S02:E19 - Putting Your Hoof Down

[slumberparty101 21]

Everyone has a moment where they feel they don't recognize themselves in bad things they say. If I was to get in deep about it, I'd say Fluttershy has a passive irritation with aspects of Pinkie Pie's and Rarity's personality and it came to a boil. Her sweet nature makes her easy to forgive though, shown by the fact the other two stood outside her house worrying about her. It shows real unconditional affection.

[powerpuff-tsubasa 448]

i didnt find this episode charming. so mean...

i didnt find this episode charming. so mean...

[twiia 1,843]

This episode was okay, although Fluttershy did get a bit out of control...

[cmarston1 5,959]

This episode will always have a special place in my heart as the very first FIM episode I saw on the day that it premiered as I started watching the show during the break between A Friend in Deed and this episode.

[Fluttery Shy 102]

Just posting in here to say that this is one of my favorite episodes.

[Thrond 3,263]

Don't agree that Iron Will is a villain - I mean, he didn't really do anything wrong - and I think Fluttershy switches to "New Fluttershy" slightly too quickly, but "New Fluttershy" is so much fun to watch. She commands so much screen presence, and her scenes are just so memorable, that I find this episode irresistible in spite of its (undeniable) faults. Not the best-written episode, but I can forgive a lot if I'm having fun. 

 

New Fluttershy > Flutterbat

[Sovereign Leader Rarity 12,006]

Wait..... Putting your hoof down, that's....... OH NO! OH NO! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[blackstarraven 142]

On 11/27/2016 at 0:28 AM, AlexanderThrond said:

Don't agree that Iron Will is a villain.

Agreed. Which actually brings up a point.

Plenty of Villain's in MLP are not really Villain's...

They are Antagonists.

 

And one of the things I here bronies talk about (Redemption) actually is pretty important to this.

Because so far. Only One Villain's in MLP has actually be redeemed. And that's nightmare moon. And Luna is actually arguably not a Villain, Nightmare moon was. Because they actually do kind of seam like a different character (Like that lives inside of Luna)

Almost all the redeemed character in MLP are just Antagonists. and Antagonists can be normal people... Heck they can BE RIGHT over the protagonists some time's. (Flim and Flam, who lost JUST BECAUSE THEY MADE A MISTAKE)

Iron Will was not a Villain, heck his product (Training) DID WORK, it's just that Fluttershy was not pleased with it. And he had a garentee. That HE ACTUALLY KEPT... If anything he's one of the better business ponies we have ever seen.

Discord was just acting on his nature. Queen Cheese legs is the only one that might (As of right now) Get a Real Redemption episode. And I'm pretty sure that they are going to flesh her out more before that to show that she actually had (At least understandable) Reasons if not good reasons gone wrong before that.

Trixe was just a insecure show off / Jerk. Gilda was no dought a massive flankhat. But.. not really a Villain.

Only Terek and Sombra so far have been just flat out evil with no explanations. And both of them where defeated without even talking about redemption.

-

Side note about this: If any one reeds the comics they will know that there is a Sombra Redemption story in those. And the thing is, I like that story it's actually more fleshed out then most of the other stories in the show and has a lot of stuff in it that would really be nice to put into the Shows Cannon. But That story really would not work unless it was done as at least a two parter, I would argue three episodes of maybe a -Released to streaming/TV 90 minute movie or something.

-

 

As far as the episode goes? Meh.. 3 out of 5. Its good its just not great, the change in fluttershy was to quick.. BUT i understand why. It's a 22 minute show.

 

P.S.: Need's more Princesses.

P.S.S.: Any one else curious to see if the eventual cancellation of FiM leads to a kick starter project? Because I am really waiting for the time period when TV shows are saved / started with Kick Starter Projects...

Like how much does it cost to make a season of FiM? Or a 90 Minute Special? I'm actually curious...

[Velvet Blush 11]

hey did anyone notice how Rarity was calling Shyshy "sweetie"?

[Bricks_Ahoy 860]

7 hours ago, Velvet Blush said:

hey did anyone notice how Rarity was calling Shyshy "sweetie"?

Well, she's Rarity. She calls everyone "Darling" and "Sweetie". Just like how AppleJack calls everyone "sugar cube".

[Velvet Blush 11]

19 hours ago, SpiBaz said:

Well, she's Rarity. She calls everyone "Darling" and "Sweetie". Just like how AppleJack calls everyone "sugar cube".

yeah, she calls everyone "darling", not sweetie. as far as I noticed, only other time she called anyone sweetie is in Dragon Quest, and it was Spike. I don't even want to think about Sparity

[Pixel Stick 927]

1 hour ago, Velvet Blush said:

yeah, she calls everyone "darling", not sweetie. as far as I noticed, only other time she called anyone sweetie is in Dragon Quest, and it was Spike. I don't even want to think about Sparity

I do think you're reading too much into this, sweetie.  It's just another term of endearment.  When she's shown any romantic interest in anypony, she tends to use much more flowery language.

[Velvet Blush 11]

18 hours ago, Pixel Stick said:

I do think you're reading too much into this, sweetie.  It's just another term of endearment.  When she's shown any romantic interest in anypony, she tends to use much more flowery language.

perhaps you are right...I guess I just love Rarishy too much.

[Moony the Cat 3,702]

Fluttershy already showed some more aggressive behavior in previous Episodes, at least i think she did, i dont remember in which particular Episode because i dont care all that much, but it was still a fun Episode regardless.

[Pixel Stick 927]

48 minutes ago, Luna Moon said:

Fluttershy already showed some more aggressive behavior in previous Episodes, at least i think she did, i dont remember in which particular Episode because i dont care all that much, but it was still a fun Episode regardless.

You're probably thinking of Dragonshy, where she gets angry at the giant dragon she spent the whole episode being terrified of, when he hurts her friends.  She was also seen in "It's About Time" wrestling a bear in what appeared to be an extremely aggressive manner, though just after Twilight decided to move on, we saw that this was just her way of giving the bear a back massage, and he felt much better afterward.

(I'm of course not counting the Season 2 opener where she became mean to everypony else - that was due to her being mind-controlled by Discord, not from any of her own behavior.)

Edited January 8, 2018 by Pixel Stick
Adding a thought.

[Thrond 3,263]

I came into this prepared to call its storytelling disastrous, but... you know, it makes a lot more sense than I realized. It's contrived as all hell - how does Fluttershy keep bumping into all the worst people? - but you can see how Iron Will's messages were a step too far, and you can see how early successes reinforce her behaviour. But I still have the same problem: Fluttershy's transition to being a jerk is so sudden that it doesn't make a whole lot of sense, so Iron Will doesn't seem like he deserves the blame, even though his teachings are awfully aggressive. Not to mention that Fluttershy insulting Pinkie and Rarity has some really severe implications which I can't imagine were intended, as does those two's constant references to Iron Will as a "monster." So the storytelling isn't good, but the jokes are nicely structured, the moral is solid, and both Iron Will and New Fluttershy are still charismatic. And I love how Fluttershy utilizes Iron Will's satisfaction guarantee. So yes, I'm not blind to the problems - and they're big ones - but I can't ignore the many, many pleasures here either. 

Score:

Entertainment: 9/10

Characters: 6/10

Themes: 8/10

Story: 3/10

Overall: 65/100

[Meushell 52]

It’s probably wrong, but I enjoy Fluttershy when she’s mean. It’s just so not Fluttershy, and she’s funny. She doesn’t really have a good reason here, despite what Rarity and Pinkie believe. I didn’t like them continually calling Iron Will a monster, but I suppose that’s easier than facing the truth. Fluttershy’s insults were 100% her fault.

Angel was horrible. I suppose it was as over the top to make a point. Otherwise, that’s horrible behavior that Fluttershy has had to deal with for years.

I liked Iron Will. He did have a point in that Fluttershy seemed to benefit from his services. Does it really count though when he picked her out of a crowd and used her as advertisement? I mean, even if she had been 100% satisfied?

Edited June 27, 2018 by Meushell

[bigbertha 414]

This episode was just okay. There were some issues like how the entire town suddenly turned into jerks and Rarity's manipulation. There was also some bad dialogue with Pinkie and Rarity calling Iron Will a monster without having even met him. 

Aside from that, new Fluttershy was enjoyable enough, there were some other good gags, and Iron Will was a ton of fun. 

Score: 6/10

Edited July 23, 2018 by bigbertha

[Cash In 22,229]

I enjoyed this one quite a bit. 

Watching Fluttershy handle different situations in Ponyville was an interesting sight, both at the beginning and after she becomes more aggressive, due to Iron Will's teachings - Although, I can't but feel empathetic towards the Ponies who get ruffled, due to her sudden mood swings.  Despite this, I do understand the need for being stronger and not being pushed around, which makes me have a larger appreciation for Fluttershy herself. I'm glad that at the end of the episode, Fluttershy proved that she was more than capable of being assertive while still being sweet and kind, in addition to making amends with Rarity and Pinkie. Although, I will say that Fluttershy changed on a whim - which leaves me a tad confused on how her personality did a complete 180, only after spending a mere couple of minutes with Iron Will. 

Iron Will himself was a bit humorous at times, especially with his 'thumbs up to the camera' gag. I don't think that he's a bad guy, as I see him more of an individual with mischievous intentions.

[Midnight Solace 5,132]

What's with the "plothole" tag? 

[CypherHoof 26,482]

On 8/15/2018 at 3:45 PM, Cash In said:

I enjoyed this one quite a bit. 

Watching Fluttershy handle different situations in Ponyville was an interesting sight, both at the beginning and after she becomes more aggressive, due to Iron Will's teachings - Although, I can't but feel empathetic towards the Ponies who get ruffled, due to her sudden mood swings.  

I think there is a fair bit of depth to Fluttershy's actions here. It is often said that there is a cycle of abuse - with those who ARE abused becoming the aggressors in their turn - and Fluttershy has had to put up with a LOT.  In the earlier Cutie Mark Chronicles we see the casual abuse she received as a young filly, and this is reenforced in the later Hurricane Fluttershy; further, you see the open dismissal of her several times in this episode - some of those abused deserve SOME retribution, but increasingly it becomes obvious "new fluttershy" is going well over what is socially acceptable (like all the mane 6, Fluttershy is ridiculously overpowered; the scene with her and the bear in "lesson zero" is one good example, not to mention how far she could throw that poor tourist)

Others are less deserving of what they receive - again, that tourist, who as rarity and pinkie point out, was not actually to blame for fluttershy dropping her letters. But the two ponies on the bridge (bonbon and cherry berry?), while rude, didn't really deserve that given a pegasus pony could just fly over or around them, and of course pinkie herself.  But if Flutters has a fair bit of rage to work though after years of abuse, I am not too surprised at that.

 

On 8/15/2018 at 3:45 PM, Cash In said:

Despite this, I do understand the need for being stronger and not being pushed around, which makes me have a larger appreciation for Fluttershy herself. I'm glad that at the end of the episode, Fluttershy proved that she was more than capable of being assertive while still being sweet and kind, in addition to making amends with Rarity and Pinkie. Although, I will say that Fluttershy changed on a whim - which leaves me a tad confused on how her personality did a complete 180, only after spending a mere couple of minutes with Iron Will. 

reenforcement, mostly .her first attempt to apply Iron Will's teachings with Greenhooves went well (and was pretty much at the appropriate level) and her (again, mostly appropriate) response to shoeshine cutting in line quite aggressively got a LOT of praise from both pinkie and rarity... which led to her turning it up to 11 (which again we see in "fake it 'til you make it" way forward in S8)

 

On 8/15/2018 at 3:45 PM, Cash In said:

Iron Will himself was a bit humorous at times, especially with his 'thumbs up to the camera' gag. I don't think that he's a bad guy, as I see him more of an individual with mischievous intentions.

Cut from the same cloth as Flim and Flam - showponytaur, working the "marks". Probably based on Tony Robbins

[Partialgeek514 5,011]

I just rewatched this episode this morning, and even though some parts make me cringe, I have to say I still love this episode! Fluttershy makes so many cute faces in this one! (I guess she makes some freaky ones too, but meh ) Maybe I just like it because it's a Fluttershy episode. I do find it odd that Ponyville has so many jerks living there though. lolz

[bigbertha 414]

This is a really bad episode. The entire situation is extremely contrived with Fluttershy just so happening to bump into terrible ponies. And the message is pretty bad too, pushing most of the blame on Iron Will rather than Fluttershy, when Iron Will's advice wasn't that bad. And there's Rarity and Pinkie constantly calling Iron Will a monster before Fluttershy starts to take things too far. And Rarity seducing a guy to give her his food and the episode not treating that as wrong. This episode might just be the worst episode so far morally, which is a pretty large problem in a show like this.

The comedy isn't that good either. Fluttershy rarely leads to good comedy since she's so quiet and boring most of the time, but this episode proves that the opposite extreme is just as unfunny. Mean Fluttershy isn't exactly bad, but she's not funny. And Iron Will isn't funny either or even that fun to watch.

This episode is a mess. It's unfunny, teaches bad morals, and has a really contrived story.

Score: 0/10

[Rushing cash 836]

It was a "meh" episode. I mean the moral is not bad and it happens when someone shy tries forcefully to be assertive, it can end up by just being mean, it happened to me a few times so I took it personally and thats why I want to like this episode and it would have been a good one if the dialog was better and the moral not shoved down our throats.

5\10. An after thought ,is this the most we have seen pinkie and rarity spend time together in the first few seasons?

 

[bigbertha 414]

There are definitely problems here, but they aren't that major. Fluttershy's transition into mean Fluttershy is very rushed and she doesn't get the blame for what she becomes. Iron Will does deserve some of the blame since his lessons were too extreme, but he's not nearly as bad as the episode makes him out to be. The reason these problems aren't major is because there are so many other positives to distract from them.

Really, the first act is pretty solid. Fluttershy only meeting terrible ponies is a bit contrived, but it's not a deal breaker. And Rarity's manipulation of that guy is bad, but she does pay him for the asparagus so it's not the worst. Everything else is done well, establishing Fluttershy's problem and flowing very naturally. 

The mean Fluttershy scenes aren't as good because of the rushed transition, but mean Fluttershy is fun to watch and her going on that rant on Pinkie and Rarity is done really well. 

The third act is where the biggest problems come in, but even then Iron Will is still fun and there are some good gags. 

This is an Okay episode overall. The jokes and the fun of Iron Will keep me from disliking this episode, but there are too many issues to call this a good episode.

Score: 6/10