SunshineFlow

Do you believe in heaven and hell?

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(edited)

Also would this be a fitting sad joyful song when you die? Its sad... but.

Yeah i am just wondering how you feel about it. I just try not to think about it. Be good to people and do my best. I try not even to argue too much online, because i know hate or envy is just wrong and i do my best to try to live as each day is something i can do something for the better. Or live that way.

But in terms of your views, how do you cope with it? I was sort of thinking about it when i was watching Area 88 Anime from 1985 in terms of what it means to be a human. But when it comes to reality i just try to deal the best way i can and work with people and be friendly that way.

 
Edited by SunshineFlow

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(edited)

Quite frankly, I don't believe in either.

You only live once. You've been given a unique gift: Life. Experience it to your fullest. I am far too busy enjoying life than I am worried about dying.

I want to be young and carefree. Middleaged and somewhat rich. Old and having fun at other people's expense by pretending I have Alzheimers and/or are deaf.

Edited by Yakamaru

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(edited)

I do not, because neither of them make sense to me.

The only sort of afterlife I could see is maybe a transfer of consciousness to some alternate universe, but I'm on the fence about that sort of thing.

Edited by Barik the Luigineer

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I don't believe in any of them. I think that these places simply aren't exist. By the way - it's a very pity!

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(edited)

The people at my funeral would be confused by such a song.

 

And I don't believe in the human ideas of heaven or hell its not likely (polite way of saying impossible). But through technicality and great unknowns there might be something. Either way we won't know right. And its a scary topic for me. Why would I want to die, and its going to happen anyways.

 

That's like being forced into a dark room after getting a lobotomy that was also forced.

Edited by SugarCoatxMarblePie

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I want there to be a heaven and I want the requirements to be easy. I also want it to be personalized to me, not made in the idea of someone else's.

 

Believe is too strong a word. Hope is more along the lines of how I feel about it.

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I do not. Scientific research has shown that the consciousness is a process created by the interacting of chemicals in the brain. When the brain ceases to function, so does the consciousness.

Heaven and Hell is a very implausible idea of an afterlife to begin with, in great part because the mythology of Christianity is... Well, since this not in the debate section, I'll just bite my tongue here. =P

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I do believe in heaven and hell. But i do not believe in Jesus. I know he is real. but i simply have some trouble with rules and all. ( in the past i was a strong believer in Jesus).

 

 

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To me, both the concepts of heaven and hell are terrible ones. Heaven, you get eternal life, but you get to know how much Earth is suffering while having that life. Doesn't sound great to me. Then there is hell, just a place of eternal torment. Or as I like to call it, pure garbage.

So I obviously don't believe in either of them. I see them as a product of human imagination and fear.

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(edited)

I have a problem with why God lefts human suffer. He loved his creation so much that he lets Adam and Eve have a dozens of generations that will have sufferings and diseases and illnesses. I just can't believe a loving God wouldn't be prepared and put some shield away from his evil rebelious forces so that they would be as he designed them, good. Like i believe in being good, but to be judged for something he made.. i dont know.

Edited by SunshineFlow

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1 hour ago, Discordian said:

I want there to be a heaven and I want the requirements to be easy. I also want it to be personalized to me, not made in the idea of someone else's.

 

Believe is too strong a word. Hope is more along the lines of how I feel about it.

I don't like to believe because we are holding on ideas that chances are, aren't true. I also prefer the idea of a personalized heaven, like living in Equestria, or getting to look for koopas and kick their asses 24/7 :dash: . I mean, sounds like fun :lol: . But we have to see what holds for us after our passing, if anything at all

37 minutes ago, SunshineFlow said:

I have a problem with why God lefts human suffer. He loved his creation so much that he lets Adam and Eve have a dozens of generations that will have sufferings and diseases and illnesses. I just can't believe a loving God wouldn't be prepared and put some shield away from his evil rebelious forces so that they would be as he designed them, good. Like i believe in being good, but to be judged for something he made.. i dont know.

That's one of the main reasons I've became agnostic. So much stuff is archaic and clearly made under the views of men way times of yore. 

 

I like the ideas of heaven and hell, though I won't assume they do exist. Plus, other than hell, I think the idea of heaven, at least under the classic idea, isn't exiting either

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No, I don't believe in any form of afterlife. I think heaven and hell are just made up by humans, like any other mythical places.

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Not really, I used to but then I dropped my religion. It's a nice idea and I would love it to be true but I very much doubt it is. 

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10 hours ago, SunshineFlow said:

I have a problem with why God lefts human suffer. He loved his creation so much that he lets Adam and Eve have a dozens of generations that will have sufferings and diseases and illnesses. I just can't believe a loving God wouldn't be prepared and put some shield away from his evil rebelious forces so that they would be as he designed them, good. Like i believe in being good, but to be judged for something he made.. i dont know.

God gives humans free will and very specific instructions of how to use it for the ultimate happiness of themselves and others while strengthening us against temptations and weakness. It's not always easy, but life on this earth is a classroom designed to teach us to overcome adversity and strengthen the spirit. Having free will, we as humans make a lot of our own sufferings (and often put the blame somewhere else). There is suffering in the world, but just imagine how much of it would be alleviated if we listened to what God asks and 'do unto others'? If we all chipped in and gave more of our time, expertise and resources there would be a lot less hardship. 

As far as Heaven and Hell, I believe there is both. But I firmly believe that everyone goes to Heaven (that wishes to, although I can't imagine anyone not wanting to). I believe that Hell is a place where evil dwells but not as a place that people are sent to as a punishment. God is all love and forgiveness and wants us to return to Heaven after this earthly life, which is too short and fleeting to bring about an eternal punishment in Hell. I think the only real 'hell' that anyone would have to endure is the one we make for ourselves in the form of the mistakes and resulting regret of our actions on this earth. When we bring our worldly experiences into the next life, we'll look back and see the bad things we did and carry that with us until we can forgive ourselves. So in that respect, eternal punishment' is from the baggage we bring with us.  

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(edited)
3 hours ago, Dreambiscuit said:

God gives humans free will and very specific instructions of how to use it for the ultimate happiness of themselves and others while strengthening us against temptations and weakness. It's not always easy, but life on this earth is a classroom designed to teach us to overcome adversity and strengthen the spirit. Having free will, we as humans make a lot of our own sufferings (and often put the blame somewhere else). There is suffering in the world, but just imagine how much of it would be alleviated if we listened to what God asks and 'do unto others'? If we all chipped in and gave more of our time, expertise and resources there would be a lot less hardship. 

As far as Heaven and Hell, I believe there is both. But I firmly believe that everyone goes to Heaven (that wishes to, although I can't imagine anyone not wanting to). I believe that Hell is a place where evil dwells but not as a place that people are sent to as a punishment. God is all love and forgiveness and wants us to return to Heaven after this earthly life, which is too short and fleeting to bring about an eternal punishment in Hell. I think the only real 'hell' that anyone would have to endure is the one we make for ourselves in the form of the mistakes and resulting regret of our actions on this earth. When we bring our worldly experiences into the next life, we'll look back and see the bad things we did and carry that with us until we can forgive ourselves. So in that respect, eternal punishment' is from the baggage we bring with us.  

I'm not trying to pinpoint God. What i'm saying is his creation doesn't make sense. If he knows everything, is all loving. He would protect his creation from harm from evil forces not point the blame for having created this problem. I just think the idea of being judged for something he created feels wrong to me

Like i understand the philosophical concept, be good, dont do bad to other people. But i don't understand the afterlife idea. Like i understand why human need judges, we know we are evil and so we need a court system for that or advisers etc. But for a god who was responsible for it doesn't really add up to me.

Edited by SunshineFlow

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I guess I do, but the existence of the latter makes me wish it all wasn't real sometimes :sunny: .

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Yes,in fact I do

as a Christian-Catholic,I totally believe in Heaven&Hell XD

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Well, I'm atheist, so the existence of both is absurd to me. Heaven sounds like a Utopia too good to be true, and Hell just sounds horrible. Eternal torment in a sea of fire? No thanks.

The only thing after death if you ask me is an endless void of nothing.

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Actually the concept of Hell and Heaven would only make sense if you believe in the concept of Divine Justice or Divine Judgement against people who chose to be Wicked and Evil all their Life causing mayhem and chaos. Since I cater to the Shia-Islamic interpretation of these two concepts here's how I think.

 

The God of Abraham has designed us for seeking knowledge since we start out being ignorant about everything we do at Life, but He also gave us the Free Will to obey Him and seek knowledge or disobey Him just as much as his other creation Satan displayed when rebelling against His Authority on creating Prophet Adam (AS) and commanding His other creation deemed supernatural by many The Angels  to prostrate to Adam.

 

Life is Temporary for those who believe on The God of Abraham for a reason. To remind themselves that Life will never be like the utopia that is Heaven if Wickedness co-exists with Righteousness or Death co-exists to cause everything around us to live in a temporary state of existence. So live Life to serve and please the Lord to limit your chances of facing Divine Punishment for your mistakes and crimes against Him and this world He created along with the Universe.

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1 hour ago, ZethaPonderer said:

Actually the concept of Hell and Heaven would only make sense if you believe in the concept of Divine Justice or Divine Judgement against people who chose to be Wicked and Evil all their Life causing mayhem and chaos. Since I cater to the Shia-Islamic interpretation of these two concepts here's how I think.

 

The God of Abraham has designed us for seeking knowledge since we start out being ignorant about everything we do at Life, but He also gave us the Free Will to obey Him and seek knowledge or disobey Him just as much as his other creation Satan displayed when rebelling against His Authority on creating Prophet Adam (AS) and commanding His other creation deemed supernatural by many The Angels  to prostrate to Adam.

 

Life is Temporary for those who believe on The God of Abraham for a reason. To remind themselves that Life will never be like the utopia that is Heaven if Wickedness co-exists with Righteousness or Death co-exists to cause everything around us to live in a temporary state of existence. So live Life to serve and please the Lord to limit your chances of facing Divine Punishment for your mistakes and crimes against Him and this world He created along with the Universe.

What always bugged me about all the Divine Judgment thing is that we're given a finite time to show our worthiness of an infinite afterlife. Why doesn't the punishment last only as long as the time we're given to screw it up?

 

A human's lifespan is so insignificant compared to the eternity that presumably awaits us.

 

"Curse the god that gave us the power to affect the future but not the lifespan to see it for ourselves." Or something along those lines. We could have killed thousands in the future thanks to our actions but we could go through life thinking we did alright because the effects won't show for many years.

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(edited)
1 hour ago, Discordian said:

What always bugged me about all the Divine Judgment thing is that we're given a finite time to show our worthiness of an infinite afterlife. Why doesn't the punishment last only as long as the time we're given to screw it up?

 

A human's lifespan is so insignificant compared to the eternity that presumably awaits us.

 

"Curse the god that gave us the power to affect the future but not the lifespan to see it for ourselves." Or something along those lines. We could have killed thousands in the future thanks to our actions but we could go through life thinking we did alright because the effects won't show for many years.

That is an interesting question and at least based on my understanding The God of Abraham is defined by 99 names that have been attributed to him (72 attributed names under Judeo-Christian). One of them is Al-Muhyee (The Giver of Life), but the other is Al-Mumeetu (The Inflictor of Death) which may sound pretty contradicting at first glance if He/It can do both things. However, He's also Al-Ghafoor (The Great Forgiver) and At-Tawwaab (The Acceptor of Repentence) in our Temporary state of Life here all for His Divine Plan to judge the rest of Humanity based on their worthiness of being eternally pleasured or being eternally punished as you state Discordian.

 

He grants the Wicked Humans respite to see if they show shame for their actions and do what they can to seek redemption. But, if they don't for the time of their lifespan, then it only makes sense for them to spend an eternity in Hell for their abominable crimes e.g. Murder, Usury, Theft, Hypocrisy, Never being grateful to Him throughout their entire life, Displeasing Him or Trying to be like Him as a symbol of how throughout their entire lifespan they have never learned their lessons (provided they're sane of course). For the mentally insane well at least The God of Abraham should be Al-Ghafoor towards them since they're not right in the head so they'll be tested in other ways based on how I come to understand. :P

 

I really don't want to imagine Hitler or Stalin getting away murdering innocent people throughout their lifespan so it would only make sense to imagine that a Higher Power would take care of their abominable crimes against not only towards Him, but to Humanity as a whole.

 

I do understand how confusing it can be to grasp such a concept like this. But, hey we as Human Beings make the best choices to fulfill Humanity's purpose under The Lord's Will or make the worst choices to damn Humanity to eternal damnation.

Edited by ZethaPonderer

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(edited)
On 8/9/2017 at 11:44 PM, SunshineFlow said:

I'm not trying to pinpoint God. What i'm saying is his creation doesn't make sense. If he knows everything, is all loving. He would protect his creation from harm from evil forces not point the blame for having created this problem. I just think the idea of being judged for something he created feels wrong to me

Like i understand the philosophical concept, be good, dont do bad to other people. But i don't understand the afterlife idea. Like i understand why human need judges, we know we are evil and so we need a court system for that or advisers etc. But for a god who was responsible for it doesn't really add up to me.

Am I mistaken or are you're saying God is responsible for all the bad things and judging us for them? God forgives us for being the ones who create the problems in this world. If we don't forgive ourselves that's another matter. He can protect us from evil, but what does that say about free will? Will all the people who make mistakes be stricken down an denied a chance to redeem their life? Are all people entitled to free will and the opportunity to learn, or just the 'good ones'? And by whose criteria should this assessment of good and evil be made? By giving free will to all, whether we use it for good or bad, we all have an equal chance to learn from our mistakes as well as our victories and hopefully become better beings. It doesn't mean it's an easy way to live, but we have to have faith in the bigger picture, whether we perceive it now or not. If someone considered you or I to be evil, should our free will be taken away? And if it was, what would be the point of living? There'd be no chance for redemption or reparation for our misdeeds. Without free will we'd be nothing more than programmed machines, and that would amount to nothing. God's ways are not always the same as our earthly ways so judging Him based on our narrow worldly perceptions is like putting someone on trial without evidence.  

Life on this earth is not always easy, and there are problems inherent in living together with others, but that's why we're told to do unto others and try to help each other. When we ask ourselves, "Where was God during all this mess and why didn't He help?" my answer is, "He did send help, and you and I are that help. He sent us here and told us how to care for each other. That's the help He sent. So rather than questioning God, we should question ourselves as to what we've done to ease the suffering of others.

Edited by Dreambiscuit

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I believe that once you die your soul will be in the state that it was in before you passed. If you were good then you will be good. And if you're bad then you will be bad. I don't know if you stay on Earth or leave to go anywhere though. Some spirits stay while some go I suppose. 

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