foreshadowed.

 

Cadance's cutie mark is a heart. Her talent seems to be the ability to "spread love" (in Twilight's own words). In Twilight's flashback sequence, Cadance seemed to be able to use her power to do exactly that. If we were to take a guess, then we could probably say that Cadance's special talent is, quite literally, love.

 

The direct power source for Queen Chrysalis was Shining Armor's love for Cadance. His love for Cadance was so powerful that Queen Chrysalis was able to use it and completely defeat Celestia. This makes sense though. If Cadance's talent is love, then I think that we can be safe in making the assumption that the love between her and Shining Armor would be incredibly strong.

 

After Cadance was freed, she went to Shining Armor and she snapped him out of his trance using her power. Now we get to the love spell. I think that Cadance and Shining Armor literally combined her love spell and his shield spell. The result of this combination was not just a normal forcefield but a love-powered forcefield.

 

The changelings are creatures that feed on love. Most biological organisms feed on things to give them nutrients and macronutrients that they, themselves, do not intrinsically possess. This implies that the changelings are not natural producers of love.

 

If the forcefield created by Cadance and Shining Armor was indeed a love-powered forcefield, then this could actually explain why it repelled the changelings so quickly and easily. If they are completely without love, then it seems to make sense that a field that was powered by the very thing that they lacked could be completely devastating when turned against them.

 

In order for the love spell to be deus ex machina, it should be unexpected. There should not be any foreshadowing in order for something to count as a deus ex machina. However, as you can see, the case can be made that the love spell was actually foreshadowed quite early on.

 

The entire case against the love spell being a use of deus ex machina hinges on Cadance. Her power is love. She is an Alicorn. From what we have seen, Alicorns have remarkably powerful abilities in magic. Shining armors shield spell repels changelings. We are given these facts and others prior to the use of the love spell.

 

TLDR - Check out my video explanation in the spoiler.

 

 

 

http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkAVfsw5xSQ

 

 

 

(Sweet Celestia.... A love-powered forcefield? The power of love? Love spells? I have never used the word love this many times in one piece of writing in my entire life. What is happening to me!!??!?!!)

[Ezynell 2,036]

The final battle...Look, I love shipping, so seeing the power of love defeat them was amazing. Though, I think the reason that the defeat of the queen was bad was because, They used love and defeated her. Look at all the other villain's defeat. There was a lot more of a struggle when they were being defeated. But the queen was just blasted away...She is still best villain though.

 

I'm a big fan of shipping too, and I think watching the episode, my mind glazed over the fact that she was powered off of Cadences love. You're right, I should have thought this over a little more.

[userLol 13]

My only problem with this episode is they didn't call bridesmaids bridesmares

[Ezynell 2,036]

Ezynell, I don't outright disagree with your points, but I would like to share an alternative way of looking at just a few things.

 

 

 

I don't really think that you can compare the ending of Dragon Quest to the ending of the finale. As Pony Joe writes above me, the ending of the finale includes more than just the restoration of Shining Armor's spell.

 

With that said, the very last leg of that segment did seem to go by a little fast. It would have been fun and cool to have something more like this for instance (exlcuding the 80s music... unless you're into that sort of thing):

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think that the 44 minute limit was probably responsible for denying us a more awesome conclusion to the battle.

 

You are certainly right with this one. I had completely forgotten that Chrysalis was feeding off of the love of princess Cadence when writing this post. Also Shining Armor's spell was combined with the love which was Chrysalis's main power which was another thing that slipped my mind.

 

I agree that the new creatures were introduced somewhat quickly. However, as you say, they have done this many times before, and I do not think that it should have been expected for them to do anything different this time.

 

Cockatrices, manticores, griffons, minotaurs, multi-headed hounds, and more - the writer's have made a habit of throwing new creatures at us without much more than a sentence or two of explanation (if any). Changelings are a pretty well established mythological creature, so the writer's probably figured that they could get away with no explanation again.

 

The reason that this speedy introduction probably disturbed you is that the changelings on the show really were not the same as the other creatures that the show had introduced. They seemed to have actual backstory attached to them - they held kind of grudge against the ponies. Some explanation of this backstory - even just a few lines - would have been helpful.

 

I bet that the writer's originally wrote this in but it had to be cut to make the story fit within 44 minutes.

 

Wow, I didn't even know that Changelings were established mythological creatures. That makes sense seeing as almost all of their monsters are pre-established mythological ones, but this puts things into a new perspective. Hopefully a back story attached to them can be a focal point for a season 3 episode.

 

Appletini? Spiked punch? All You've Ever Wanted to Know About Slumber Parties? (Oh my....)

 

The writer's seem to have a habit of slipping in jokes that can be perceived as a bit risqué if you know the background. I don't see the bachelor party joke as a deviation from the norms. (By the way, not all bachelor parties are wild, crazy events. Though... Many are.......)

 

As for the darker atmosphere of the episode, I am not entirely certain that this is a new thing either. The season opener for season 2 was quite dark as well. The discording of the mane 6 was not a light-hearted event. Besides, as Pony Joe said, I don't really think that there was any other way to do this story right.

 

I had never noticed the Appletini reference or the Slumber Party one... the slumber party one is a bit... yea, wow. So I guess that that fits in. The darker atmosphere of this story I find to be a little more extreme then in the Discord episode and I'd compare it more to the "Toy Story 3" of My Little Pony.

 

The only other episodes with RD performing a sonic rainboom were Sonic Rainboom and The Cutie Mark Chronicles. Both of those episodes are back in season 1. I am not particularly sure about the chronology of the episodes, but I am willing to go out on a limb here and say that, most likely, RD has gained in skill since that time.

 

I also think that RD's Sonic Rainboom's have something to do with her emotional state at the time. She was only able to pull one off in The Cutie Mark Chronicles because of the thrill of competition. In Sonic Rainboom, she was only able to do one to save Rarity. Each incident relied on some kind of intense feeling, like an adrenalin rush of some kind.

 

I would guess that after all of the amazing events prior to the wedding and the wedding itself, RD was probably "pumped" enough to pull off a Sonic Rainboom. As for the poorer animation, an alternative explanation might be that they didn't really focus on RD very much as she pulled off the rainboom.

 

I see how she could have done it under that condition, but the lack of intensity for it removed allot of emotion for that scene. Even with the pump and the rest of the episode budget, they always had the rainboom looking unbelievably amazing. And with Rainbow Dash being the only Pegasus able to pull it off, she made it look like an unbelievably simple act.

 

Yes! All of my yes! I couldn't stand Spelling's segments. I thought they were completely unnecessary. Her "acting" was horrifying to me.

 

Hasbro should have saved their money and given me some show accurate plushies instead!

 

This is something everyone can agree on XD. I wouldn't be surprised if she became some sort of submeme. I kinda feel bad for her.

 

When Luna first arrives to take over from Celestia for the night watch, she actually enters Canterlot from outside of the field. If we assume that this means Luna does not reside in Canterlot, then we could also assume that she returns to her home when Celestia begins the day watch.

 

Just a thought, what if she woke up after the battle and the Mane 6 had lost. Oh the lulz.

[Iris Melody 90]

I didn't mean it in the way of the "Final Battle", but it seemed like a cop out way of dealing with the solution. The one spell not only defeated Chrysalis, but also wiped out all the minions and fixed all the problems going on. It was also more powerful then Celestia herself.

 

LOVE CONQUERS ALL

 

I couldn't resist I read all the posts before choosing to type this, and I think pretty much anything of value I could have contributed, you have already responded to from others. You did bring up valid points, and I'm glad they all seem to have been addressed. I, personally, am completely thrilled that they involved the power of love! Elements of Harmony, meet the power of love! I sure hope in Season 3 they have male ponies as regular characters and friends! I really hope they tackle the issue that friendship should not be (or at least doesn't have to be) gender-restricted.

 

Also love that Shining Armor and Princess Cadence at least had a history of knowing each other for many years before getting married. I hope to see some backstory on that!

 

Maybe they'll make an extended "director's cut" movie version of this?! Here's to hoping!

[MrL0LZ 866]

I know that everybody absolutely adored the episode, and I personally also thought it was amazing, but a few things struck me as not up to par with the episode. I watched it with three other Brony friends and they seemed to agree with me so I thought I'd share it here and see what response I get.

 

First of all, I'd like to state that I did love it. The songs were amazing, as well as the humor and the fight scene. Pinkie was hilarous and really kept the jokes rolling in.

 

Back on topic to the negative side, I thought the ending went way faster then it should have.

• The entire episode was building up and building up to that one single moment where she had complete control, then all the sudden, the elements were out of reach, Celestia had been cornered, Canterlot was in rune, and the Mane 6 were helpless, the entire thing was just fixed in a few seconds. All done. It seemed like a cop out to me, and the only other time I was upset about the ending such an episode was when they teleported out of the woods at the end of "Dragon Quest".
• The way they introduced the new creatures was a little over speed too. All the ponies seemed to know what they were, but they were introduced to have unbelievable power and introduced in a snap. I know all the other monsters in the past have been introduced like this (timberwolves, manticore, ice-spirit-things, etc.) but this is the first time it's disturbed me.
• The show producers seem to be gearing allot of their show toward the Brony audience now, such as the bachelor party joke, and the overall dark atmosphere of the episode. This is what caused many of the fans to fangasm, but could be a bad thing in the long run. The ironic target audience of the show is one of the mane things that have caused the fans to develop in such a loving and tolerant way and if the show began to be geared toward the older viewers, it really wouldn't be the same show anymore.
• Also the Sonic Rainboom was really upsetting to me. Whenever I usually see the Sonic Rainboom performed on the show, it always channels a decent amount of emotion through my body, but the "on demand" aspect and lack of buildup killed the mood for me, especially how Rainbow Dash did it while ascending, not even descending, and the animation on it seemed more poor then on the other times it happened.
• While this isn't really related to the show, I found Tori Spelling's (the one who queued the commercials every break) acting to be more then bad. Especially the Rarity scene, if anypony can find a link to that.
• As something final to say, Luna didn't seem to give a buck. Throughout the entire episode, all the other bronies watching with me were saying "where's luna" and similar stuff to the point where I honestly thought she was going to be the one to come and save the day.

That aside, when Vinyl Scratch showed up, every Brony in the room literally stood up and began to cheer.

 

I agree A LOT with #4 and #6.

[prettycool 65]

While I do think this episode was great and had no flaws I do have to admit that I can understand why you would have issues with this episode.

Edited April 22, 2012 by SuperX46

[Yellow Diamond 7,564]

Post

 

I won't quote the whole of the post for the sake of space.

 

Your points are well taken. The "power of love" theme definitely has the essence of foreshadowing---from young Cadence settling the two quarreling lovers (or overriding their free will; you be the judge) to "This Day Aria" and its emphasis on true love versus deception---it wasn't a secret in retrospect that love would play a crucial role in solving the crisis. Kidding aside, an apt (if slightly less subtle) analogy would be during Dragon Ball Z when, during the battle with Frieza, there was occasional reference to the legend of the Super Saiyan and how Vegeta thought he was the one destined to ascend to that form. Given the formula of Dragon Ball, it was practically assured that Goku, not Vegeta, would be the one to beat Frieza; so when the Spirit Bomb failed, Frieza came back, and then Krillin was killed, Goku transforming into a Super Saiyan was an unexpected event within the context of the characters. In the overall narrative, it isn't a surprise to the audience; if, for whatever reason, you asked Son Goku or Frieza if a Super Saiyan was going to appear, it wouldn't be a serious consideration given the circumstances.

 

Thus we know Princess Cadence's love for Shining Armor is particularly, even more so, in a implicit fashion, than the friendship of the Mane Six---that requires the Elements of Harmony as conduits of power---although the fact Cadence and Shining Armor are alicorns and unicorns, respectively, certainly helps. As this is the case, I think we may be able to say that it is not properly a deus ex machina from the vantage point of the audience; for the ponies, however, it is most certainly an unexpected event which helps resolve the narrative having been boxed into a corner.

 

I shared Cadence and Shining Armor's love in an analogy with a Super Saiyan. I feel both satisfied and kind of weird.

[Key Gear 6,662]

I shared Cadence and Shining Armor's love in an analogy with a Super Saiyan.

 

LIKE A BOSS!

 

I am completely unfamiliar with Dragon Ball Z, but, after a bit of research, I have to say.... Your analogy is fantastic, and it has made the thread about 20% cooler.

 

I myself was still unsure about whether or not the ending was a deus ex machina (even after writing my wall of text), but now, with the help of this unlikely illustration, I think that I feel more secure in saying that it was not. Well, at least not from the perspective of the audience.

[Yellow Diamond 7,564]

LIKE A BOSS!

 

I am completely unfamiliar with Dragon Ball Z, but, after a bit of research, I have to say.... Your analogy is fantastic, and it has made the thread about 20% cooler.

 

I myself was still unsure about whether or not the ending was a deus ex machina (even after writing my wall of text), but now, with the help of this unlikely illustration, I think that I feel more secure in saying that it was not. Well, at least not from the perspective of the audience.

 

Dragon Ball was the first thing that came to mind, probably due to the fight scenes and the magic beam battle between Celestia Chrysalis. If it made the thread 20%, then my work here is done.

[Reaverpony 3]

Really I was rather disappointed by this finale. For most of this season I loved the direction it took but this finale just didn’t do it for me. It seems to me that this finale has something of an identity crisis. It tries to build into an epic confrontation which it seemingly succeeds with up until the actual confrontation itself.

 

The whole wedding crashing was a nice set piece but everything seemed to start falling apart for me the moment the Changeling Queen started telling her plan to everyone in the room. This little cliché I have seen time after time again in kid shows and I used to love them. With the direction this episode was heading however it seemed to just be a slap in the face that this is still supposed to be for kids which really offset the atmosphere. The part with Celestia being defeated seemed weak to me. For someone who has the power to send a mare to the freaking moon, change night into day, and seems to have lived for around a millennium to be so easily defeated screams either a cop out or “We are f***ed!” Unfortunately it comes off as the former by the conclusion.

 

The sight of Canterlot in ruins bounced the show back to this “epic” conclusion. I have no complaints with the ensuing dash for the elements of harmony. I have no issues with the capture at the end. I do have issues with the fact everyone seemed to give after that up until the love of two people spontaneously saves the day (as expected for the kiddies). That just didn’t fit with the desperation of the situation. To say the conclusion was rather rushed is an understatement. The conclusion was just another miracle solution that saved the day. For most of the series I would find that to be acceptable but with the struggle going on in the end, the solution seemed cheap as hell.

 

The episode seemed torn between sticking to the younger audience while trying to appeal a lot to bronies. Usually this can be done successfully in other episodes yet it just seems to just fail for me during this episode sadly. There seemed to be too much appeal to the tastes of an older audience mixed in with the clichés and basis of a kids show (or perhaps vice versa). I personally think that the brony influence should only go as far as to effect small portions of the show such as small jokes, cameos, or maybe a plot change in line with the show’s established atmosphere. This darker tone shows promise as a standalone but in the end it didn’t mix well with what MLP is already.

 

Well those are my complaints in a rather messy nutshell. I did enjoy the episode however. I just felt it could have been better realized.

[RickRossTheBoss 17]

I highly agree with pretty much everything you said, but it didn't make me not like the episode at all.

 

The ending definitely went faster than it should have...

 

The point you made about the Sonic Rainboom is very true...doesn't it usually take a lot more effort to pull it off? I was like wtf? That was kinda lame...

 

Also, I was really hoping Luna would show up though cause she is like my favorite character besides RD. Not sure where she was when Canterlot was being attacked http://mlpforums.com/public/style_emoticons/default/dry.png

 

Also, I'm probably in the minority on this, but I frankly don't care for Vinyl Scratch, so that wasn't a big deal for me.

 

You pretty much said all that I was gonna say.

 

*Brohoof*

[Chigens and Kay 3,831]

Here is Tori Spelling if you guys want to get mad:

 

That Rarity part is at like 28 seconds btw.

 

 

She was the biggest problem with the Season Finale.

Edited April 23, 2012 by Chigens

[Ezynell 2,036]

Here is Tori Spelling if you guys want to get mad:

 

That Rarity part is at like 28 seconds btw.

 

http-~~-//www.youtube.c...h?v=44OUB98t8zw

 

She was the biggest problem with the Season Finale.

 

I can't believe... how bad it is...

[prettycool 65]

Here is Tori Spelling if you guys want to get mad:

 

That Rarity part is at like 28 seconds btw.

 

http-~~-//www.youtube.c...h?v=44OUB98t8zw

 

She was the biggest problem with the Season Finale.

 

I feel so bad for the ponies that had to suffer thru her.

[Evilshy 5,089]

(watched finale on YouTube)

(did not have to watch Tori)

 

 

 

Anyway, even if the ending was a bit of a cop out (which actually I don't think it was, but my reasons are the same ones that were already posted, so inwont repeat them), would you rather that the mane 6 just element hax'd their way through everything again?

I was actually disappointed when Celestia told them to go get the elements. I was thinking "damn... She beat Celestia, now what will the poni- oh right. Elements beat everything".

 

The ensuing fight scene totally made up for that, but I was quite glad to see the final boss get defeated by something other than the elements, and pleasantly surprised that it wasn't even the mane 6 who beat her.