S07:E09 - Honest Apple

[Jeric 46,851]

2 minutes ago, VG_Addict said:

Why would Rarity think Applejack would be a good fashion judge in the first place?

She wanted AJ's pragmatism, honesty, and her eye for functionality. Either that or Rarity was just looking for an excuse to have AJ near her. 

*Runs*

[Prospekt 11,018]

Not bad. Especially after watching it for the second time. The first time, I admittedly cringed a bit at Applejack's ridiculous lack of class and respect for the hard work being put in by the three aspiring fashion designers. But after a second viewing, I came to a sort of realization myself: these episodes in which a Mane 6 character must deal with the flaws of their specific element are great ways to prevent protagonists from appearing larger-than-life. Rarity Takes Manehattan did that for Rarity, Green Isn't Your Color did that for Fluttershy, etc.

Photo Finish and Hoity Toity were overdue for another appearance. I do wish Coco Pommel had made an appearance, but she did get a few mentions. The three contestants were alright. Lily Lace fits the somewhat overused yet always humorous trope of the valley girl, Starstreak reminds me of a less experienced Hoity Toity, and goth pone Inky Rose had a very unique character design that just hasn't been tried before on FiM as far as I can remember.

Rarity and Applejack have a beautiful dynamic, and they usually get to shine together like this once or twice a season. Look Before You Sleep was an early favorite on my very first run-through of the show a few years ago, and Simple Ways was hilarious. Almost every RariJack episode seems to be an upper-tier one. Can't really say this one was much different.

I'll give this one a 7.5/10. Not spectacular, but it's no "OMG this season is ruined!" moment either. Not too memorable, but not one I'm going to skip when I rewatch the season.

Oh, and Rarity shredding on a guitar was a cute meme-worthy moment.

I wonder, though... without the help of magic, how does a pony play a guitar? Hooves aren't all that dexterous...

[Jeric 46,851]

1 hour ago, Goat-kun said:

You've already answered your own question. It's not fashion. It's function.

Fashion is an art form with function. Architecture is an art form with function. Next I half expect you to start quoting Socrates and Plato on how art is derivative and devoid of truth. 

Tangential, but still relevant to those that are applying fashion in real life with Equestrian fashion. Equestria is a little unusual in that clothing is less necessary, so it takes on more of a 'art' angle than fashion for us humans. It isn't purely aesthetic like paintings, since hats and environmental clothing is needed at times, but it does sit a little closer to art. 

What Coco created was bizarre in both worlds though. 

[Mesme Rize 15,683]

30 minutes ago, VG_Addict said:

Also, Applejack was being flat-out rude in this episode. 

Maybe, but it helped the message of the story. AJ is supposed to be the most honest pony in town and sometimes the truth is very hurtful, but it needs to be said.

AJ dosen't understand this fashion stuff, so she just thinks that all these accessories are useless and rips them away.

In the end though, she learned that, while you can voice your opinion, you can do it more civilized, while Rarity also learned to accept her friends honesty.

[Castle Bleck 19,363]

17 minutes ago, Prospekt said:

I wonder, though... without the help of magic, how does a pony play a guitar? Hooves aren't all that dexterous...

 

Similar physics to Goombas' and VeggieTales characters' limited telekinesis, Rayman's ghost-like arms and legs, etc., methinks.

 

 

Edited May 14, 2017 by A.V.

[Will Guide 21,360]

2 minutes ago, Mesme Rize said:

Maybe, but it helped the message of the story. AJ is supposed to be the most honest pony in town and sometimes the truth is very hurtful, but it needs to be said.

AJ dosen't understand this fashion stuff, so she just thinks that all these accessories are useless and rips them away.

In the end though, she learned that, while you can voice your opinion, you can do it more civilized, while Rarity also learned to accept her friends honesty.

Exactly, a fine example of the trope, Brutal Honesty 

[Goat-kun 2,527]

1 hour ago, Ganondox said:

I think the point you're missing is that function IS important, and that's why Rarity chose Applejack, but she went WAY too far, and started criticizing everything she didn't like even if they had only minimal impact on function.  

I understand your concern. AJ did go too far since she didn't quite understand the purpose of said event. However, the only function those clothes need to fulfill is that one can comfortably move in them. They were made to be worn out of want not out of need.

31 minutes ago, Jeric said:

Fashion is an art form with function. Architecture is an art form with function. Next I half expect you to start quoting Socrates and Plato on how art is derivative and devoid of truth. 

Tangential, but still relevant to those that are applying fashion in real life with Equestrian fashion. Equestria is a little unusual in that clothing is less necessary, so it takes on more of a 'art' angle than fashion for us humans. It isn't purely aesthetic like paintings, since hats and environmental clothing is needed at times, but it does sit a little closer to art. 

What Coco created was bizarre in both worlds though. 

I have already stated that I am not bothered by the matrimony of art and function. And no, architecture is so much more than an art form with function. Though, you are right in regards to most Equestrian clothes and accessories we've seen so far. So would you consider clothing in Equestria to be in the same category as fancy carriages and jewelry?

1 hour ago, Dark Qiviut said:

Snip

Yes, all these clothes serve such a noble purpose indeed. Can you define it? Is one's expression of self the only "function" important in regards to clothing?  We both know that isn't true. Sometimes, well, a lot of times, one must forsake one's culture and yield to the elements or to the purpose one needs to fulfill.

[Dark Qiviut 22,424]

1 hour ago, Ganondox said:

Just noticed some fridge brilliance in this episode: Applejack complaining about the clothes being all black IS a practical complaint, because that would get really hot in the sun really fast. 

If you're talking about Inky's dress, the fridge brilliance trope may function better had she state that too much black could make the wearer sweat.

Quote

Starstreak: I'm not interested in what's already been done. Only what will exist…in the future! *shows concept art*

For one, nobody can ever predict what will actually exist in the future. The future is forever an unknown. And Starstreak is going after what's nothing more than a hope for a possible trend, something no one can accurately predict. He's playing a game of chance.

His whole vision feels like a parody (heck, the panel in total feels like one), but the jokes don't land at all.

And Applejack's bluntness in response to all three (including the "singing birds") comes across as completely clueless about what makes fashion good.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Dark Qiviut

[Truffles 2,033]

2 hours ago, Ganondox said:

Considering with last episode we got an example of where to go with a mutual romantic relationship, this is a good place for showing people what to do when it's unrequited. Really something that's important to be teaching people nowadays. 

It was kind of interesting when I heard about the scenes of Big Mac coming on too strong (and in all the wrong ways) with Sugar Belle. I was thinking he could take what he learned in that episode and sit down with Spike to try and straighten him out as well. Though the other thought  that crossed my mind with Big Mac's kissing attempt was Spike almost accidentally kissing AJ back in season one in the same way while his Sir Spike fantasy played out. XD

 

5 hours ago, MegaSean45 said:

A more of a reason for Spike to finally move on. I'm glad they're not just dropping the scenario, but he's gotta move on at some point. Season 8, I'm pretty sure this crush is going to be a thing in the past! The only reason it's still around is because the characters shouldn't change too much personality-wise before the movie.

I envy your optimism that they'll deal with it head on and finally put it to rest, but I can't get there myself since I keep saying the same thing every season and by the end there's still evidence he's pining away for her without any resolution.

[Dark Qiviut 22,424]

Quote

AJ: Are you puttin' holes in the clothes? On purpose?

Uh, yeah, and some ponies put holes in them. Holes are made through sewing the clothes together. Our belts have holes. Sometimes, we wear shirts and suits with buttons, which requires intentional holes.

Hell, your damn hat has a hole in the middle

So, yeah, it's practical.

Quote

Inky: It's to create a distressed look.

AJ: More like an old and tattered look.

What the fuck, Applejack?!

[Jeric 46,851]

3 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

What the fuck, Applejack?!

She doesn't trust holes. Like Trixie doesn't trust wheels. 

 

[Dark Qiviut 22,424]

Just now, Jeric said:

She doesn't trust holes. Like Trixie doesn't trust wheels. 

 

Well, if she don't trust holes, she won't like an old-fashioned NYC bagel anytime soon.

[Thrond 3,263]

I found this really formulaic, and I didn't like the ending. The moral is fine, but I feel like Rarity deserved a lot of the blame for Applejack's rudeness as well. I didn't like how much AJ's rudeness was cranked up, but RariJack episodes don't happen without exaggerating the differences between the two, so whatever. I was never gonna like this. Ignore me.

I can comment on that ending, though, and I expanded on my thoughts at my blog. Offsite; onsite. 

Still better than the previous episode, though. 

Additional thoughts:

Only a RariJack shipper could watch an episode where a character outright insults another's career and think "yup, perfect relationship material." It's still a crackship to me. There's always a couple ship-y moments, but even if they do get together, I can only imagine it ending in tears.

Honestly, I don't even know why these two spend time with each other. It never goes well for them and they fundamentally don't understand each other. Fine, they make up at the end, but their episodes are always, always, always like this. Why do I even bother watching them? 

Also, I thought this was up to something different at first, so I kinda liked it until I realized that it had no tricks up its sleeve. I want to like these episodes, and I do like "Sisterhooves Social" and "Trade Ya!," but I just hate how these two are always at odds with each other. 

Edited May 15, 2017 by AlexanderThrond

[Dark Qiviut 22,424]

*LMAO @ Rarity's guitar riff*

Okay, THAT is funny.

Pinkie's mane helps, too.

Edited May 15, 2017 by Dark Qiviut

[Nerdy Luigi 2,065]

In my opinion, this episode was mediocre for me...

Pros: Pinkie was done well, I didn't find AJ to be a jerk at all, until the part about Strawberries..., SvFE style humor with Rarity's metal

Cons: Liked none of the designers, Rarity CAUSED the problem... She never apologized for it..., Still can't stand Photo Finish or Hoity Toity

 

I give this episode a 6/10.    

[Dark Qiviut 22,424]

Quote

Lily: I attached each feather individually. Ha! It took me literally forever. *puts hat on mannequin*

Hoity: Ohhhh, you used hoof-crossed, double-over stitches! *chuckle* They're perfect.

AJ: Who cares if it's stitched perfectly! You don't need feathers on your head! *grabs it and shakes it off to everyone's horror, revealing the bland hat*

WHAT THE FUCK?!!!!!!

Lily worked OVERNIGHT to stylize that damn hat from a bland, white piece of fabric to an interesting, complex piece of design. And in a few seconds, all that hard work gone! That's not being Honestyjack anymore. That's being an asshole! Applejack may not have the best manners or most polite language, but why the hell would she want to DESTROY someone's hard work?! I don't care what reason she has. This isn't Applejack. It's a complete bastardization of her!

Excuse me while I go get Advil…

Quote

AJ: NO! There is no choice! *slams hoof down* They're the exact same belt! This is so silly! Fashion. Is. Ridiculous!

On second thought, give me some fried Applejack to go on a bagel.

[Jeric 46,851]

15 minutes ago, Squirrel Luigi said:

Cons: Liked none of the designers, Rarity CAUSED the problem... She never apologized for it..., Still can't stand Photo Finish or Hoity Toity

Rarity most certainly didn't if you consider in universe logic. Applejack has shown that she can be tactful before with her honesty, which is what Rarity expected. As someone who has put people I trust in positions of power based on their past history only to see them fuck it up for themselves and others, that ain't the promoters fault. 

AJ's line about fashion that set everyone off was simply not something that she would normally say. And she prizes hard work in general so her undoing it with the feather hat makes little sense.

I actually liked the episode more than you, but Rarity's only error was in her communication of the judges to one another. But in Equestria these things tend to be slapped together relatively quickly and will less planning than we are used to. Pony culture ..  what can you do, right?

[Thrond 3,263]

Also, I found Pinkie pretty superfluous in this. She was easily the funniest part, but I have no idea why she was there at all. 

1 minute ago, Jeric said:

Rarity most certainly didn't if you consider in universe logic. Applejack has shown that she can be tactful before with her honesty, which is what Rarity expected. As someone who has put people I trust in positions of power based on their past history only to see them fuck it up for themselves and others, that ain't the promoters fault. 

AJ's line about fashion that set everyone off was simply not something that she would normally say. And she prizes hard work in general so her undoing it makes little sense.

I actually liked the episode more than you, but Rarity's only error was in her communication of the judges to one another. But in Equestria these things tend to be slapped together relatively quickly and will less planning than we are used to. 

 

 

But Rarity should have stopped her earlier. She appeared quite uncomfortable with how Applejack was running at the mouth, and yet refused to tell her to tone it down. I know she expected AJ to be more reasonable (and it feels pretty forced that AJ wasn't), but she was encouraging Applejack to let down her filter and didn't bother stopping her when she knew it might be an issue. Can you blame Applejack for thinking that's what Rarity wanted from her? And that's ignoring the question of whether Rarity was correct to think AJ had anything to contribute in the first place. AJ awarding all three designers because of their hard work only makes me feel more like she had nothing meaningful to offer. 

[Nerdy Luigi 2,065]

Just now, Jeric said:

Rarity most certainly didn't if you consider in universe logic. Applejack has shown that she can be tactful before with her honesty, which is what Rarity expected. As someone who has put people I trust in positions of power based on their past history only to see them fuck it up for themselves and others, that ain't the promoters fault. 

AJ's line about fashion that set everyone off was simply not something that she would normally say. And she prizes hard work in general so her undoing it makes little sense.

I actually liked the episode more than you, but Rarity's only error was in her communication of the judges to one another. But in Equestria these things tend to be slapped together relatively quickly and will less planning than we are used to. 

I respectfully and totally disagree, for the reason that Applejack herself stated in the episode: She has no experience with fashion. It makes no sense at all to me why you'd make somebody that cares as little about fashion as Applejack a judge for a Fashion-related contest. The reason didn't even make that much sense to me anyways. Yet again, MLP doesn't always make sense... Also, to be fair Applejack accepted the invitation to do something she shouldn't have done in the first place. 

Sure she does get a little hypocritical, but she's also too practical to like things like 100s of buttons on one dress, a dress with an extraordinarily distasteful amount of holes, and somepony dressed like a Disco Ball... It honestly feels in-character to me for her to criticize that. To be honest, if she didn't complain, I would have actually ended up considering Applejack to be out of character in the episode, because that would be the case from what I know of Applejack's tastes and extreme honesty (except in a few circumstances, and I consider those to be out of character as well. One of my few gripes with Party of One).

I was tempted to rate the episode lower than I did, but I think Pinkie Pie really saved it from a potential 5/10.

 

 

 

[SugarCoatxMarblePie 701]

9 hours ago, AkuStarburstLyraFries said:

This one was a bit hard to like for me. I guess it was alright or maybe even good, but Applejack being "honest" in such a jerky fashion was really off-putting. Especially when she shook apart that one mare's hat which took some amount of hours of work which I don't remember. :/

 

*Reaches into the virtual toy box to find a fitting Aku meme.*

Here we are.

Well, Rarity practically said it was her job to do that, so she took it more seriously, and didn't catch onto what Rarity actually meant.

[ManaMinori 4,145]

Maybe AJ is a little TOO practical.

I really liked Inky Rose

oh, by the way, she has a fanclub

 

[Dark Qiviut 22,424]

14 minutes ago, Squirrel Luigi said:

Sure she does get a little hypocritical, but she's also too practical to like things like 100s of buttons on one dress, a dress with an extraordinarily distasteful amount of holes, and somepony dressed like a Disco Ball... It honestly feels in-character to me for her to criticize that. To be honest, if she didn't complain, I would have actually ended up considering Applejack to be out of character in the episode, because that would be the case from what I know of Applejack's tastes and extreme honesty (except in a few circumstances, and I consider those to be out of character as well. One of my few gripes with Party of One).

Her comment about a pony being dressed in a disco ball makes sense. She was blunt and had reason to.

The rest of her comments and actions, however, are very out of character. Not for what she feels, but how. Applejack wasn't being honest or blunt and instead acted like a complete and utter ass to everyone there. She wasn't merely critiquing their designs anymore. She was bashing them and treating their whole work like it was point. The fact that she completely destroyed Lily's pattern after working overnight to put it together and not give a damn about her feelings is beyond anything she'd do.

[ManaMinori 4,145]

50 minutes ago, Dark Qiviut said:

WHAT THE FUCK?!!!!!!

Lily worked OVERNIGHT to stylize that damn hat from a bland, white piece of fabric to an interesting, complex piece of design. And in a few seconds, all that hard work gone! That's not being Honestyjack anymore. That's being an asshole! Applejack may not have the best manners or most polite language, but why the hell would she want to DESTROY someone's hard work?! I don't care what reason she has. This isn't Applejack. It's a complete bastardization of her!

Excuse me while I go get Advil…

On second thought, give me some fried Applejack to go on a bagel.

I completely agree. AJ was truly at her worst. If she thought fashion was ridiculous, then she never should've signed on to be a judge for fashion. I hate her attitude here, and by now, she should've known better that being honest doesn't mean being a steaming hot twat. There is no excuse.

[Jeric 46,851]

1 hour ago, AlexanderThrond said:

Also, I found Pinkie pretty superfluous in this. She was easily the funniest part, but I have no idea why she was there at all. 

But Rarity should have stopped her earlier. She appeared quite uncomfortable with how Applejack was running at the mouth, and yet refused to tell her to tone it down. I know she expected AJ to be more reasonable (and it feels pretty forced that AJ wasn't), but she was encouraging Applejack to let down her filter and didn't bother stopping her when she knew it might be an issue. Can you blame Applejack for thinking that's what Rarity wanted from her? And that's ignoring the question of whether Rarity was correct to think AJ had anything to contribute in the first place. AJ awarding all three designers because of their hard work only makes me feel more like she had nothing meaningful to offer. 

Valid point. I did notice Rarity actually did try at one point to reign her in with a visual cue waving her hoof and gesturing with her eyes, but Applejack didn't see it. So the intent was there if not a full effort. 

[Megas 27,653]

The biggest problem with this episode is that it pretty much required at least one of the focus characters to be set up for failure right from the beginning. Not to mention, being blunt and tactless is usually something we'd expect from RD rather than AJ, and the moral seems to set itself up more for a character like her than AJ(there's a difference between an honest opinion and being a jerk). In fact, the more I think about it, the more I feel like this episode was made more for RD than AJ, but for some reason they decided to change it to AJ

It also suffers from a similar problem we had from 28 Pranks Later, in that this is entirely Rarity's fault. She brought in someone who is very much not a fashionable person, quite the opposite in fact so she's not gonna understand how much about how fashion works

Edited May 15, 2017 by Whompy Whomperson