The Importance of Tagging: Search Feature Woes & Ironing

[NavelColt 22,883]

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Something's bugged me lately. Whenever I'm searching for something, lots of topics that aren't what I'm looking for pop up.~Scootabloom, over yonder in "Improve the searching"

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Whenever I find a thread that sounds as if it's been posted before, though, I have a rather hard time searching for it.~Kirino, "Forum Search Suggestion"

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Yah the search feature is 100% broken. I've tried searches for key words where I am 100% sure that I was the only one to use them in my tags, but it didn't even show up by the 5th page.~Bohtty, "Forum Search Suggestion"

MLP Forums has had a history of issues with the tagging feature, both technical and in simple lack of practice. First and foremost, the search tags' implementation into the search feature is almost non-existent, due to an ongoing forum error that Scoots and Feld0 are not unfamiliar with. Any of you can see what I mean if you click on any tag, in any topic. It will show up with a page saying 'No results'. This is being looked into, and it shall be fixed, hopefully at some point soon.

 

This topic, however, is going to talk about the other side of our problem; the lasting, layered problem. The issue of tags not being nearly as utilized by members, or staff alike.

 

Let's take a random screenshot from Show Discussion's current front page; Show Discussion being one of our primary discussion hubs of the board, and thus a place where consistently tagged threads are vital.

 

 

6 tagged topics, 6 with none. 50% of topics have absolutely no tags whatsoever, and this is a reoccurring theme throughout the forum. This is a combination of three things:

 

1: Newbies either have no concept of using tags or don't bother.

 

2: Semi-regulars or regulars don't for whatever reason.

 

3: Staff don't edit topics to place tags when there aren't any, even though it's technically something our job description describes.

 

Truth be told, the tagging feature hasn't been vital to our existence and growth thus far. This is obvious considering it's still broken and not utilized much, and here we are thriving. That said, we have had growing pains. With the tagging search feature not working and having so many topics without tags that, even if it was working we wouldn't have considerable gain out of it, the search feature suffers. And we've had our fair share of complaints about the search feature, as the OP has given a very small taste to.

 

In order to fix the tagging feature, I have the following scheme in mind:

 

A: Scoots is going to add the tagging feature to his gargantuan To-Do List, and, hopefully, we can finally reach a breakthrough with the system at some point. If all goes well, the tagging search feature will no longer be broken, and clicking on a tag should yield results instead of saying 'No results'.

 

B: I plan on making a large FAQ entry that not only talks about the importance of tagging just as this topic has shown, but of which also lists a bunch of generic tag patterns, examples and types (names of characters, places, etc.) that both members and moderators can use off-hand for quick additions of tags to topics that lack any.

 

C: After A and B have been implemented, moderators can regularly add tags when they're able, and hopefully members in general will be more libel to add tags to their new topics as it becomes norm. The FAQ entry regarding all this might be linked to in the Resource Map.

 

This will be an ongoing project for the foreseeable future, following those three steps, of which I'll be doing my best to keep track of, with Scoots helping me with step A. Thanks for reading~

 

--

 

EDIT: The FAQ entry regarding tags has been created.

Edited February 7, 2013 by ~Chaotic Discord~

[XrosOver 613]

Let's play a new game called tag the topics! I should start doing that... Does this apply for blogs as well? I would assume it does because they use tags also.

[Alex Kennedy 1,228]

I always make sure to add as many tags as I can think of (and that are appropriate and relevant, obviously) when creating a topic. I would think that once the search issues are cleared up, one would want to add as many tags an possible so that their topic will show up in searches more often and thus hopefully be more active.

[MelancholicMemory 2,027]

I just realized that I never use tags on any of my topics. I will be sure to add plenty of tags on future topics though, and I may even add them to some of my older threads  as well. I am glad that this problem is finally being addressed.

Edited February 7, 2013 by MelancholicMemory

[NavelColt 22,883]

  On 2013-02-07 at 3:23 PM, Alex-Kennedy said:

I always make sure to add as many tags as I can think of (and that are appropriate and relevant, obviously) when creating a topic. I would think that once the search issues are cleared up, one would want to add as many tags an possible so that their topic will show up in searches more often and thus hopefully be more active.

That's the hope. Fix the feature, give it a little promotion so newbies are aware that it's a helpful thing to use, and it should ideally run itself.

[Rainbow Dash 1,472]

i always forget to tag a topic when i create a new post. I didn't think they were that important. I guess i am a bad person for not tagging.

[NavelColt 22,883]

  On 2013-02-07 at 1:21 PM, ~Harmonic XrosOver~ said:

Let's play a new game called tag the topics! I should start doing that... Does this apply for blogs as well? I would assume it does because they use tags also.

 Blogs have their own tagging system as well, yes :3

 

  On 2013-02-07 at 4:41 PM, Iamnotabrony said:

i always forget to tag a topic when i create a new post. I didn't think they were that important. I guess i am a bad person for not tagging.

Doesn't make you bad; tags are very, very overlooked because, like I said, they've been a non-vital, semi-broken feature for a while now ^^ We're just going to try and fix that. It should help the search feature become more accurate overall, and make everyone's time easier.

 

Also, I've created the FAQ entry I mentioned in Step B. I've added a link to it at the bottom of the OP.

[Shift 4,272]

I use tags sometimes.Not all the time. Sometimes, and that means not much. Thanks for the heads up, i'll be using them from now on.

[Dave247 568]

It could be an idea to have users suggest tags for topics that aren't there's but, that in itself would cause problems like first and foremostly, how such a thing would be implemented which would most likely require another custom plugin created by our tech turkey who is already extremely busy, and even if it were, what is to say the users were to make use of it otherwise the time spent making the plugin would have been for a waste. On the flip side, users might start using it too much and overwhelming the staff with requests to approve but I would imagine this to be a easier fix as a limit could be set to how many suggestions a user could make per day, or something along those lines.

 

it's just an idea but I honestly don't know how viable it would end up being and if it would be worth going to the trouble of implementing it.

[Prismatic 49]

I know Dave has said this but I'm putting it in my own words.

 

I myself am not a fan of tagging.  If anything my forum threads tags already match the forum thread's title.  The issue I'd see is that people can easily spoof tags and add results to things that don't even have any sort of relation to the tag (i.e. tagging what does not exist).  For example I can throw in an R-9Ø tag (which is relevant to my original character) in which said object wouldn't exist at all.  The other would be items that would need multiple tags since there isn't a way to make tagging consistent (for example my computers tag could be computer, Turing machine, electronic, integrated circuits, etc.).  Once you let the Opal out of the bag you're going to have a very hard time putting her back in and unless the forum behaves it's going to substantially increase the load on the moderators if done incorrectly.

 

If there's something of interest I am looking for via the search function and typing in the word yields no results I would say it probably does not exist.  Of course it depends on how sensitive the function is.  I believe it does it from the first character (i.e. Prismatic would come up if Prism is used rather than matic) and can't be changed last time I used it.

Edited February 8, 2013 by Prismatic

[Zygen 6,066]

I actually never really payed attention to the exsistance of tags.. I feel kinda bad now :/

 

I guess I'll try and pay more attention to it, and hopefully others will to.

 

i guess they where never important anywhere else, or maybe I wasn't aware of their exsistance, whatever the reason I'll try to remember to put some tags in the next topic I make.

[SCS 7,537]

I usually try to write in five tags whenever I make a new topic. I don't have any particular reason for choosing that number, other than the fact that I like the number five. What would be a general ideal number of tags, if there is one?

[NavelColt 22,883]

  On 2013-02-28 at 2:53 AM, SCS said:

I usually try to write in five tags whenever I make a new topic. I don't have any particular reason for choosing that number, other than the fact that I like the number five. What would be a general ideal number of tags, if there is one?

 

A minimum I'd say should be around three, and you can have up to ten.

 

Number 2 from my OP is on Scoots' list of things to try and tackle at some point ^^ I'll definitely be reporting again when we eventually have the tag search function working.

[SCS 7,537]

  On 2013-02-28 at 4:55 AM, ~Chaotic Discord~ said:

A minimum I'd say should be around three, and you can have up to ten.

 

Number 2 from my OP is on Scoots' list of things to try and tackle at some point ^^ I'll definitely be reporting again when we eventually have the tag search function working.

 

Okay, sounds good.

 

Also, I have a suggestion: users should be required to enter in at least three tags when making a new topic, or else they would get an error when they tried to post it. This would ensure that tags were used always. 

[NavelColt 22,883]

  On 2013-02-28 at 1:10 PM, SCS said:

Okay, sounds good.

 

Also, I have a suggestion: users should be required to enter in at least three tags when making a new topic, or else they would get an error when they tried to post it. This would ensure that tags were used always. 

 

There's definitely a line between ensuring people do something important, and just being slightly obnoxious; I think a board-wide error for not entering tags would just get a lot of needless complaining. If we did enforce that, it'd only be needed in Show Discussion, Sugarcube and maybe General Discussion/Media Discussion.

[Zain 32]

Oooo You got me all excited since I'm currently working a bit in Enterprise Content Management... but in the argument of cost vs. value for a social forum, I think the steps you laid out should be plenty, so I won't get into crazier ideas.   

 

Forum member adoption is crucial though, and as you've stated, finding the balance of encouraging and explaining the importance of something Vs. forcing it, being obnoxious and losing support, is a far more tricky thing than it seems on the surface.   

 

I'll be sure to tag!  

[Pinkazoid 3,493]

Too much work, too lazy to type extra words.

 

I haven't tagged a topic in a long time :x

 

Last time I did was long ago when loved writing out stuff on the tags for people to have a laugh at even though they never did

[Batbrony 16,056]

  On 2013-02-07 at 1:00 PM, ~Chaotic Discord~ said:

MLP Forums has had a history of issues with the tagging feature, both technical and in simple lack of practice. First and foremost, the search tags' implementation into the search feature is almost non-existent, due to an ongoing forum error that Scoots and Feld0 are not unfamiliar with. Any of you can see what I mean if you click on any tag, in any topic. It will show up with a page saying 'No results'. This is being looked into, and it shall be fixed, hopefully at some point soon.

 

This topic, however, is going to talk about the other side of our problem; the lasting, layered problem. The issue of tags not being nearly as utilized by members, or staff alike.

 

I know this topic is kinda old, and I'm glad that it's been looked into, but I just wanted to ask if anyone on the staff has considered implementing a tag-minimum requirement for new topics?  Just like our character minimum, this could perhaps encourage tagging topics very efficiently, and wouldn't have to be that many required, say, 3 minimum.  IDK if this is feasible or would just be a pain in the flank, but I'm just trying to shoot some ideas out there to help make things more clean and organized on the forums.  Hope everything is going well with the tag-reforms! 

[NavelColt 22,883]

So, hey guys Why is a topic this old being unlocked and revived, you ask? Because our godly new Tech Pony, @ has just solved this forum-long issue we've always had, of which I've mentioned in the OP :3 Those tags inside topics, those colorful prefixes that sat next to topic titles?

 

Yeah. Those work now.

 

No more 'no results' pages :3 We found the problem of why they weren't working, and it's been solved. So, now when you're browsing the Life Advice forum and want to find all those Brony Advice topics, the Non-Pony art forum and want to see all of a specific kind of art category, or are interested in searching any tags given underneath a topics' title...those all work, now The only downside is, the search feature itself had to remove an 'upgrade' it was given some time long ago. Using the search feature alone, itself, may or may not prove to be a little less efficient than it had been, but that can be worked on from another angle in the future, I'm sure.

 

People always talked about how the search function wasn't any better than it had ever been, so, gaining the ability to search tags and prefixes outweighs anything gained from that, I'm sure.

[Princess Periwinkle 3,775]

  On 2013-06-17 at 7:01 AM, ~Chaotic Discord~ said:

So, hey guys Why is a topic this old being unlocked and revived, you ask? Because our godly new Tech Pony, @ has just solved this forum-long issue we've always had, of which I've mentioned in the OP :3 Those tags inside topics, those colorful prefixes that sat next to topic titles?

 

Yeah. Those work now.

Yay! Now why don't you make the "tags" a required field? That should (help) stop the problem, at least with people forgetting to tag their topics.

 

[killersave60 22]

Yeah the problem is coming from the people who dont know how to tag good things (like me XD just kidding) and its because they are tagging the most popular things on the forum to get more popular