Funding MLP Forums, Part 1 - Subscriptions

[LowfatEnvelope 335]

Hmm i'm unsure which i would prefer. As i still haven't gotten around to donating yet (somepony slap me :| ) i feel like my comments shouldn't be taken as heavily. Anyway i think the donation option may work the best, as some people may want to donate, but may not (for some reason) wish to buy a subscription (even if it's a non-recurring one time thing) because the amount they would be willing to donate is less than the lowest subscription amount.

 

I.E. if you could and want to donate a dollar but the minimum subscription is five. Are flexible subscriptions possible where you pick your subscription amount? That way people could still essentially donate however much they want by using a one time subscription, or have a very low recurring subscription and then bump it up when they can.

(EDIT: Princess Mi Amore Cadenza actually suggested that and i didn't see it, woops! Sorry about that).

Edited May 14, 2012 by LowfatEnvelope

[Nas 2,873]

 

Just to clarify, NASCARFAN160, by "current structure", are you referring to the current donation tracker we use or the new system I proposed in the OP? FYI, in my proposal, the subscription system would completely replace the donations tracker.

 

By current, I meant the new subscription method. Wasn't thinking straight there :X

 

I kinda liked the progress of the donation tracker thingy, but this seems more efficient and user-friendly.

[Tom 891]

I believe we have a consensus, we go with subscriptions where the cost is determined by the user.

[Jokuc 8,173]

 

 

You don't have to, it will ask you if you want to renew your subscription. It won't automatically take money from you unless you want it to. Lets say it's basically like the current donation system but more sustainable.

 

Yeah I know I ment that since I want my donor status to remain, I would have to donate once a month and eaven though I have money for it, I wont be able to do it since my parents would never let me pay money to forum once a month eaven if it's my own money. And eaven if its for the same price as donating a bit more money but once. It's about the number of times I'll have to donate that's the problem for me, not how much money I'll donate Edited May 14, 2012 by Jokuc

[MrL0LZ 866]

I would love for this to happen, Mainly so I don't have to remind myself every month to donate.

[3005 332]

I suggested Teams, a store, services, and affiliate marketing in the other thread.

[Bunni 1,075]

I'd probably donate 20$ each month.. But sadly this month will be the last month of scholarship money.. No more income for toasty.. But I do plan on making a last donation until I start earning income ^^

[Twilight Sparkle ✨ 8,525]

Could you hook it up to a preexisting Google Adsense account? If so, I could also do this.

 

There's no way to directly share revenue from Google AdSense that I know of. However, once Google pays you out, could you not make a donation then?

 

Hmm i'm unsure which i would prefer. As i still haven't gotten around to donating yet (somepony slap me :| ) i feel like my comments shouldn't be taken as heavily. Anyway i think the donation option may work the best, as some people may want to donate, but may not (for some reason) wish to buy a subscription (even if it's a non-recurring one time thing) because the amount they would be willing to donate is less than the lowest subscription amount.

 

I.E. if you could and want to donate a dollar but the minimum subscription is five. Are flexible subscriptions possible where you pick your subscription amount? That way people could still essentially donate however much they want by using a one time subscription, or have a very low recurring subscription and then bump it up when they can.

(EDIT: Princess Mi Amore Cadenza actually suggested that and i didn't see it, woops! Sorry about that).

 

All comments are appreciated, whether you are a donor yourself or not. I don't see why donors should be the only ones to provide input on ways to fund the site.

 

If you donate just a dollar, PayPal will take almost all of it for themselves with their processing fees. That's why the minimum donation amount is $5 right now, and I don't plan to lower that because a very small part of the donor's money would actually reach me - it's not really fair to either of us. If you only have a dollar to spare, that dollar will go further if you buy yourself a chocolate bar than letting a few cents of it go towards our $xxx/monthly bill.

 

Aww but then I'll have to renew the sub every month by paying more and I dont think im able to do that.. I still want to keep the normal donation system..

 

Yeah I know I ment that since I want my donor status to remain, I would have to donate once a month and eaven though I have money for it, I wont be able to do it since my parents would never let me pay money to forum once a month eaven if it's my own money. And eaven if its for the same price as donating a bit more money but once. It's about the number of times I'll have to donate that's the problem for me, not how much money I'll donate

 

Jokuc, I could hook you up with a subscription billed every several months or even by the year, instead of by the month. Would that work for you?

 

I suggested Teams, a store, services, and affiliate marketing in the other thread.

 

And those suggestions have been noted down! As I said in the OP, this is the first of a series of threads to discuss several ideas for monetizing the site more effectively. The teams idea in particular that you mentioned is something that I find quite curious and unique, but it would unfortunately require heavy custom development so I've noted it as a possible future concept.

 

I already do some light affiliate marketing here (have you seen the link to buy The Friendship Express in the news ticker?), although I admit I've hardly been pushing it. There's definitely room to step it up.

[Ezynell 2,037]

There's no way to directly share revenue from Google AdSense that I know of. However, once Google pays you out, could you not make a donation then?

 

I don't have a credit card hooked up to it at the moment, but I'll see what I can do I only make about $20 a month from it, but I just started my channel 2 months ago, so I'm hoping to boost that up higher. Plus I really love the new server, I've already seen noticeable effects. Instead of the normal 30 seconds per uploading signature, it takes about 30 seconds to upload all 10.

[Twilight Sparkle ✨ 8,525]

I don't have a credit card hooked up to it at the moment, but I'll see what I can do I only make about $20 a month from it, but I just started my channel 2 months ago, so I'm hoping to boost that up higher. Plus I really love the new server, I've already seen noticeable effects. Instead of the normal 30 seconds per uploading signature, it takes about 30 seconds to upload all 10.

 

You hook up a bank account to AdSense, not a credit card. When you connect your AdSense account to your bank account, Google will automatically deposit your earnings once you reach $100. If you link a PayPal account to your bank account, you will then be able to use your money online via PayPal.

[Prince Lightning Da Cute 619]

It seems solid, but for those who just want to dump their money into the site it may be too high. Whereas before you could donate any amout and get the status and be done with it, now you have to donate on a monthly basis.

 

It would be easier to calculate funding and such. They would be able to get their status longer, but for those who may do it just for the status may want more as they donate on a higher tier.

[Zoop 8,384]

It seems solid, but for those who just want to dump their money into the site it may be too high. Whereas before you could donate any amout and get the status and be done with it, now you have to donate on a monthly basis.

No you don't.

 

You don't have to, it will ask you if you want to renew your subscription. It won't automatically take money from you unless you want it to. Lets say it's basically like the current donation system but more sustainable.

 

[Juju 16]

Yeah, that might be a good idea.

 

And yeah, what about MLPForums swag?

[AngryGamer432 155]

I like this but I wish I was able to donate. I would if I could

[Bohtty 1,775]

Doesn't matter as long as I can give you money :]

I think a clothing store would be nice, there are some online services that make them as they are purchased so you don't have to commit to anything. I'm looking to get maybe 3 mlp shirts and an mlp sweatshirt.

[Twiliscael 3,960]

Sounds good to me. Unfortunately I don't have any way to support the sitkeepso ads on

e so I guess I'll just keep the ads on.

[Ezynell 2,037]

You hook up a bank account to AdSense, not a credit card. When you connect your AdSense account to your bank account, Google will automatically deposit your earnings once you reach $100. If you link a PayPal account to your bank account, you will then be able to use your money online via PayPal.

 

Sent in the bank account information, but this is the final step I'm stuck on.

 

 

Meh, whatever, I'll get my parents to plug that in after finals (in 2 weeks), and if we implement the system before then, I could hook it up to my bank account, which has enough money to last in it.

Edited May 15, 2012 by Ezynell

[Whiteshade 1,426]

I see no problem with it, whatever pleases the rich must be beneficial to the rest of us.

 

Seriously though, keep both the systems, and also what another user said, a store of some sort could also serve as extra income.

 

Sounds good to me. Unfortunately I don't have any way to support the sitkeepso ads on

e so I guess I'll just keep the ads on.

 

Also this, minus the grammar and spelling errors Edited May 15, 2012 by Whiteshade

[Twilight Sparkle ✨ 8,525]

Sent in the bank account information, but this is the final step I'm stuck on.

 

 

Oh man, taxes. Yeah, you'll need to get past that screen to get your money. I didn't need to fill a W9 in because I'm in Canada, but you have to because you live in the same country as Google.

 

You will need a social insurance number, by the look of it. Other than that, the rest looks fairly self-explanatory. You might need to cooperate with a parent to get that filled in. Unfortunately, I'm not a tax advisor so my ability to help you out with that is extremely limited.

[Ezynell 2,037]

Oh man, taxes. Yeah, you'll need to get past that screen to get your money. I didn't need to fill a W9 in because I'm in Canada, but you have to because you live in the same country as Google.

 

You will need a social insurance number, by the look of it. Other than that, the rest looks fairly self-explanatory. You might need to cooperate with a parent to get that filled in. Unfortunately, I'm not a tax advisor so my ability to help you out with that is extremely limited.

 

Eeyup, the issue with that it looks like is that I use my own name for my bank account, but will have to use my parents name for the tax information, so if Google AdSense accounts check for similarity between them, I'll have to put my AdSense money into their bank account. This would mean they would be able to track all of my money use and I'd rather just have it coming from myself. Plus Google has an (American only, I think) 18+ regulation in order to have an AdSense account, which by bank account doesn't show, so that might be a problem too. I'm just hoping it doesn't dig through your information on multiple accounts and compare.

[Typhoid Libby 1,265]

Say hello to the other side of the fence.

Not paying for Forums, dozen in a five and takes only a minute to find a new one if I were so to desire.

Some even have the decency to use black BG. (I'd really like a black/dark theme, hint, hint, nudge, nudge.)

 

Subscriptions are solid and have worked for other sites in the past.

Tho, they offer something besides only a forum to those subscribing.

 

TBH, I care not as long it's not invasive.

Otherwise you will just end up with members-only-club and snobby Donors berating everyone for not donating.

And those will then be the only users.

Lemme guess, next the donors will get their own Donors only sub-forum to discuss snobby donor things?

#randomvector

 

Something, something, about living above your expenses.

400 a pop per months seems a bit excessive, is a only a forum after all. (Unless associated cost have gone up a bit lately.)

Why not look at things were you can save, rather than to look how you can get more money to pay for all the bells and whistles?

Adding stores and what-not is a nice idea, but will it even pay for itself?

Then you would need to add more ads all over the place to make that store support itself too.

Looks like a vicious cycle of escalating expenses.

Optimize.

Don't look for improvements and the ability to pay for them, look to remove the useless and redundant to lower the costs.

 

After all, what is more important, the community, or the fact that they have a top of the line forum with all the things that costs +1$ per day for each daily user?

 

Also;

C:forumutilbinComment.exe

[Shankveld 4,949]

My fiancee and I are paying for our wedding, so needless to say I don't have the money right now to support the site. Especially not a monthly donation. After the wedding, I'll try to make something happen.

But I do agree that $400 a month seems a little crazy o.o

What would 'subscribers' receive over other members?

I would hope no donors only sub-forums or snubbing would happen like Libertina mentioned.

~

[Zoop 8,384]

Regarding concerns about 'subscriber only' snobbery, as posted in the previous thread...

 

To be frank, all members already get a plethora of abilities and features that would be considered "premium" material on many other sites. Space for 250 PM's, unlimited attachment uploads (with a very generous per-file size limit), the option to have an ad-free experience, free access to every part of the site (I understand that some people simply aren't able to donate, and I don't believe in restricting any content from them because it), and three name changes per month (honestly, this is an extremely generous limit).

 

When we rule out donor-exclusive content, "premium" site features are something I also want to make available to everyone, so I'm honestly not sure what else I could add to the donor incentives to make it more enticing to give money for the site. Then again, people should be donating to maintain the site, not to get personal account upgrades, anyway.

[Twilight Sparkle ✨ 8,525]

Say hello to the other side of the fence.

Not paying for Forums, dozen in a five and takes only a minute to find a new one if I were so to desire.

Some even have the decency to use black BG. (I'd really like a black/dark theme, hint, hint, nudge, nudge.)

 

If you'd like an alternate theme, that's something to start a new feedback thread for. This thread is about discussing the addition of paid subscriptions to MLP Forums.

 

Subscriptions are solid and have worked for other sites in the past.

Tho, they offer something besides only a forum to those subscribing.

 

TBH, I care not as long it's not invasive.

Otherwise you will just end up with members-only-club and snobby Donors berating everyone for not donating.

And those will then be the only users.

Lemme guess, next the donors will get their own Donors only sub-forum to discuss snobby donor things?

 

My fiancee and I are paying for our wedding, so needless to say I don't have the money right now to support the site. Especially not a monthly donation. After the wedding, I'll try to make something happen.

But I do agree that $400 a month seems a little crazy o.o

What would 'subscribers' receive over other members?

I would hope no donors only sub-forums or snubbing would happen like Libertina mentioned.

~

 

To be frank, I've seen enough of this "donor snubbery" on the rest of the Internet to know it doesn't belong here, and I don't intend to segregate those who pay money to keep us online in any way. We've been accepting donations since October, and we haven't had a community split over donor status yet, so I see no reason it would begin now.

 

 

Something, something, about living above your expenses.

400 a pop per months seems a bit excessive, is a only a forum after all. (Unless associated cost have gone up a bit lately.)

Why not look at things were you can save, rather than to look how you can get more money to pay for all the bells and whistles?

Adding stores and what-not is a nice idea, but will it even pay for itself?

Then you would need to add more ads all over the place to make that store support itself too.

Looks like a vicious cycle of escalating expenses.

Optimize.

Don't look for improvements and the ability to pay for them, look to remove the useless and redundant to lower the costs.

 

After all, what is more important, the community, or the fact that they have a top of the line forum with all the things that costs +1$ per day for each daily user?

 

It's not only a forum - we also have two game servers, and a laundry list of additional expenses in addition to the server bills. We have a rock-solid core community here, but I'm also quite proud of the "top of the line" user experience that we have been able to offer until now.

 

"All the things that cost +1$ per day" truly are not essential to the community's existence, but having a shiny, lightning-fast forum goes a long way especially towards attracting new members, and makes the site a joy to use for its existing members.

 

If the only part of the site that mattered was the community itself, we could cut our expenses down to nil by dropping our game servers and relocating to a free "unlimited everything" forum host like ProBoards or something instead of running a self-hosted IP.Board installation with a ton of great mods and add-ons. Voila - MLP Forums will have no expenses. MLP Forums will also be a slow, ugly wreck of a site that will have an extremely hard time looking good to passersby.

 

We have been a "luxury forum" since day 1, and we will remain as such as long as we are able to pay for it. With our level of traffic, there is quite a lot of revenue potential, so I'm confident that we can keep our dedicated server and continue providing the user experience we do if we get a little more creative with our monetization than "throw some dosh in the donations bucket if you're feeling generous".

[Typhoid Libby 1,265]

Regarding concerns about 'subscriber only' snobbery, as posted in the previous thread...

 

Imma gonna keep bringing it up until humanity is dead when it's relevant.

It's the core feature of humanity to establish "Us" and "Them" if given the option.

Previous behaviour points money to be one of the deciding dividers in the past.

...but having a shiny, lightning-fast forum goes a long way especially towards attracting new members, and makes the site a joy to use for its existing members.

 

I thought it was about having a relevant topic to discuss and lurk.

Then again, maybe I'm used to less intuitive forums and people these days need to have all the bells and whistles to bother using forums.

For me basic functionality and good content is enough.

 

...MLP Forums will also be a slow, ugly wreck of a site that will have an extremely hard time looking good to passersby.

 

That's just the time and effort placed to the appearance that decides it and good hosting.

http://preparetodie.com/forums/

Fer example. Looks really nice and has been done with phpBB.

Best and shiniest forum software does not make it the prettiest, just the most modded and add-on-ish.

Appearance is not a feature of the software, it's completely relevant of the end-user modifications.

It's also not a "slow, ugly wreck" as you said it might be.

 

We have been a "luxury forum" since day 1, and we will remain as such as long as we are able to pay for it. With our level of traffic, there is quite a lot of revenue potential, so I'm confident that we can keep our dedicated server and continue providing the user experience we do if we get a little more creative with our monetization than "throw some dosh in the donations bucket if you're feeling generous".

 

Admirable, but I urge you to question what is feasible in the long run.

What is sustainable.

Bridges are not supported by potential steel.

Not to aim for the "best" regardless and base things on Maybe's and What if's of the future.

Constant service keeps people interested in the medium term, not constant changes to "better".

 

User experience is nearly entirely user created from what I can see.

Without providing users, there is no community to have experiences in.

Circular logic, but I see the user as more relevant than the environment in the end.

And users are adaptive.

 

Revenue potential is not hard factual revenue after all.

I'm fine even if you add amount of ads on le site but that's about what you will get out of me to increase your revenue.

Make them even not optional and I'm fine with it.

 

Best course would be to go bother really big forum Admins on how they solve this money sink problem, not the GI Poster.

Just start bothering them politely in PM's until you get an answer or a discussion.

All we, the GP can offer is maybe's, what if's, and unconfirmed rumours, those sources will have hard solutions that work and can be implemented.