Nightmare Moon and Season 4 [Spoilers]

[Jack Spades 162]

I hope so. All of us can agree. Luna rocks. Celestia socks. That didn't make sense but just roll with it. okay? Luna rules. Luna rules.

[Casy 238]

I think ...as you said... maybe she will be jealous of twilight ... because of attention of everyone to her... she is new princess and so on... and Luna will turn back into nighmare moon... i dont know but i CANT WAIT TO FIND OUT

Edited August 30, 2013 by Casy

[Fhaolan 4,468]

Spoilered for those who haven't seen the animatic yet.

 

 

 

 

If you actually watch the animatic, the full scene appears to be with some form of dream/memory sequence with Twilight taking the place of Celestia a thousand years ago. The way Luna talks, it sounds like she's ranting at Celestia right before she turns into Nightmare Moon.

 

 

 

[Scootalove 10,684]

Apparently I think that Luna is planning a rebellion because, she feels that she is less important and that Celestia does not deserve to rule Equestria. Instead, Luna takes it upon herself to make sure that Twilight does not get in the way of it.

[Jadefire 2,796]

Spoilered because spoilers.

 

As of right now, it's completely unknown. Luna could be being impersonated, corrupted again, possessed, or as other people have said, it's a flashback to a thousand years ago.

 

 

All we know for sure is that it's going to be really interesting.

[Kyoshi Frost Wolf 40,474]

Here is my view from the animatics:

 

It is obviously some kind of flashback. It could not be anything else. Luna is talking to Twilight as if she were talking to someone else and the line 'Bask in your glorious light' makes no sense for Twilight and it even confused Twilight herself, as indicated by her reaction to that line. So, it is obviously a flashback thing, perhaps to test Twilight further.

 

 

So that is my view. Having Luna be corrupted again would be kinda dumb. Having her be jealous would be INCREDIBLY stupid at this point. It has been done already and it would just set the character back A LOT in terms of real development.

 

Given all of these circumstances, it is highly unlikely that she is planning some 'rebellion'.

Edited August 30, 2013 by Kyoshi

[Fhaolan 4,468]

 

Given all of these circumstances, it is highly unlikely that she is planning some 'rebellion'.

 

Mind you, we have no context for the scene whatsoever. For all we know the framing device is the return of something *like* Nightmare Moon, and Twilight is trying to find out what's going on.

[~StatesTheOblivious~ 1,795]

A rebellion?

 

Like others already said, it is rather unlikely that it really happens. Not just because of the interpretation of the scene from the SDCC panel.

 

I have another reason. No matter in what context, it would just make some parts of this popular fanon here canon in some way, I think.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think the writers would try to avoid that.

[Mars Caramel 319]

Meghan McCarthy said something along the lines of the first 2 episodes of season 4 being part of a 3-part story with the season 3 finale. This could be an interesting plot possibility.

 

I hope so. All of us can agree. Luna rocks. Celestia socks. That didn't make sense but just roll with it. okay? Luna rules. Luna rules.

 

But... but... why would you say that? Celestia is awesome!

[Forlong 1,725]

LOL.  Nope.

 

 

The scene in question seems to be a memory of Celestia's experience 1,000 years ago.  It was either brought on by Luna herself to prepare Twilight for something.  Or maybe Discord has decided to have some fun with the new princess.

 

[Winona the Dog 1,981]

I seriously doubt Luna would be feeling jealous at this point. Luna Eclipsed and Sleepless in Ponyville proved that a lot of ponies really do appreciate her and her night. Her being corrupted again would render both episodes useless.

 

My money is on the fact that the whole thing was a memory relapse.

[Kyoshi Frost Wolf 40,474]

Mind you, we have no context for the scene whatsoever. For all we know the framing device is the return of something *like* Nightmare Moon, and Twilight is trying to find out what's going on.

I am just going by what we have seen upfront so far, which highly points to what I posted in my spoiler. Anything beyond that is speculation. If it is the case, we don't know the cause or reason, my 'To test Twilight' part was speculation. There is a lot we still don't know, obviously. Hence why I am very eager for the premiere so we can have the answers.

[True Rarity 1,239]

Thank you for everypony's input!

 

As some of you have said, it could be a flashback. I never took that into account before, and I hope you're right. But if this is before she turns into Nightmare Moon, why did she refer to herself as "me" instead of "us"?

[hawkflame 3,310]

Thank you for everypony's input!

 

As some of you have said, it could be a flashback. I never took that into account before, and I hope you're right. But if this is before she turns into Nightmare Moon, why did she refer to herself as "me" instead of "us"?

I think she only used the royal "we" in dealing with her subjects, and she just dropped the formality when talking to her sister. The clip clearly shows Twilight experiencing that day from Celestias perspective. Watch the clip carefully, it's less like Luna is talking to Twilight, and more like she's talking to Celestia but with Twilight standing in her place.

[idonotreallycare 94]

As far as we know, she's not. 

 

 

The part with Luna in the animatic takes place 1000 years in the past, in Celestia's memories. As other members have pointed out, this is probably to prepare Twilight for something. This could, of course, have to do with present-day Luna, but probably not.

 

[TheSupremeLeaderOfChaos 1,190]

I'm putting my answer in spoilers for those who have not seen the animatic.

 

 

In the flashback, it seems rather clear that Twilight is witnessing a flashback. Why? I'll prove it.

 

• Luna does not appear to hear Twilight and never actually responds directly to her questions.
• Luna specifically says "bask in your precious light". Who represents light? CELESTIA
• "There can only be one princess in Equestria, and that princess WILL BE ME!" ... Luna, if you aren't a flashback, then you should be aware that even if you get rid of Twilight, there are still two other princesses, Celestia and Cadence. So that line wouldn't make sense unless it was a flashback to the time where there were only two princesses.
• Luna's expression when she is beginning to transform into NMM is clearly surprise and fear, showing that this has never happened before and that she is severely concerned about this turn of events.

Do you really need more proof?

 

From my own personal opinion, I do hope that it is a flashback, as Luna is reformed, and we need more backstory anyway, and this would make for an awesome backstory episode.

 

[Jokuc 8,172]

Well I would say no. Luna is happy now once she feels she is loved by her sister. I don't think she would ever try or want something like that.

 

 

 

And as everypony already has said, I don't think that video was something that happened at that moment. As pretty much everypony says, I think it's some sort of flashback or possibly time travel. Maybe dream.

 

 

[Dzastur 1,719]

 

The animatic scene happens inside the Castle of the Royal Pony Sisters. It looks to be in good shape before Luna goes all Nightmare Moon on it. We know that, in present-day Equestria, it's in ruins inside Everfree Forest. So, not only does this scene look to take place in the past, it seems to show how the castle got ruined in the first place.

 

Extra tidbit: if you look at the map of Equestria included in The Elements of Harmony book, the ruins are depicted to be in the dead center of all of Equestria. Also in the book, Lauren Faust makes a point of mentioning it as being a pretty special place.

 

[Castle Bleck 19,206]

Celestia-related flashback? WIN!!!

 

Planned test of character for Twilight? Eh, why not?

 

Indeed a present-day planned rebellion?  Dear Luna's Character Development:

 

Edited August 30, 2013 by Anti-Villain

[Super Derpy 535]

Just like a lot of people have said this is a flashback to 1,000 years ago. I think Celestia is showing Twilight exactly what happened so she will know what's going on. And John Mellenclop brought up something that I didn't realize was true until I went back and watched it again. The setting does indeed appear The Castle of The Royal Pony Sisters, which in present day Equestria is a ruin.

[RiseofSpectrum 359]

Remember when Chrysalis took on Celestia and won? Clearly Celestia's not as powerful as she was in the days of yore, which again adds to why she handed over the Elements of Harmony to the Mane 6. If Chrys could defeat her, then a re-awakened Nightmare Moon could as well, with perhaps more power than before, who knows? There's a saying: What doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Technically, NMM wasn't killed, she was merely sapped of her powers and her grip on Luna, but that doesn't prevent her return anytime soon.

 

Bah, Celestia, Celestia. Someday, we'll be able to see a flashback from you in your prime. She's clearly weaker than a thousand years ago. Twilight would defeat her mid-dif. Hell, even Cadence could beat Celestia high-dif.

[Anadu Kune 668]

Bah, Celestia, Celestia. Someday, we'll be able to see a flashback from you in your prime. She's clearly weaker than a thousand years ago. Twilight would defeat her mid-dif. Hell, even Cadence could beat Celestia high-dif.

How is it clear that she is weaker? Really there doesn't seem to be much of an indication of what the limits of her powers are. All we know is this. She cant defeat Discord by herself or without the aid of the elements. This isn't helpful as Discord is god like in his powers, reality is his plaything. She was defeated by Queen Chrysalis. That isn't really a helpful limiting factor either. Chrysalis was hyped up on love magic and we don't know the love to magic exchange rate. Considering the power of the crystal heart it seems love is a force that potentially rivals that of the elements of harmony. Not only that but we have no way of knowing what the force was behind those magical beams they were throwing around. For all we know that could have been the magical equivalent of a condensed nuclear blast. We also know Sombra while defeated had magic that Celestia nor Luna could stop.

 

All we know for sure is that Celestia can be defeated by other beings. We know that she did wield the elements before so in that sense she was more powerful but in the normal sense she probably really hasn't changed that much. Of course that could change in season 4.

[TailsIsNotAlone 3,694]

It was a flashback, either a vision Celestia is showing Twilight. Or it could be Luna inducing a dream to show Twi how she became NM. 

 

But I believe NM was Luna, just a side of herself she had bottled up and kept hidden until it finally burst out. And I've always been curious about her, so I would like to see her come back.

[BluntySrBlunt 4]

I did not watch that video but I would hope that Nightmare Moon does not return. I think it is not necessary. I am hopeful that it is a mere flashback scene that is referenced in that video. As others have said, don’t take friendship for granted.

 

THIS 

 

 

 Anyways...

 

I think it was all just a flashback where Twilight saw the NMM event in Celestia's eyes, my reasons being :

 

1. Twilight asks "Where am I?" this is not the Canterlot Castle she knows, but the "Old castle of the royal pony sisters" aka the one in the Everfree forest, which was wrecked by NMM 1000 years ago.

 

2. Twilight asks "Why did you and Celestia dissapear?" to which Luna ignores and continues the whole "Precious Light" thing. (Don't feel like quoting the whole video). As far as we know Twilight doesn't control anything light related.

 

Reasons why I think this might not be a flashback:

 

1. From the video, Luna raises the Moon in front of the sun, while in the original tale "She refused to lower the moon to make way for the dawn," meaning it was already night as opposed to the "eclipse" we saw. Unless the writers have the whole History is written by victors thing going on. It was regarded as an old mare's tale so, the storybook interpretations of the events could be wrong.

 

2. Luna doesn't have her pastel collared mane, but instead her starry astral starry one. The scene from The Crystal Empire" does take care of this issue though. Pastel Luna was a "de-powered" version of herself. Out of show, the writers just wanted her to resemble Celestia though and it does scream Princess of the Night, more now.

 

I really hope this is a flashback though. Luna even said "The elements to away our dark powers," so for her to backstep and become NMM again would just ruin all of that. Especially after the "friendship" between her and Twilight.

 

If it flashback it could have something to do with her ascension to becoming a princess (Don't ask me how I'm still wondering like the rest of you)

 

If it isn't Luna lost all character development she gained and is reverting back to her old ways.

 

And just when I started to like her...   

 

Time will tell...

 

Just my two cents. 

 

Edited September 1, 2013 by BluntySrBlunt

[Castle Bleck 19,206]

How is it clear that she is weaker? Really there doesn't seem to be much of an indication of what the limits of her powers are. All we know is this. She cant defeat Discord by herself or without the aid of the elements. This isn't helpful as Discord is god like in his powers, reality is his plaything. She was defeated by Queen Chrysalis. That isn't really a helpful limiting factor either. Chrysalis was hyped up on love magic and we don't know the love to magic exchange rate. Considering the power of the crystal heart it seems love is a force that potentially rivals that of the elements of harmony. Not only that but we have no way of knowing what the force was behind those magical beams they were throwing around. For all we know that could have been the magical equivalent of a condensed nuclear blast. We also know Sombra while defeated had magic that Celestia nor Luna could stop.

 

All we know for sure is that Celestia can be defeated by other beings. We know that she did wield the elements before so in that sense she was more powerful but in the normal sense she probably really hasn't changed that much. Of course that could change in season 4.

 

Celestia WAS, however, both immune to and effortlessly able to break Twilight's "Want It, Need It" spell over ALL of Ponyville, as well as able to enchant the Elements Of Harmony directly so Discord could no longer just teleport them away (with the latter moment arguably redeeming Celestia from getting 'The Worf Effect' from Chrysalis).

 

Of course, as far as alicorns go, we've DEFINITELY seen Cadance doing the most work; she's like the Legolas of MLP: FIM, and thus should have THIS as her theme song: